JoshVette

Are you still stock though?

briann510

C6 envy? That is one thing I do not have. The car is a not good looking IMHO, and its a copycat Viper look.

'06 Quicksilver Z06

Not every non C6 owner suffers from the affliction of C6 envy. You don't appear to. But make no mistake, there has been a virtual "outbreak", if you can call it that, of C6 envy since the frist ones rolled off the line . Lots of other Vette owners hate the latest addition to the family. And make no bones about it.

But it was the same way for the C5. Hell, we even have a guy still talking about the "big butts" of the C5 and C6. http://forums.corvetteforum.com/show...8&forum_id=101 Some people should just get over it.

briann510

I admit each year a new style Vette came out after 1972 as I was growing up I did not like. When the C5's came out I actually hated the body style then grew to love it, and then got one. I am sure the C6 will eventually be liked in my view someday I am sure, but Chevy really made a mockery of the front end on them.

cerino2000

Of the 4 C5 Z's that I spanked that night, my buddie's Z16 was my favorite. We are equal drivers (be it good or bad) but we went three times and I beat him all three times.

Don't get me wrong, I didn't spank them by much (.1 against my buddies Z16, others were no better than .2 slower) but spanked them all regardless. I did in fact run my best time ever there, and he was real happy about it since it was one of our 3 runs, but the other 2 runs were just ok runs.

2 of the z's were just no competition. They were turning .3 slower at best.

With the weather cooling down, I hope to make my best time ever before December. The worst part about drag racing is how addictive it is. Hunting a C4 to beat the snot out of so I don't have to feel so guilty about beating on my C6.

69and88

First and foremost, I cant believe the type of negative comments and response I have recieved from members of this forum, and you wonder why I dont have tons of posts on here. This is a real shame, people have to resort to name calling and commenting on the level of my involvment in my past posts. I am an engineer of 31 years age, working for Goodyear (actually did the design work on C5 Z06 and all C6 tires, so I believe I have some credibility and driving ability considering my driving expertise need for my job as well as cars/bikes being my hobby). I grew up in my moms 69 vette which I still own today, bought my first vette (88) in 1999, and now my C6 back in July, musuem delivery and all, a dream come true, the Vette with the tires I designed on it. I have been autocrossing, road racing my 1992 Misubishi 3000GT VR-4, thus the reason for no posts on either of my Vettes (which I have never raced) until my C6. I would never dis a Corvette, they have become my life professionally and personally. Working on the tires I have made many contacts with the Vette development team and engineering community and would never disrespect them or their car, as some of you have disrespected me. I would entertain any of you coming to see me and drive my car, guarantee I'm a better drive than any of you who speak negatively of me. I will post my time slips shortly, need to scan them. I have dragged and raced my 3000 for years, albeit that Im new to the C6. I have claimed several 2 and 3 places in the autocrosses I have participated in with my C6 this year (power isnt everything, those who think so dont have a clue). I'm just looking for some help and support for a product that I love and want to perform as intended. My work and personal life has keep me extrememly busy, why should I be ripped for it in the lack of posts on this forum, I cant believe it. I have tried to help those with tire questions as much as I can without divulging too much. This forum I must say, has lost some credibility with me now. I have friends that always mention the attitude of Vette owners, and being one, have always stood up for us, after this spectical, I may start agreeing with them.
lt@#$@% whatever your name is, you have some serious issues, come see me anytime you want and I will have some things to show you!

Drag conditions again:
60 -70 degrees
93 octane, 1/4 tank
1500 miles the first time, 3000 the second
other engineers present while dragging, verifying my launch
2005 coupe, all options but onstart and XM, comp grey wheels, 6 speed, Z51, no mods.
launches side stepping clutch around 2000 rpm with minimal wheel spin
power shifting at readline (hitting rev limiter in some cases).
held traction control for more than 5 seconds to totally disable system (active handling and TC off).
ran a 13.5 @ 106 with my 3000GT the same day, control vehicle, which is the best trap I've had with that car.
elevation around 1000 ft
Vette feels flat through rpm range, but everyday drivability is good. Feels stronger some days, weak other days.

I actually have some connections and will have the car diagnosed soon. I agree that the car feels like its down 100 hp!

I still cant believe these are actual corvette owners who are on this forum.

Time slips to follow.
What else do you guys want to know?

69and88

add:
full burn outs performed
reduced rear tire inflation to 26 psi on some runs with minimal impact ( I know what pressure the tire footprint was optimized for)!!!
drive it like I stole it, thats an understatement.
someone want to go with me next time and see if Im a moron, or granny shifting???

'06 Quicksilver Z06

Impressive credentials..........What experience do you have with drag racing a manual transmission car? You say you have no experience drag racing your Vettes.

I was one of the ones critical of your posts. I have a reasonable amount of experience drag racing automatics. I ran 13.6 in my MN6 Z51 and I had never drag raced a manual transmission car in my life. How does it sound if I all of a sudden blame that bad time on the car? Again, what experience do you have drag racing a manual transmission car?

You you tell us you have been drag racing for 5-6 years and are only able to muster a best of 13.9 after 6 runs with 1500 miles on the car and 13.6 after 3000 miles. http://forums.corvetteforum.com/show...1169367&page=1

Thats part of what many here had been trying to say. That your "newness" to the C6 possibly played a big role in your slow times?
What was it doing in the 1/8? How about at 1000 ft?

Impressive. But winning autocrosses has nothing to do with running a killer time in the quarter mile. How often do you speed shift or power shift when you are running those autocrosses?

Thats like a marathoner claiming prowess in running the 40 yard dash.

People here have tried to help you. I posted a link to tips given by one of the best Z06 drivers in the United States. Others have asked for the specifics of the time slips to get a better feel for what is going on.

Don't take this the wrong way, but I don't think too many here are going to give a rats *** about your friends and their comments re Vette owners, or your agreeing or disagreeing with them. Nor any potential lost credibility with you.

You hit the rev limiter too huh? My inexperience resulted in the same problem. Now when I had my A4 C5 with 3.42 gears and high stall converter, I was running low 12s and never worried about the rev limiter. And didn't you tell us?????

"..... Well, needless to say, I'm quite embarrased and pissed too. I took my Z51 C6 (6 speed) to the track last night, along with my 3000GT VR-4. ANyway, ran mid to low 13s at 105 with the 3000, and expected to beat that with the Vette. Despite a few 2.0 60fts, the quickest I ran was a 13.9 @ 104!!!"

I usually think of mid to low 13s to be 13.5 and under. You say low 13s you're talking 13.4 or better?

Let us know how you come out. Taking it on the road and doing some scanning and logging? Does this mean you are going to have it dynoed also? It would be a good idea to use 93 octane gas if so.

Tough crowd this bunch. .

Forgive me, not doubting you..... but this is sort of an odd question coming from an experienced racer???? What was in it before?

And I am having a tough time following. We are going from 94 to 93 octane and from a "fresh fill" to 1/4 tank. You have to admit, this is tough to follow.

People are going to need accurate information if they are going to help you. There is a question as to how much gas was in the car and what octane.

There is also a question about the elevation of the track.
You have said "Probably under 900 ft , "Dragway 42...Elevation 927 ft." and finally, "elevation around 1000 ft"

According to this Dragway 42 sits at a physical elevation of 700ft. http://www.racefan.com/showtrack.asp?id=862

Please be sure to include a few of the ones where you were running the 13.9s and worse from the first trip to the track. Hopefully you get it diagnosed and sorted out.

o0 zeno 0o

Don't blame the car because you don't know what your doing. You need to accept the fact that you are the problem and practice until you get the car in the 12's

69and88

My 3000GT is a 5 speed manual, its the only way they come, and thats what I drag. Believe me, launching an all wheel drive, 3900 pound turbo car takes more skill than the Vette. Every car I have ever owned has been a manual, 69 is a 4 speed, 88 is a Doug Nash, only the Isuzu ia an auto.
94 octane Sunoco my first time to the track, fresh fill meaning fillingup right before going to the track, 1/4 tank.
93 octance Amoco my second time out, 1/4 tank again.
If I was such a bad driver and not used to my C6, explain my low trap speeds please!

Tommy D

It is apparent from the MPH you posted that your car should have posted a low to mid 13 second run. This not being the case, running 106 MPH and a 13.90 I would expect that you experienced quite a bit of wheel spin, short shifted, or experienced some other traction related problem. On the other hand track conditions can also play a large part in elapsed times. Since you made the runs on a relatively cool day I am at a loss to give you any other suggestions as to what may have happened when you ran.

I would run the car on a dyno to get a baseline run, just to see what it is making at the wheels. If that number is within what most of us have been running (approximately 330 - 350Hp) then you know it was track/driver related and not the car. Good luck

'06 Quicksilver Z06

Welcome back

I agree with everything that TommyD said but would add a few things.

With regard to the 3000GT, I would think that an all wheel drive vehicle would tend to yield much better 60ft times than our Vettes.

Both the C5 and the C6 are obviously RWD, had rear mounted transmisisions with the differential mounted directly to it, and a sophisticated independant rear suspension system and launching them takes a bit of practice. I learned this was true even when I had my automatic C5.


Both the MN6 C5 and the MN6 C6 are probably a lot less forgiving on the launch than an all wheel drive import would be. I have always heard that an all wheel drive car gives a better 60 than a rear wheel drive car. And it makes sense that it would.

With all due respect, and this is not a rip, running mid 13s at 105 MPH in an all wheel drive import probably does not require the skills .....nor help a great deal in developing the skills.....necessary to get good 1/4 mile times from an MN6 C5 or MN6 C6 Vette.

You say you were running 13.9s the first time and 13.6s the second time. You mention 2.0 60ft times........ I am willing to bet that if you go back and look at your time slips from both times at the track,..... that you are going to see a few 2.3s and 2.4s in there for 60ft times if you were running 13.9s and 13.6s.

I could be wrong, but I doubt that the worst 60s you ran were 2.0secs.

http://forums.corvetteforum.com/show...m_id=90&arch=1

The post #2 by Mr Mojo contains a great video of power shifting. Not everyone can drive that good, but that is what it will require to get the absolute best times out of the car. If you listen, it sounds like an automatic. Thats a fine example of driving a manual on a drag strip.
If you are driving like that, I doubt you are going to see 13.6s in a C6.

Usually trap speeds are indicative of horsepower. But as already mentioned a few other factors come into play. In addition to the things already mentioned by TommyD

The first thing I would suspect would be short shifting. The car is not allowed to make maximum power before the next gear is selected.

Second thing I would suspect is slower shifting. In other words shift speeds that are nowhere near the shift speeds we see exhibited in Mr Mojo's video. When the shifts are slow, forward momentum slows down between each shift... and trap speeds and ETs suffer.

I'd still like to know what it was doing in the 1/8 mile.

Third thing I would suspect is the car is not making the horsepower it is supposed to make........for whatever reason.

This is why I would have it dynoed. Sooner rather than later if I knew beyond any shadow of a doubt that it was not driver related.

69and88

Yes it does require skill to launch and all-wheel drive turbo car. Turbo cars, especially 4 wheel drive and as heavy as mine, will bog if the clutch isnt slipped perfectly, or the rpms held just right. I can spin all tires just like the rears on the Vette. Yes, 60fts should be better and are with the Mitsu. I know how to shift fast. I run exactly whats advertised with my Mitsu, given the mods and forum results, so its not a matter of me short shifting, etc.

Here are the first runs from the very first time I went. I dont have all of them, but this should give a good indication. I did get better with teh 60fts, as the night went on, I did more extesnive burnouts and lowered the inflation which yeiled the 2.1# 60ft.

C6 is car 434
3000GT is car 435

Have at em.

I need to find the most recent runs from when I went the second time, and will post those soon.

Thanks for all the help. I plan to dyno the car next week hopfully!

69and88

Opps, here they are:


wait, how do I post pics, its a pdf. Though I would just have the option to attach a file like normal email????

69and88

Apparently I am not able to post attachments, can I email somone to post them, or how do I get access or permission to post attachments (I dont get the browse button and it says I MAY NOT POST ATTCHMENTS)????????

jschindler

To post a picture, it has to be "hosted" somewhere - you can't post it from a file on you computer. I trust you - no need to post the time slip. But you might tell us what your various times were (60', 330', 1/8 mph and et. etc). I would be glad to post the corresponding times I had on my c6 last winter. I ran a best of 12.499 @ 114.9 with a 1.94 60' time.

Thanks for bearing with us. I know some of the posts have been a bit harsh.

69and88

Recall Im car 434...........


Welcome to Dragway 42
mickey thompson test
firday aug 19th

#214 8/23/2005 20:55:01

Tuesday Test & tune trials
434 car # 463
+.2949 reaction +.07220
2.1649 60 ft 2.6858
5.9710 330 ft 6.7631
9.1262 1/8 ET 10.4320
78.26 1/8 MPH 68.49
11.7160 1000' ET 13.3581
13.9109 1/4 ET 15.8718
103.22 1/4 MPH 90.58

1st finish 1.7380

timing by TSI system 2000 plus


So, would a 1.9 60 ft make that much difference in trap speed, time yes, trap speed, I dont think so! I mean, this doesnt even look like C6, its not just a little off, its a ways off.........track visit day 2 coming soon........

jschindler

The 60' time is NOT the problem. Sure, it's going to affect your times, but not that much. The 1/8th mile time is really ugly - here are all of my stats on my best run. This is a bone stock C6 six speed Z51 with 900 miles on it, in very good conditions (around 60 degrees and near sea level track).

60' 1.955
1/8 mile - 8.15 @ 89.95
1000' - 10.511
1/4 mile - 12.499 @ 114.88

My best 60' of the night was a 1.943, but the car was really hot that run, and only managed a 12.56@ 112.73. On several other runs that night I was in the 12.5's and 12.6's at over 114 on several runs. BTW, only one of my time slips that night had a 330' time recorded. It was a 5.402. That was the run that I turned a 12.56/112.73

But here is the most interesting one. On my first run of the night, I had it in "competition" mode. At the top of first, it felt like the rev limiter cut in at about 6300 (and I am very good at shifting right at redline), then, on the 1-2 shift it felt like traction control kicked in and shut me down for a nano-second. But here's the kicker - my time was still a 12.97 at 112.7 with a 2.198 60' time. After that run, I turned everything off (TC & AH). You really have to be sure you know how to turn everything off - sounds like you do.

Here is another kicker. I just pulled the time from my very first drag race - ever in my life, at 48 years old (four years ago). This was in a bone stock 2001 coupe (six speed). Again - this time is my first time ever!!!

2.33 60' - 13.65 e.t. - 107.2 mph.

That was also in somewhat hot weather (around 90 degrees)

Sounds like you have a problem child on your hands. Good luck!

jschindler

Okay, me again

After looking at my post above, and your post, it looks like the problem was somewhere between the 60' and the 1/8th mile. That might indicate a "problem" with the 1-2 shift. Any thoughts on that?

bunk22

What about the difference in tracks and weather? I've run at three different tracks, with two being absolutely horrible (very slick) and one being decent but it's hot and at 1500' (not sure if that altitude makes a difference). Some tracks are simply faster than others, if that makes sense.