I'm thinking of ditching the FAST because although it idles pretty well and it certainly gives a bit more power, it could be tuned more conservatively and I could add a bit of juice to go over the top with an LS6. The car still tries to stall out while slowing down if you don't downshift each gear and it wont coast even 20 ft in neutral without trying to die. The idle is fine once its settles in, and it never goes flying up the revs like it did when untuned, but I feel the car could still be more streetable. After doing a burnout at the track, for example, you have to manage the revs or it will die. Playing throttle master can be a tad annoying, and I've been in LS6 intake strokers done by Agostino that idle beautifully.

Is adding a 100-150 shot to the 422ci a bad idea? I love the idea of having 138-140mph traps on tap(car already trapped 126 in 90+ heat shorting it), but I don't wanna risk destroing my $$$ longblock. Wet or Dry? How big? How much? What's an acceptable CR to run a shot of that size on?

 

Where are you located? Do you want to swap to LS6 intake to see if it idles better?

 

the poor idle is not from the F.A.S.T intake manifold. If you have the TPIS 90 mm TB, I know what you mean by the feathering needed to maintain a stable idle. Real PIA trying to maneuver in gridlock, stop and go traffic. The problem is just the opposite when the AC is turned on as then it will "cruise"and not drop off RPMs as you are trying to shift gears. There definately is a signiificant power gain,how much I don't know.

I am personally looking to go the Maggie route and tandem that with a small nitrous shot and not look back.

 

I'm with both of you guys the 90mm really gives a lot of power to the stroker I got about 35rwhp out of it but its like the hot rods I had when I was a kid when you have to drive heel and toe to keep the gd thing from dying, and after driving awhile it seems to get worse at diff temps, I am going to put on one of Nicks that we have been experimenting with that will idle very well, I sent one I had to MTI and they put it on Jayson's car, he drilled a hole in the plate and tuned it in and apparently loves it, he was having the same crap with the TPIS--I really do not enjoy my car like I use too, I have spent a fortune tuning a good car into a pos that may run like a scalded ape, but somewhat loud and the throttle control thing is driving me nuts, I am hoping if this doesn't work that maybe I can mount the GM 90mm on this fast and see how it works. In the meantime my patience has worn rather thin

 

Oh trust me I know it will idle better. I'm sure the FAST is a nice piece of hardware, the problem lies in the TB. And it's not even that mine is nearly as wacky as some peoples. I just know from driving other cars done by my tuner that they can throw back on the LS6 and have it perfect in no time with NO issues.

Then with the $$ from selling the FAST and 90mm TB I can buy a decent n20 kit to moer than make up for the lost power I desired for the track with the LSX.

Neptunebill-did you ever think about spraying your 436? What kind of CR does that motor run?

 

O.k. guys, I have similar symtoms with my 430 motor with the TPIS and the FAST. Idles well, exept with the A/C on, driving me nuts. I always use the A/C. Also, misses slightly between 4,000-7,000 at WOT, but will rev there under normal throttle. Cures? Anyone?

NeptuneBill, I am with you, on patience wearing thin and blowing money down a bottomless pit.

If I recollect, yours was missing from 4,000-7,000 as well. How did you fix yours? Dave, at Cartek, think it could be the wires 50/50 chance. Went from Nology to MSD now moving back to stock wires.

Really miss stomping on the car and ease of driving in traffic.

 

I don't want to totally knock the Fast/TPIS setup. It actually runs quite well and is noticeably more powerful than the LS6 intake, OEM TB combo. It's just the annoyance issues of the cruise affect with the AC on and the stumbling idle in heavy traffic that are troublesome. I am sure that at some point one of the tuners will fix the gremlins. It will be very interesting to see how GM worked the C6 90 mm TB as you know that puppy has to idle dead on perfect

 

I drove GNX Guy's car which has the same setup, and tuned by Jayson, and it had none of those issues. I think rwj383 has cured some of those issues too with tuning.

I'd advise perhaps looking at some further tuning, or look at holding onto the manifold till the issues can be sorted out. Also, the GM TB is avaliable now, and the wiring adapter should be ready in the not so distant future. I would suspect the GM TB may help things...

 

I definitely think that there are tuners out there getting it done, but I'd say the vast majority haven't got it 100%. I also think the problem lies almost entirely with the TB.

I thought about holding it until it was sorted, but I'll be selling the car next year for sure and can use the $$ from the FAST to just slap on a small shot.

 

There is no issue with the Nick Williams TB. If your car is running right with your stock intake and TB you will find Nick's TB needs little or no tuning. My car is an A4 and has all the running characteristics of stock.Do a search on Nick Williams and read the comments. I suspect the problems adressed here are with the TPIS unit.

 

I agree to some extent. RWJ383 definitely has the tuning sorted out, at least with Nick's TB. Of course, the more radical the cam the more tweaking is necessry: in my case he had to tweak a number of idle related tables.

I'd guess not every setup is fixable (too many variables) but probably most are. The issue is that not all tuners know how to do this, or are willing to take the time to get things right. Fine tuning often takes several attempts which they may not be willing to do. As far as I'm concerned, that's actually the key to getting good results from these packages. If I were to do this again I wouldn't even start until I had a commitment from my builder to take whatever time was necessary to get the car's tuning correct before releasing it to me.

 

RWJ 383 definitive takes his time for his customers.
That´s why he is such a great tuner with so good results out of his installed packages.

When he sent me a program to get my 408 iron block idling (yes, he had to send it as I live in Austria and he had no time to come over here), he needed only ONE program to get the engine running and idling perfect.........the car now (one year later) still runs strong on exactly that setup!

When I get my new drag race Vette from Shirl Dickey, I´m sure Robert will finetune it, even if I have to pay him flying over there to do it.

And with him tuning it I don´t fear a BIIIG cam and whatever TB and intake.



Michael

 

" Of course, the more radical the cam the more tweaking is necessry"

Speed dog, that's my point. If your car is tuned and running right and then install Nick's TB and the Fast intake, it will continue to run right.
We have seen it too many times. From totally stock engines to big cube engines this has been true. The problem occurs when a cam is installed at the same time and the cam tuning is not done right. Cam tuning has been an issue for some before the Fast came about.

 

Gojo- are you saying that if you tune a car with the LS6 and factory TB to run perfect, then keep the tune and swap in the LSx and Nicks TB it will stay the same?

 

The tuner at LAPD has a 427 w/90mm FAST TB/intake....I rode in it....it idles like stock has excellent drivability and makes over 550rwhp......all your issues are tuning related....call LAPD and talk with Al....818-998-3966, x104.

 

It will need little or no tune.

 

Let me know if you want to sell the intake &/or TB.

 

DBK--there is no drag strip within a reasonable distance for running the ets and a shot on the street would be nuts I cant get any traction in the first 3 gears as it is, the CR is apprx 11.2-- I know this is a tuning issue but one of our members put the ls2 setup on his motor and had no tuning issue's I don't know what power gains he had--I am waiting on Nicks lastest TB now and apparently for the stroker it works better with the hole drilled in the blade, helps with the idle and the surging that seems to come with the adding the 90mm to the bigger ci motors--mine idle's about like dbk is talking about, its the unpredictable dieing, and I have to let mine warm up a little in neutral and let it learn to idle everytime I start the car, I had no miss in the 4K to 7K the power program is probably as good as it gets, the car will scare the s^%$ out you the torque comes on early like my blower motor and it will get away from quick, so going fast is not the problem as usual, its going slow thats a bitch, I am waiting on Nicks we had a program pretty much worked out for it so I will take it somewhere and tune it in, Jason just tuned one in on his 427 at MTI but I think its a 1000 miles, ---

How about this I cure the idle problem and the oil use problem, I shorten the stroke to a 4" (leaving a 422ci) longer skirts better ring placement should pretty much stop the oil and make a better 7Krpm motor, I put on an ls6 setup and put 10lbs or so of TT and ram the air down its fkg throat and give up on NA--

 

NEPTUNEBILL -- I know your getting tired with your current setup, but, I wouldn't give up on NA. FI has just as many problems - they are just different problems. I would be very curious to see how your car runs as a 422 with the LS2 intake manifold and TB. My sources tell me that the improvements are respectable and the price will be *very* reasonable.

Cheers,

Mark

 

SpeedDog,

Nick has a revised edition 90mm TB out now. I think it is different from the one Jeremy tuned on your car. This is why some are saying that there are little or no tunning issues. Compared to his earlier TB's i believe he has done something to the plate and bore of the TB to allow better results and easier tunning.