There seems to be a rash of installed heads/cam/header packages posted on the forum by our tuners for <$6k. It seems that this is about $2k less than the pricing last year. Is this generosity or in anticipation of a 500hp (6.4 or 7 liter) LS7 motor coming? I got this from gmpartsdirect.com’s website:

GM PART # 12499750
CATEGORY: Eng Asm-(must provide commercial shipping address)
PACK QTY: 1 CORE CHARGE: $0.00
GM LIST: $7,500.00
OUR PRICE: $5,250.00
DESCRIPTION: LS2 CRATE ENGINE (400hp) 6.0 364cu.in.
The is the production LS2 corvette engine complete from intake to oilpan. This will not have a wiring harness nor ecm.

I’ll bet the LS7 will come in under $9k

So the question I have is, should I purchase a package from (LPE, LGM, VetteDoctors etc…) or wait a year for the LS7 to at least verify its price.

Have any of you purchased one of these packages and are you satisfied and have been trouble free.

Thanks

 

Probably be more involved than simply transplating the LS7 into your car, don't you think? The cars are different sizes, different mounting points, different harnesses, different tranny, different ECU with different parameters, and on and on.

What are your goals exactly? That would help to better identify what you should do.

 

Smokey;

As everyone as much hp/tq as possible that is reliable and daily drivable. I would assume an LS2 fits in a C5. I would assume that the LS7 would fit in a C6. A C5R 427 fits in a C5. I am making assumptions but when the 2004 GTO's had an LS1 and then GM puts an LS2 in the 2005's, I would bet the same can be done in a C5 without too much trouble. Isn't it really the same motor bored larger.

I would like 500hp at the crank. The heads/cam packages seem to be at that number but I get very nervous of broken springs (don't understand why that happens but it does), I don't want to replace springs every 10k miles (again don't understand this), I don't want the car to stall at a stoplight, and need to pass emissions.

I would bet that GM has to eliminate my concerns or they would not be able to sell their next Z06 or its motor. The tuners don't have to pass that same test.

 

Everyone wants as much power as they can get and be streetable. You need to be more specific about your purposes. Are you planning on racing this car at all? Is it your daily driver? If you race, is it street, strip, autocross, roadrace, ?? How much of each? What does "streetable" mean to you? (It means something different for everyone). Are you willing to forgo the refined characteristics of the car? Are you willing to have a loud exhaust and loud motor? Those things sound good at first but for some folks it can be too much. A loud exhaust is one thing. A loud valvetrain is another thing entirely that you may not be prepared for.

Another thing: not all valve springs break. Lou Gigliotti at LG has assured me that the Comp Cams dual spring setup I am using will last. And I trust him. If they don't, then I know he'll stand behind the work. And that is the real key is finding a tuner whom you trust. Unless you can do all this work yourself then that is very, very important.

Something else: **** happens. Especially when you mod. Some are lucky, some are not. But the average is that when you mod something will go wrong. It's just part of the game. Maybe it will be minor computer tuning over time. Maybe it will be a weak link issue (eg. the drivetrain) resulting from adding more power. But you need to plan and budget for those possibilities. Eg., when planning the mods listed in my sig I budgeted $5000 and set it aside just in case my tranny decides to fail. If you are prepared then it will not seem like such a big deal if/when it occurs.

But getting back to the original point you really need to do soul searching about what you want from the car. What do you need it to do? What will make you happiest? What are you willing to compromise? What are you willing to sacrifice? How do you want the car to behave? Do you take long trips and require the ultimate in reliability? Is it a daily driver or a weekend warrior? If you don't have these things thought through there you're not ready to make changes yet.

That being said, you can always start out with the usual bolt-ons. Eg., airbox, exhaust, x-pipe, headers,wheels/sticky tires, lowered, sway bars, etc. Typically you will end up doing most of these things anyway. And sometimes it helps to satiate "the bug" if you get some mods done while thinking of the overall package you want to accomplish. Who knows...maybe after getting the usual bolt-ons done you'll be happy with what's left.

One final thought...give some tuners a call. It can often help to hear them go on about what their different packages can do, what the effect will be on the car, the output, the driveability, etc. I highly recommend calling Lou at LG motorsports. He is a busy guy but always makes time for his customers.

Good luck. Feel free to "think aloud" here on the forum about what you want. We're all more than happy to help put it in perspective for you.

 

sounds like you've made up your mind

 

Rob;

Yes to some extent my mind is made up. I would like a 427 from GM assuming it's less than $10k but I hate to wait another year to get that motor if it's available at all. Let's say this, if the C6 Z06 HAS a removable roof and is <=$55k, I'll just purchase it. I have an '02 with 6k miles that is probably worth no more than $35k. So my car plus $20k. Then I'm getting the motor, wheels/tires and suspension of the C6 Z06. I can handle that.

If the car is $60-65k then I can get any tuners 427, CCW wheels/tires, C5 Z06 suspension, Ken King interior. I like the looks of the C5 better than the C6 and prefer to keep it and a $30-35k difference. Follow me?

 

Smokey,

I don't track race the car (lack of time with my job). I drive mostly to and from work (80 miles a day on open stretches). I would like to crack the throttle from time to time and don't want the motor to break. I'm willing to have some valve train noise (lumpy idle is fine). A loud exhaust is better. 1 - 1.5 second increase in 1/4 mile time would be great. I just hate the thought of being on the interstate calling a flatbed and then sending the car 1k miles to a tuner. I understand that things break from time to time I just want to minimize this as much as possible.

 

These are good qustions. I've been planning on a h/c package for my car but If I could get a 427 LS7 then I'm all for it.

 

I was on the fence for this one for months....

On one hand I wanted a monster that had 500 crank HP and would be 1.5-2 seconds quicker than stock...

On the other hand I didnt want to invest ANY money in building the engine and drive train components to handle that added power...

In the end I chickened out and just ordered an LS1 to LS6 conversion kit...

An extra 50 HP in the land of Head and cams is very mild...

So is 405 crank HP...

But it is still a lot better than 350 crank HP..

I just figuered that if I still want to get close to the 450- 500 crank HP mark...

In time Ill just do all the basic bolt ons...

Maybe one day Ill be ready to do those bolt ons and be ready to except the responsibilty of 500 crank HP and things breaking..

Until then Ill be happy with the reliable GM direct 405 HP..

 

As far as the LS7 goes.....From what I undestand since they are pretty much going to be hand built, limited production like the ZR1 motors, I don't think it will be very easy to obtain one. Only time will tell, but a few articals I read on them seemed to imply that if you don't own a Z07 don't bother trying to buy one. Time will tell.

 

Well except for sensor changes, new differently wired TB and MAF, and various small changes, yes, it's the same general engine. However, you could spend a lot of time, money, and computer tweaking, getting the electronics connected and getting it to run right.

Heck, you can probably drop an LS1 in an LT1/4 C4 and get it to run.

 

If you are looking to spend 10k anyway on an 500HP motor, I would also consider a supercharger. My understanding is they are really reliable and very streetable. It won't give you the "lope" of a cam, but it is another option.

Even if the LS7 is 10k, what's it gonna cost to get it in your car?

I went the cam route, there are so many to choose from. You have the stealth type that are hardly noticeable, but that might not be enough to get you to the 500 mark. My setup has around 440 HP and that's without heads. I'm hoping for more with proper tuning, freeway on-ramps are a blast now!!

Just keep doing your homework and don't be afraid to ask. Better to know what you are looking at than to go in blind! Good Luck!!

 

I agree; don't expect to see the LS7 offered in crate form for a long time, IF so it surely will be spendy. As for the LS2; the knock sensors are completely different and are not compatible (no fix in sight yet) with the LS1/LS6 PCM. You have to turn the knock sensors completely off which for a daily driven street car is not acceptable.

 

Talk to Andy at A&A the ls2 into c5 transplant is being worked out as we type, the knock sensors are ls1 move to the exterior and the cam sensor is the ls2 (I think) and the throtle body is ls2. The ls2 heads are the same as ls6 and all mounting points are the same.

More Than Zero

 

And if you think the Z06 motor making 500HP and especially if its a 427 c.i.d, is only going to be $10K the first year that it is out, i think that you will be very disappointed and that i will cost considerably more than that to buy GMs hand built racecar Z06 masterpiece, not to mention the labor to get it in your C5 and hooked up properly with all sensors, electronics and tuning, etc.

I suggest you start saving up with an eye on buying the C6 Z06 after it been out for one year and you can pick up a used on for $10K less than what i believe is going to be at least a $65K sticker pricer!! In the meantime do the basic aggressive bolt ons to our C5 and JUST ENJOY It b/c i speak from experience when i tell that doing heavy big Horsepower mods leads to MAJOR HEADACHES< ENDLESS $ and an oversall sense of unreliability.

The fact that GM has not been able to step up to the plate so far and make a factory vette that puts out 500HP (LIKE THE VIPER) is the reason guys like me do the mods to make the power and if i knew what i knew now, i would have a beatiful z06 in my garage and and a 500HP VIPER< both with aggressive bolt on mods but WITHOUT TOUCHING THE internals of the MOTOR, & having full factory warranties on each etc.

 

What I decided to do with mine, was bolt ons, plus an LG G5X2 cam.

My car put down 400 at the wheels with no head work.

I plan on doing a 4.10 gear next (probably should have done that first!)

The springs are not a huge issue, if you have the right tool changing them if you actually had to is not a big deal.

I am also waiting to see what the new Z06 brings, and what parts will be transplantable. In the future I could see doing a LS2 block w/ a forged stroker kit.

Lou at LG should know what cams could pass emmisions, from what he posted recently a good tune will allow them to pass.

If you have a good tune you won't have stalling and hesitation issues, I drove mine for almost a month before my tune and it only stalled once even w/o the tune!

 

The way MSCU5 went is a great way to go if you want to open your motor just a tad and extract every last bit of POWER out of your LS1, as these motors REALLY RESPOND and WAKE up to the properly selected cam. Just make sure you spare no expense a pay extra for the best springs that $ can buy and that seems to be the dual 921s from what i have seen!!!

 

From what we have heard in the Detroit area about the new "Z" is that it will be the 427 cu". However, the prices we have heard are way North of $65K - more like $75K and possilbly a tad more. Z owners around here want to upgrade to the new one but realize that it will require a sizable investment. Most of the cost, obviously, is being generated by the new hand built motor. They will probably list it at 500hp and that is going to leave a lot of aftermarket "refinement" potential. I am sure you will see crank hp at 700 with some tinkering. A dude that does mods on this mill will eat us all alive!! Start developing the muscles in your left leg!!

 

The old addage, "he who hesitates is lost" could not be more appropriate. Why wait and aggonize on what could be, when you can live and enjoy today. Many have said it before, there will always be cars more powerful/quicker than what you have...its all about having deep pockets, and how many times you want to change out what you have.

Go for the H/C mods now, enjoy it and don't worry about the 427's. You'll have so much power as is on the street tires you'll be running 99% of the time that you are going to spend time figuring out how best to get them to hook. Imagine how difficult it will be for those big bad 427's to hook when they are finally available.