Blue Devil- Judgment Day
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Le Mans Master
Joined: Dec 2001
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From: Kansas
Blue Devil- Judgment Day
By now everyone has heard rumors of a Super-Vette, the Blue Devil, with a carbon fiber body, TT , and about 625hp. If we assume that this project would appear for production in MY2007, when would GM have to make a final Go-No Go decision? Can this be a winner if priced about $100k?
Phil
Phil
Team Owner
Joined: Apr 2002
Posts: 43,370
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Re: Blue Devil- Judgment Day (Zivnuska)
I think they would sell, although it would be an image car that could hurt GM's CAFE. That's exactly what the Viper is. If it's going to be a seperate model from the actual C6, but sharing the same name and platform, then it will have to go through the entire lengthy GM approval process (See All Corvettes are Red). If it's a different body style of the C6, but still a C6, then I'm not sure what the process is on that.
In other words, for all we know it could only be sharing the Corvette name, and be completely different. A completely different car, the first true exotic supercar from Chevrolet to be produced.
But one thing is for sure, if they call it the "Blue Devil," that would be a shame. Stupid name.
In other words, for all we know it could only be sharing the Corvette name, and be completely different. A completely different car, the first true exotic supercar from Chevrolet to be produced.
But one thing is for sure, if they call it the "Blue Devil," that would be a shame. Stupid name.
Drifting
Joined: Mar 2003
Posts: 1,569
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From: Carolina
Re: Blue Devil- Judgment Day (Zivnuska)
At 100k it would definetly be a winner just look at the prices of other competitors:
1. Porsche Carrera GT 605hp price 440k
2. Mercedes Benz SLR 617hp price 350 to 400k
3. Ferrari Enzo 660hp price 650k
100k for this car is a gift.......
1. Porsche Carrera GT 605hp price 440k
2. Mercedes Benz SLR 617hp price 350 to 400k
3. Ferrari Enzo 660hp price 650k
100k for this car is a gift.......
Burning Brakes
Joined: Feb 2000
Posts: 1,195
Likes: 1
From: East Bay CA
Re: Blue Devil- Judgment Day (Zivnuska)
At the beginning of MY2004, the Z06 was an 18% premium over the base coupe.
In 1995, the ZR-1 was an 85% premium over the base coupe. The ZR-1 sold
at the approximate rates of 3000, 2000, 500, 500, 500, 500 through its six
year career. From this I'd say that an 85% premium was too high but I bet 50%
would work. So, if you assume that the MY05 comes in between $45K and $46K
and further allow a $1500 bump each year, you might conclude that the cars
will cost
MY05 Base coupe - $45,500
MY06 Base coupe - $47,000
MY06 Z06 - $55,500
MY06 ZR-1 - $70,500
I think it's imporatant to remember that the price drives the content rather than
the content driving the price. From a marketing point of view, I'd say that a price
between $70K and $80K is as high as Chevrolet dare go. Given that, the content
will follow accordingly.
In 1995, the ZR-1 was an 85% premium over the base coupe. The ZR-1 sold
at the approximate rates of 3000, 2000, 500, 500, 500, 500 through its six
year career. From this I'd say that an 85% premium was too high but I bet 50%
would work. So, if you assume that the MY05 comes in between $45K and $46K
and further allow a $1500 bump each year, you might conclude that the cars
will cost
MY05 Base coupe - $45,500
MY06 Base coupe - $47,000
MY06 Z06 - $55,500
MY06 ZR-1 - $70,500
I think it's imporatant to remember that the price drives the content rather than
the content driving the price. From a marketing point of view, I'd say that a price
between $70K and $80K is as high as Chevrolet dare go. Given that, the content
will follow accordingly.
Team Owner
Joined: Jul 2003
Posts: 34,299
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From: [Enter Unoffensive Comment Here]
Cruise-In VI Veteran
Cruise-In VII Veteran
St. Jude Donor '06
Re: Blue Devil- Judgment Day (Runge_Kutta)
It depends what they consider a "super car". EXTREME bang for your buck? Mega ponies & performance to rattle GT's & Enzo's is one thing and one price...a limited, luxury, all carbon fibre, titanium insano is another. If they go that route it would be just to say they could do it. I think they will extend the price into Viper territory and blow everyone away with the perfomance that we almost have already. There are lots of members with "supercar" performance after dropping putting some more coin in. :thumbs: :cheers:
Burning Brakes
Joined: May 2002
Posts: 1,010
Likes: 13
Re: Blue Devil- Judgment Day (Runge_Kutta)
At the beginning of MY2004, the Z06 was an 18% premium over the base coupe.
In 1995, the ZR-1 was an 85% premium over the base coupe. The ZR-1 sold
at the approximate rates of 3000, 2000, 500, 500, 500, 500 through its six
year career. From this I'd say that an 85% premium was too high but I bet 50%
would work. So, if you assume that the MY05 comes in between $45K and $46K
and further allow a $1500 bump each year, you might conclude that the cars
will cost
MY05 Base coupe - $45,500
MY06 Base coupe - $47,000
MY06 Z06 - $55,500
MY06 ZR-1 - $70,500
I think it's imporatant to remember that the price drives the content rather than
the content driving the price. From a marketing point of view, I'd say that a price
between $70K and $80K is as high as Chevrolet dare go. Given that, the content
will follow accordingly.
In 1995, the ZR-1 was an 85% premium over the base coupe. The ZR-1 sold
at the approximate rates of 3000, 2000, 500, 500, 500, 500 through its six
year career. From this I'd say that an 85% premium was too high but I bet 50%
would work. So, if you assume that the MY05 comes in between $45K and $46K
and further allow a $1500 bump each year, you might conclude that the cars
will cost
MY05 Base coupe - $45,500
MY06 Base coupe - $47,000
MY06 Z06 - $55,500
MY06 ZR-1 - $70,500
I think it's imporatant to remember that the price drives the content rather than
the content driving the price. From a marketing point of view, I'd say that a price
between $70K and $80K is as high as Chevrolet dare go. Given that, the content
will follow accordingly.
i can see how they might go for an 100k model just as a super halo.
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Brett Foote
Team Owner
Joined: Mar 2000
Posts: 83,383
Likes: 87
From: Boston, MA
Re: Blue Devil- Judgment Day (Runge_Kutta)
At the beginning of MY2004, the Z06 was an 18% premium over the base coupe. In 1995, the ZR-1 was an 85% premium over the base coupe. The ZR-1 sold at the approximate rates of 3000, 2000, 500, 500, 500, 500 through its six year career. From this I'd say that an 85% premium was too high but I bet 50% would work.
The only reason the ZR1 sold 448 units the last 3 years of production is because GM canned the project. ZR1 was terminated (even though every single one made was sold) and the remaining LT5s were divided up for 3 years + parts replacement. That calculated into 448 for the last 3 years and every one sold.
QUESTION: Why did GM stop building ZR-1's?
ANS: Several reasons, one was because of low volume. But the main reason was future EPA rules meant having to redesign the LT5 engine in the ZR-1. Because sales were so low and the next generation Corvette was just around the corner the costs in redesigning the LT5 couldn't be made up.
The lower volume didn't make it cost-efficient at the time with the C5 and the LS1/LS6 already in development to redo the LT5.
Team Owner
Joined: Feb 2000
Posts: 45,287
Likes: 892
From: Texas
CI 1-4-5-8-9-10 Vet
St. Jude Donor '03 thru '10, '17
Re: Blue Devil- Judgment Day (GDP)
I think they would sell, although it would be an image car that could hurt GM's CAFE.
Racer
Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 374
Likes: 0
From: South Brunswick NJ
Re: Blue Devil- Judgment Day (Zivnuska)
you guys are kidding yourselves if you think that any car can be produced with a carbon fiber body for under 100k
i think the bodywork alone for the saleen s7 is well over 100 grand
i think the bodywork alone for the saleen s7 is well over 100 grand
Team Owner
Joined: Feb 2000
Posts: 45,287
Likes: 892
From: Texas
CI 1-4-5-8-9-10 Vet
St. Jude Donor '03 thru '10, '17
Re: Blue Devil- Judgment Day (Saving Pennies)
you guys are kidding yourselves if you think that any car can be produced with a carbon fiber body for under 100k
i think the bodywork alone for the saleen s7 is well over 100 grand
i think the bodywork alone for the saleen s7 is well over 100 grand
Team Owner
Joined: Mar 2000
Posts: 83,383
Likes: 87
From: Boston, MA
Re: Blue Devil- Judgment Day (DngrZne)
They can't even get the CF hoods to hold paint so I can't see how a full body would work out unless it came in your single color choice of "carbon fiber". :D
Instructor
Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 148
Likes: 0
From: Sioux Falls SD
Re: Blue Devil- Judgment Day (DngrZne)
why? they'd either have to develop their own molding process, which costs tons of R&D money, or license existing molding techniques from 3rd parties and farm out the molding to somebody else too, which would also cost tons.
GM is already hard at work doing carbon fiber experimentation with some success, as evidenced by their carbon fiber hood on the current Z06. But i recall reading about how the process was terribly cost inefficient still, and there are problems with paint application and finish.
I wouldnt expect comparable bodywork to cost any less from GM than it does from Saleen. The deciding factors will ultimately be how many units they are able to sell, to recoup their investment, and how involved the actual bodywork itself is. It's not as complicated as the S7's extremely involved shape, so it shouldnt cost THAT much, but it would still be significant. (the bodywork for the S7 is said to have a cost to saleen of about $100,000 per car!)
GM is already hard at work doing carbon fiber experimentation with some success, as evidenced by their carbon fiber hood on the current Z06. But i recall reading about how the process was terribly cost inefficient still, and there are problems with paint application and finish.
I wouldnt expect comparable bodywork to cost any less from GM than it does from Saleen. The deciding factors will ultimately be how many units they are able to sell, to recoup their investment, and how involved the actual bodywork itself is. It's not as complicated as the S7's extremely involved shape, so it shouldnt cost THAT much, but it would still be significant. (the bodywork for the S7 is said to have a cost to saleen of about $100,000 per car!)
Instructor
Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 138
Likes: 0
From: Seville OH
Re: Blue Devil- Judgment Day (ivan111)
100k for this car is a gift.......
Having a basic 2000 Z-51 coupe 6-speed, I have to believe that the C5 is a great platform for starting to develop a supercar. GM promises the C6 suspension to be 'substantially better' so they have to be pretty close.