I installed the "Predator" on my new Z06 and now I have a PO171 code, "left bank, lean condition". I assume this is not good. Should I pull the program out? I also cut away some of the radiator shroud to get more air into the air filter.

 

Check your LTFT's. I bet they are both way positive. Add fuel via the MAF function till the LTFT's are near zero. Your shroud cutting has fooled the MAF.

 

The Predator makes power by leaning the AFR--does not advance timing. You can adjust the AFR with the tool. Their website is very helpful. I don't think just cutting the shroud should make that much difference as the ECM should be able to easily compensate for it. As 6Speeder says, you can adjust the LTFTs after data logging to see where they are. If you clear the code, it very well may not come back, anyway--as the ECM will have adjusted.

 

Return the Predator - it's useless. Here's a link that's action packed with details on just how useless it is:

http://forums.corvetteforum.com/show....php?t=1716375

 

Have you used a Predator? I assure you, it works. I picked up 15 HP with their tune. Not saying a custom tune isn't better, but for a caned tune that is safe, it works. And it gives you a scanning tool as well.

 

Looks to me like that thread was mostly blaming the predator for the lean condition that a vararam produces by forcing more air into the mix. Glad I didn't buy a vararam, the only things thats should be forcing more air into a motor are turbo's and SC's. I would suspect that a vararam can be tuned to work, but I bet it would be foolish to try it without having a way to monitor the air fuel mixture in real time. Which the predator isn't going to be able to do effectively. You could use it to addjust the mixture, its not good enough as a monitoring aid to do so. Neither are any of the other options either btw, you really need a air/fuel tool if your going to play with the vararam set-up. Now I see why they pick up some hp and torque, they lean out the mixture. not a good thing with a predator, which already leans the mixture, or any tune for that matter.

As for the original posters problem, I would pull the tune for now, maybe drop it to the 91 octane version and try to use the poor monitoring capabilities of the predator to see what your mixture looks like and adjust from there. If they would make the predator better at monitoring, I would buy it in a second. For now, I'll run a little rich until I get one of the other software based programming tools.

 

Obviously its not safe if the original poster was throwing a lean condition code, wouldn't you say?

 

So, next time you PM me begging to help you, even after you have bashed our product all over this forum, you will understand that I will not reply, cool?
A lean code does not mean unsafe, just that the PCM is adding more than 25% fuel to compensate.
Considering the code seems to have gone away, and the car is running fine, I think all is well.

BTW, what do you mean about the 'poor monitoring capabilities' of the Predator?
It displays more info than any handheld out there, and you can actually see more than one parameter at a time.

Thanks
Mike

 

You must have info not posted here, I don't see anything about the code going away here.

I've been told that the predator will not store any information, or at least anything significant. Perhaps my info is wrong, how much running time can I store on the unit to help in tuning the mix on a 2006 C6? Seeing a parameter in real time is not useful, unless I put a video camera on it. I want to record some runs and dump it to my PC.

 

[QUOTE=jsk96z28;1560735836]Well, I assumed after 4 days and no follow up posts that the code has been cleared and all is well? Please let me know if I am incorrect.



The U7194 for C6 does support datalogging and can be exported to a PC to be viewed on our free dataviewer software.
Check out the software, there are some sample logs you can play with already in there....
http://download.diablosport.com/down...203.0.0.16.msi

Thanks
Mike

 

Oh well, gave it a try, locks up when I try to load one of the demo files, thought we had a sale there for a minute.

This is what the log.txt file says

538781 Info: .\DataViewer.cpp, line 115, CDataViewerApp::InitInstance, DataViewer is initializing.
539031 Warning: .\ParamViewBase.cpp, line 75, CParamViewBase::GetParamTreeView, Could not find ParamTreeView.
539031 Warning: .\ParamViewBase.cpp, line 75, CParamViewBase::GetParamTreeView, Could not find ParamTreeView.
539062 Info: .\ParamTreeView.cpp, line 318, CParamTreeView:pdatePIDsFromLogData, Loading parameter tree from log file data.

That's funny, I didn't add that graphic, it comes from the log file, but it fits!!!!

Got it to work on my computer at work, which is significantly lower in performance than mine at home. Go figure.

It looks like you can data log based upon this information. Why does everyone say you can't, like Whiterock says below???

Any ideas why the software wont work for me at home? BTW, I get the same information in the log.txt on the computer at work, yet it loads the log file and doesn't lock up like it does at home.

 

Begging YOU? You have got to be kidding! Your product is a joke as was your so called help. You want me to toy with the PCM of my car through trial and error? "Yeah, alls you gots to do is adjust the injector slope to get the LTFTs to between 0 and -2. Then make a few WOT runs to get an average LTFT reading at WOT, and then adjust for that through the 4-7k rpm WOT fuel parameter..."

GREAT! How do I do that Mike? Hmmm? Your manual certainly doesn't tell me and your inbox was full, so I couldn't ask. Great help! Thanks.

By now, I'm hopeful that enough people have seen the posts about this useless device to think twice about buying it.

Oh, and about the "monitoring capabilities" - can the Predator data log? NO; it can't. Remember what you said about it? "There are no groups of info available in this tool, only the live data that appears once you go into the live data section..." So that translates into me having to make WOT passes while looking at this toy in order to figure what the average LTFTs are during said passes; gee, that's safe. THUS, it's "monitoring capabilities" are as useless as the rest of the product. In fact, I'm willing to bet that within the next few years, if it already hasn't happened, some kid's going to wrap himself and his car around a tree while he's trying to "monitor" the data from the Predator during WOT operations. Then, when Predator finds itself defending a wrongful death claim, we'll see how well your advice and it's "monitoring capabilities" will hold up. Get real.

The Predator is nothing but a toy; a joke. The only reason it sells is because Diablo spends an ***-load of money marketing it to people who simply don't know any better; and I was one of them. I guess $400 is the price one pays for trusting a misleading advertisement.

I priced out some of the REAL tuning programs out there, and they cost just around the same as the Predator and, from the posts here, they seem to actually deliver what they promise.

So, keep up the good work over there at Predator; and GREAT JOB!

 

I am running the Predator and the Vararam and i think they are both good products. neither has given me any codes. I think that the bad experiences expressed here are the FEW and I also bet for every Bad write up you find on this forum in the search mode you can find 5 good ones.

But every car is going to react different to the MODS we do to them some cars will be fine as others will be not so fine that is the world of tuning and modding.

 

You're right, the Vararam did cause a lean condition, but only because of the Predator's tune; and when I called Predator for help, they told me to go to hell. So I uninstalled the Predator's program as advised by Vararam, as well as a bunch of the people on this forum, and the problem WENT AWAY, leaving the Vararam to perform beautifully. Since then, I've been going back and forth about the utility of the Predator with a rep from Diablo who's on this forum.

In either case, most of the posts at the link above should be very helpful regarding the Predator and the Vararam. And despite the Diablo guy's interpretation, I'm not bashing the Predator, I'm calling it as I see it - A USELESS WASTE OF $400!!

Of course, if you have an automatic, the Predator might help with the shift points and other such adjustments in order to get a little more "umph." But short of that, I found it to be a lame addition and I should have returned it within the 30 days while I had the chance; simply put, the tune did little to nothing in terms of performance gains.

But don't take my word for it; run some tests with your cars before you buy it, then compare the numbers to see if it's worth $400.

 

"I'm not bashing the Predator, I'm calling it as I see it - A USELESS WASTE OF $400!!"

If that's not bashing, I'd hate to hear what you think of something you are bashing!!

I bought the Predator and in conjunction with my Bullets, Aircharger and opened shroud, have noticed a definite improvement at wot. Plus, TM is tuned out, CAGS is tuned out and the tool works as a scanner/code deleter. I would prefer it data logged, but I have sense enough to have someone else drive while I observe its readings, or vice versa. And I have found their forum to be very helpful and responsive. To each his own, but I have nothing bad to say about Diablo or the tool. Leaning the AFR in 7000' Colorado Springs makes sense, and the engine seems to like it. I can see where the VR and leaned tune at lower elevations could have been a problem, but you can adjust the fuel trims, albeit not easily. Again, to each his own but I only have good things to say about Diablo--and Mike in particular.

 

Mike,
Noticed looking at the log files that the AFR for the C6 goes pretty low, like 11.89 in third gear. I thought the minimum was about 12.5. Or is this ok because its being read from the O2 sensor data? Also, any tips you can give me to get the software to work on my home computer would be appreciated, this is the only thing at this point stopping me from purchasing.

 

Considering the fact that you could not figure out how to use the Predator, I wish you nothing but the best trying to tune your car with a full tuning suite.

I'd love you to find me anyone that can honestly say that this tool does not work, and you are incorrect in stating this.
It tuned your car, as proven by the fact that your A/F went a bit lean. I guess if it didn't work, we would never have had this problem, lol.
The issue, and only issue, was your unwillingness to even attempt to use the tool for what it was designed for.

Have a nice day
Mike

 

This is an 'inferred' A/F ratio, so I am not sure how accurate it is, as it is derived from the O2s.
I would compare it to a wideband to see if there is a difference, otherwise just use it as a reference.

Thanks
Mike

 

For anyone that wants to see how I have 'not' helped this gentleman, here is the PM he sent me, even after he made a thread about a 'Compatibility issue with the Predator and Vararam', including my response.
This was not the first time that I had attempted in vain to help him with tuning the car with the Predator.

(My response)
Your assumption that the tune will not help part throttle operation is incorrect.
As I have stated in the past, you have an injector slope parameter that allows you global fuel control. Also, the only time the Vararam will be truly affecting the tune, is when you are at WOT, or speeds above 80mph.
The basic info you need to gather from the tuning thread is to monitor your LTFTs at steady cruise and then adjust the injector slope to get the LTFTs to between 0 and -2. Then make a few WOT runs to get an average LTFT reading at WOT, and then adjust for that through the 4-7k rpm WOT fuel parameter. There are no groups of info available in this tool, only the live data that appears once you go into the live data section.
You could also attempt to add about 5% more timing as well, but our testing has shown that stock head/cam cars do not like any more timing than we put into the tunes.
I need to stress that if the Vararam is the only mod to the car and the drivability at low speeds is not good once you install the base performance tune, than there is likely an other issue somewhere.
Good luck with it.

Thanks
Mike

 

Are you using XP or Vista?
I know I have had a few people experience issues with Vista.
Try reinstalling the viewer software, and if still will not work, let me know. I have a good customer that is a real computer guy who would be glad to try to help.

BTW, the guys who cant log, are tuning C5s, the C6 Predators have logging capability.
We are currently looking into offering a hardware upgrade to the older GM tools which will allow them to be internet updateable and support logging. I'll keep everyone informed as I get more info.

Thanks
Mike