J-Rod

Ok,

I installed a Meziere WP this week, and wanted to see if they had helped out. Along with that, I had a few intakes I wanted to test on the car.

I managed to get my hands on a couple of manifolds, actually. Yes LGM has FAST intakes, and yes, I got a 90MM for testing. So you may be asking yourself, well how did get a TB for one. The simple answer is I used the TPIS oval TB on the FAST intake. It isn't a true 90MM, its oval (76MMx90MM), but its bigger than stock, and Lou had already seen a gain on it in his car.

Anyhow, Jayson @ MTI was nice enough to rent me the dyno for the better part of the day. (Major Props to MTI)...

Anyhow, the dyno consisted of 3 baseline pulls with a stock LS6 intake with a polished TB. After the baselines, the intake was swapped for the TPIS modified LS6. Two pulls were made with the TPIS intake. Finally, the FAST intake was installed, and two more dyno runs were made.

The results were quite shocking, so here they are. I will be posting two sets of numbers. The Dynojet software @ MTI is the DOs version. I am suing the newsest version of the the runjet viewer, and for some reason it makes all my dyno runs about 1HP higher. So, I will post the MTI numbers and the runviewer numbers.

MTI Numbers
The baseline pull for the car with the stock intake was
471.9 HP / 423.5 Tq - which is about a 8 HP gain from the WP.
TPIS modified intake
478.9 HP / 428.3 Tq
FAST w TPIS TB
476.7 HP / 415.3 Tq

Runjet viewer numbers
The baseline pull for the car with the stock intake was
472.87/421.05
TPIS modified intake
480.17/426.40
FAST w TPIS TB
477.44/415.49

Here are the graphs:
All 3


TPIS vs FAST


I was somewhat suprised to see that the FAST lost so much torque across the entire spectrum. On the graph it is down all the way across. I figured with all the work Wilson had done on the manifold that this thing would be right on. All I can say is GM did their homework, and yet again it appears that its hard to improve on their work. The Big TB on the TPIS however did seem to help. At around 4300 it separates itself from the stock TB and pulls away all the way to peak. Let this be an object lesson that bigger may not always be better. Remeber that velocity vs flow folks kepp talking about? Well, this is a pretty good example. The FAST has bigger runners, and should have more flow, but it appears that velocity may be hurt, and thus torque suffers. Its not to say that there is not some incremetal improvement between the FAST and a stock LS6, there is. Its just not what I would have hoped to see. It will be interesting to see what happens when some of the flow wizards get some time in with them and what it results in. I can't comment on what other shops result have been, or why they differ from mine. All I can do is provide you with my data, and let you come to your own conclusions.

I know I gave props to MTI earlier but I would like to point out that MTI went out of there way to help me with this test. Jayson came over personally numerous times while I was there to see if he could help me out. He made sure if I needed anything that he got it right away. He and his staff were helpful in every way shape and form. I just wanted to say thanks again, and point out what a class act the guys over there are.





[Modified by J-Rod, 11:17 PM 1/23/2004]

kh24

Very interesting results. Looks like I may just buy the waterpump for now until I see further testing on all the other intake options.

Dave00C5

Very Good Info!! :cheers: :cheers: :chevy :thumbs:

Godspeed

Thanks for sharing your testing results, I'm glad I didn't jump the gun early on the FAST.

Chris@East Coast Supercharging

Thanks for sharing the results with us. We appreciate your efforts in research :cheers: :cheers: :cheers:

NEPTUNEBILL

Thanks J--I was intertaining the thought of ordering the TPIS to mount on a FAST--I will nix that, interesting you got about 7rwhp the same as the Carteks guys did--650 for the TB and another 500 to have them alter the zo6 intake, thats 1150 for 7rw, would like the extra hp but its no bargain, the EWP seems like a good deal with 8rw for about 500, together for 1650 and a re-tune looks like at least 15rw--we will have to see who does what with the FAST, but sounds like the TPIP is not big enough to keep the manifold fed. very good test and great info and thanks alot for sharing, you helped me with a decision I have been struggling with--I think I am obligated for a FAST 90 that is on the way but I will wait for a better TB for it--I have also been struggling with the waterpump issue so I couldn't have hired someone to answer my question better than this--I see no sig so I am not sure what size motor you ran this on (a very strong one whatever it is)--thanks Bill


[Modified by NEPTUNEBILL, 9:17 AM 1/24/2004]

J-Rod

Howdy Bill,

Its the same 346 H/C car we've been testing with the LG H/C package. I'm not sure if tuning will make any HP difference, as I don't think the car is going rich or lean up top.

NEPTUNEBILL

One other thing since the TPIS is about 30% smaller than a full 90mm TB do you think more TB would increase Vel as well as flow and bring these numbers up--in the one post they used the smaller FAST and a polished 78mm TB and had great numbers--is the smaller neck FAST getting better Vel because it has the proper TB for its neck size--and if so it would seem a bigger TB on the larger neck would have the same affect and more power--

kumar75150

Thanks for taking the time to do this Jrod. You prolly saved me some money. :)

Avanti

:lol: More aftermarket "magic."

By the way, "error of the measure" is always presant to some degree and is certainly more than 1 hp, hence a few hp one way or the other are essentially meaningless. No dyno I've ever used is that "perfectly" accurate. Simply the nature of of the beast.

Thanks for the info and all the best.

"Salt Flat racers stay on it loooonger!" :yesnod:

J-Rod

In talking with Jayson @ MTI, my results were in linw with wha he saw during a test of a 427 and the FAST manifold.

Our testing was done on a full G5X3 package from LG motorsports. This is a head and cam only car with the stock shortblock.

Bone_Stock

I'm glad I hung on to my money now. I wonder if the reults will be different when the 90mm fast TB comes out?

NEPTUNEBILL

From what we are told, GM has put a 90mm on the c6 which is only a 6 liter so apparently even they think we are restricted on the intake side even on the stock size motor, so the strokers are obviously suffering badly--only a computer program could make these cars even idle much less run hard--I will hang onto my fast until I see someone make a proper TB that will make it perform--at least at this point, thanks to J and Cartek, I will not spend 1150 to have TPIS alter a manifold for their setup and will not entertain the idea that the TPIS oval will supply enough to feed the new intakes--Patrick where are you, we need the 105mm and the 145mm you are working on--I am not even sure the 90mm being built by FAST will be enough velosity for the bigger motors to keep some pressure in the intake manifold, we may all have to go to some sort of FI just to feed these motors and I really would like to stay NA.

LittleBoyBlu99

Thanks for posting J-Rod! :skep: :skep: :cheers: :nopity

ClarksZ06

Looks like fast is really letting everyone down on this one! What a waist of hipe all this time waiting for it to come out and having all the delays.

MTWallet

Great job J-Rod. Thanks to MTI for the use of their dyno. I am sure this info will be making its rounds all over the web very soon. It was great to see this kind of test done by an end user not a re-seller. This goes to show that our motors ARE NOT starved for air and installing a LS6 intake with a ported TB is good enough for 95% of us. The other 5% will bolt on the latest and greatest whether it adds HP or not. :cheers:

vstella

Excellent info J-Rod..Really a breath of fresh compared to all the hype on the FAST. It just goes to show you..you can't believe everything you read.. :rolleyes: As always this forum will find the truth and the members will make the RIGHT decisions based on real world testing just as you have shared with us..Thanks again:D

BTW..I am very impressed with the Meziere WP..It may just be a nice compliment to my next cam install.. :yesnod:

Flyin'Brian

I'm quite sure mine IS starved for air. So, If you are counting us big stroker guys as the other 5%..I will tell you I will not just buy something without knowing for sure there are gains to be had. Some porting to match stg III heads and a larger TB may help us big cube motors....we will see

Scubanme

J,

Thanks for taking the time out and going through all the expense and work to find out what "works" and what is truth and fiction. Most of all, thanks for sharing your findings with us. Some of us here on the forum may not have the time, mechanical skills, facilities or resources to be able to perform this type of testing. It's contributions from people like you that helps us to be better informed before we spend our hard earned dollars on MOD parts.
I thin I could safely say that all of us here on the forum thank and appreciate
your input!

Sincerely Thanks,

:flag :thumbs:

66ImpalaLT1

Have you considered removing the top half of the FAST and checking out how well the ports match the heads?

If they're considerably bigger, it might be hurting torque through reversion.

Thanks for the unbiased results.


[Modified by 66ImpalaLT1, 12:36 PM 1/24/2004]