5.5L 440 HP Next Gen Base Vette Motor Info!
06-30-2010, 11:24 AM
#21
Drifting
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E85 capable is something that would make the C7 far superior in terms of having a long term future than the C5, C6, or any other vette. That's at least if you plan on actually driving the car and filling the tank at actual ordinary gas stations.
Just as so many of the old vette engines were built for leaded premium gasoline and are thus just about impossible to drive on pump gas.....the C5 and C6 are all built for high octane unleaded with no more than 10% alcohol. ( High octane is a relative term. The Z06 recommends 93 octane which was never even available in many parts of the country when the first cars were sold. )
You younger guys think I'm kidding about the older vettes just try filling up ANY original or rebuilt V8 with 10.25 to 11.00 to 1 compression on 93 octane unleaded and see what happens when you mash the gas. ( Unless you've added octane boosters or tweaked the timing though still it's tough to get it "just right". )
Just as so many of the old vette engines were built for leaded premium gasoline and are thus just about impossible to drive on pump gas.....the C5 and C6 are all built for high octane unleaded with no more than 10% alcohol. ( High octane is a relative term. The Z06 recommends 93 octane which was never even available in many parts of the country when the first cars were sold. )
You younger guys think I'm kidding about the older vettes just try filling up ANY original or rebuilt V8 with 10.25 to 11.00 to 1 compression on 93 octane unleaded and see what happens when you mash the gas. ( Unless you've added octane boosters or tweaked the timing though still it's tough to get it "just right". )
06-30-2010, 01:43 PM
#24
Team Owner
TQ is a function of displacement and stroke length. Another way to make up TQ loss is through FI and it looks as if they may not go that route. Way to early to tell what will eventually be used.
06-30-2010, 02:47 PM
#25
Safety Car
HP and TQ numbers are only part of the equation - I want to ALSO know at what RPM those values are obtained. Pretty worthless if they are at or near redline.......a smaller displacement engine will surely have to head up the RPM range compared to a larger displacement engine. THAT will totally change the character of the vehicle. I've owned vehicles with forced induction and direct injection but small displacement - they're a dog off idle...............
06-30-2010, 02:59 PM
#26
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I have problems with this. The older engines (ie before ~1970) needed the lead in gasoline for their valve seats. Todays octane ratings are an average of two different test methods. That change lowered the ratings but there are additives available for octane increases for the really needy few. Ethanol does have a higher octane rating than the gasoline it goes into: but, it has less energy (google fuel BTU content) thus the horrible MPG ratings of flex-fuel vehicles when using E85.
06-30-2010, 03:59 PM
#27
Team Owner
HP and TQ numbers are only part of the equation - I want to ALSO know at what RPM those values are obtained. Pretty worthless if they are at or near redline.......a smaller displacement engine will surely have to head up the RPM range compared to a larger displacement engine. THAT will totally change the character of the vehicle. I've owned vehicles with forced induction and direct injection but small displacement - they're a dog off idle...............
06-30-2010, 05:16 PM
#28
440 is not enough considering the 50,000 dollar mustang gt500 will have at least 550hp, the charger srt will have 480hp at around $45,000 and the camaro z28 will have around 550hp. I know the Vette will be alot lighter then these cars but for around the same price or less these cars should not have allot more horsepower then the next Corvette.
06-30-2010, 05:29 PM
#30
"My new 135i with a 3.0L TT makes 300+ ft lbs @ 1400rpm." That would put in a class with my Duramax. I guess I better move out of the way when I see one coning. Later! Frank
Last edited by fnsblum; 06-30-2010 at 05:57 PM.
06-30-2010, 06:52 PM
#31
Team Owner
440 is not enough considering the 50,000 dollar mustang gt500 will have at least 550hp, the charger srt will have 480hp at around $45,000 and the camaro z28 will have around 550hp. I know the Vette will be alot lighter then these cars but for around the same price or less these cars should not have allot more horsepower then the next Corvette.
Secondly, you are assuming those cars will be immune from the same issues that will effect whatever power the C7 has. For all we know, none of those engines will exist in three or four years either.
06-30-2010, 07:38 PM
#32
Race Director
GM will do the new motor as a 5.4L and advertize it as a 327.
Why not, the Z06 is a 428 advertized as a 427, how would a 328 advertized as a 327 be any different.
I can see the Badge now; 327/465!!
Why not, the Z06 is a 428 advertized as a 427, how would a 328 advertized as a 327 be any different.
I can see the Badge now; 327/465!!
06-30-2010, 07:52 PM
#34
Race Director
E85 is a joke. Do a google search on E85 CAFE ratings and you'll find that it is effectively a government loophole. Chevy Surburbans and such get a CAFE rating of high 20s to near 30 for offering E85, despite the fact that it is almost impossible to actually find it (and nobody would pay the price for it anyway).
As to the 5.5/440 rumors, anything that is printed today is subject to a lot of change over the next three years. But I'm always interested in reading the rumors because they can point the way to what is being worked on.
As to the 5.5/440 rumors, anything that is printed today is subject to a lot of change over the next three years. But I'm always interested in reading the rumors because they can point the way to what is being worked on.
about E85. It causes us to use more gallons and at least outside of the corn belt at a much higher cost. Gas mileage will actually drop.5.5 seems like a great motor, same hp isn't everything. It needs to have the same torque.
The car does look sharp but wonder how much will make it into production. Right now the car is really best guess since any one in GM that leaks the info would be fired and probably sued in a heartbeat.
06-30-2010, 08:01 PM
#35
Race Director
"( High octane is a relative term. The Z06 recommends 93 octane which was never even available in many parts of the country when the first cars were sold. )"
Not true, 93 Octane has always been available on the East Coast and still is - Mobil, Exxon, Sunoco, Fina, Shell and others. Available way before (and after) the Z0 was introduced.
Not true, 93 Octane has always been available on the East Coast and still is - Mobil, Exxon, Sunoco, Fina, Shell and others. Available way before (and after) the Z0 was introduced.
06-30-2010, 08:16 PM
#36
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E85 capable is something that would make the C7 far superior in terms of having a long term future than the C5, C6, or any other vette. That's at least if you plan on actually driving the car and filling the tank at actual ordinary gas stations.
Just as so many of the old vette engines were built for leaded premium gasoline and are thus just about impossible to drive on pump gas.....the C5 and C6 are all built for high octane unleaded with no more than 10% alcohol. ( High octane is a relative term. The Z06 recommends 93 octane which was never even available in many parts of the country when the first cars were sold. )
You younger guys think I'm kidding about the older vettes just try filling up ANY original or rebuilt V8 with 10.25 to 11.00 to 1 compression on 93 octane unleaded and see what happens when you mash the gas. ( Unless you've added octane boosters or tweaked the timing though still it's tough to get it "just right". )
Just as so many of the old vette engines were built for leaded premium gasoline and are thus just about impossible to drive on pump gas.....the C5 and C6 are all built for high octane unleaded with no more than 10% alcohol. ( High octane is a relative term. The Z06 recommends 93 octane which was never even available in many parts of the country when the first cars were sold. )
You younger guys think I'm kidding about the older vettes just try filling up ANY original or rebuilt V8 with 10.25 to 11.00 to 1 compression on 93 octane unleaded and see what happens when you mash the gas. ( Unless you've added octane boosters or tweaked the timing though still it's tough to get it "just right". )
You really think E85 will be the fuel of the future? Come on over to PRC and defend that.....
06-30-2010, 08:25 PM
#37
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Didn't see this posted yet, pretty good info about the next gen motor on Autoblog apparently taken from next month's Motor Trend.
http://www.autoblog.com/2010/06/29/r...-5-5-liter-v8/
http://www.autoblog.com/2010/06/29/r...-5-5-liter-v8/
I think the LS3 stays....
07-02-2010, 06:24 PM
#38
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First of all, you seem to be forgetting that those are not the base engines in those cars. You are comparing a base Corvette engine to the top engine in those cars.
Secondly, you are assuming those cars will be immune from the same issues that will effect whatever power the C7 has. For all we know, none of those engines will exist in three or four years either.
Secondly, you are assuming those cars will be immune from the same issues that will effect whatever power the C7 has. For all we know, none of those engines will exist in three or four years either.
1. $25,000 mustang 300hp vs base $50,000 corvette 430 MUSTANG WINS
2. $28,000 mustang 5.0 V8 420 hp vs 85,000 Z06 MUSTANG WINS
3. $48,000 mustang GT550 550hp vs $120,000 ZR1 Corvette 630hp MUSTANG CLEARLY WINS
07-02-2010, 06:41 PM
#40
Team Owner
Great point Lakemary!!! Jschindler you are way too much in love with GM and Corvettes to be objective. Lakemary and his comments about Mustang vs. Corvette horsepower value clearly Mustang wins
1. $25,000 mustang 300hp vs base $50,000 corvette 430 MUSTANG WINS
2. $28,000 mustang 5.0 V8 420 hp vs 85,000 Z06 MUSTANG WINS
3. $48,000 mustang GT550 550hp vs $120,000 ZR1 Corvette 630hp MUSTANG CLEARLY WINS
1. $25,000 mustang 300hp vs base $50,000 corvette 430 MUSTANG WINS
2. $28,000 mustang 5.0 V8 420 hp vs 85,000 Z06 MUSTANG WINS
3. $48,000 mustang GT550 550hp vs $120,000 ZR1 Corvette 630hp MUSTANG CLEARLY WINS
Up until 16 years ago you couldn't give me a Corvette. I've owned many Fords as well (including an SHO Taurus and a Thunderbird SC). I've owned three pickup trucks - both Ford and Chevy's. I've owned four full size SUV's - both Ford and Chevy.
If you want to take issue with my statements, then tell me what I'm saying that's wrong - but don't accuse me of having blinders on.
I'm not sure what you mean in your comparisons. What criteria are you using to call the Mustang the winner?
Last edited by jschindler; 07-02-2010 at 06:46 PM.