Originally Posted by greentank

made it up to great lakes tonight. My previous best was:

R/T .027
60 1.87
330 5.162
1/8 7.822
mph 93.82
1000 10.084
1/4 11.991
mph 118.76

My best 3 times tonight were:

R/T .259
60 1.882
330 5.082
1/8 7.684
mph 95.20
1000 9.911
1/4 11.790
mph 120.12

R/T .162
60 1.899
330 5.100
1/8 7.703
mph 95.12
1000 9.932
1/4 11.812
mph 120.08

R/T .125
60 1.898
330 5.106
1/8 7.708
mph 95.12
1000 9.937
1/4 11.816
mph 120.38

My conclusion: Removal of TM gave me 2 tenths, and possibly more if I had drag radials. I was spinning in my 1-2 and 2-3 shifts alot more than before I removed it. There was virtually no improvement in my 60'....I truly believe that it is my tires, and my inexperience, that is holding the car back in the 60'. Not really convinced it is TM. I'm also convinced that with DRs, I can acheive the magical 11.49....where I would get kicked off anyway.

I was getting alot of comments and people walking up to me asking if I was supercharged, what my mods were, etc...people weren't used to seeing a regular C6 putting up times like that. That part was really fun.

BTW - the weather was very similar...in fact, it was warmer tonight and more humid than on the night I got my previous best.

Originally Posted by Dave O

I'm with greentank. I'm not understanding your comments. He removed TM, so why does he need to learn to drive around it? He is saying that by deleting TM, he is getting more power and more tire spin. With DR's, he may be able to transfer that lost energy to the ground, and get better times. Bottom line, deleting TM seems to be getting more power to the tires with the potential for better times. The problem now lies in how can he keep the tires from spinning to allow him to transfer that power to the ground.

Originally Posted by Evilways

I think what Dennis is saying is that, no matter the tune, TM cannot be completely removed from the programming. TM applies itself during positive traction , not during wheel spin (i.e.the harder you hook, the more torque to the wheels and the higher the percentage of TM applied).During loss of straight line traction, and TC off, there is nothing (nanny wise) to keep your car from accelerating full out.This theory is consistant with both launch and during shifting. The harder the tires hook, from say, the 1-2 shift or the 2-3, the higher the % of TM, even though with tuning it is somewhat relaxed, is still applied. As an example, my first runs in my C6( with 50 less rwhp and torque) is identical to my last runs with the extra hp and tq, with the exception of a much higher MPH ( 117mph to 121mph). Currently the car reads more torque being transfered to the wheels and applies the TM accordingly, even thoug, yes, it has been "tuned" out of the car. Dennis's launch techniques , i.e. driving around TM, has shown great results for him and others who have used it.Some are seeing better times with DRs, of course, but would see even better numbers without TM period, and as of current, that is not possible with the tuning software availible. I know it goes against everything I've ever learned about drag racing, but it is true . Try a bone stock , un tuned car at the track and the TM is so envasive, it almost seems as if the car wants to shut off on a good hooking launch. I hope this both helps educate and further confuses you, as the TM issue has been a pain since day 1 in these cars for me.

Originally Posted by dennis50nj

its just that you cant understand. i dont care what new program, tuning aide, or if chris angel tuned it. are all you guys that BLIND! 1.87 60 fts to1.89 60 fts isn't tuning anything out. i hate to say it so i wont i ran a 1.7 60 ft withe stock runflats 16,000 miles on them with a 3800 rpm converter with tuning over a year and a half ago. thanks to CARTEK tuning so why isnt this new tuning producing better 60 ft times.

Originally Posted by glennhl

I agree with Dennis. It is my understanding that all the Beta version 19 can do is turn off torque management during the shifts. My car sees NEGATIVE 14 degrees of timing for 3 tenths of a second during every shift. Beta 19 can turn this off, but it's my understanding it does nothing for anything else (i.e. TM is still operative in first gear during a launch).

Originally Posted by Ted P

Glenn have you installed this beta version in your car? I know you were thinking about it

Ted

Originally Posted by Dave O

Ok, I will concede that he may still have to drive around TM at launch. But part of his original question was around lose of traction at the shift points. Quote:

"My conclusion: Removal of TM gave me 2 tenths, and possibly more if I had drag radials. I was spinning in my 1-2 and 2-3 shifts a lot more than before I removed it. There was virtually no improvement in my 60'....I truly believe that it is my tires, and my inexperience, that is holding the car back in the 60'. Not really convinced it is TM. I'm also convinced that with DRs, I can achieve the magical 11.49....where I would get kicked off anyway."

So wouldn't drag radials help in the 1-2 and 2-3 shifts? With TM gone here, the only thing he should have to drive around is the launch. Once past the launch, TM is supposedly gone with the new HP tuners Beta version. He may still have bad 60 ft times, but he should be able to make up some time by putting the power to the ground with drag radials in the shifts. Bottom line, with the new HP version, we should only have to worry about TM at launch, if all the speculation is correct.

Originally Posted by Wingrider

Did the C5 have a torque management system?

Originally Posted by greentank

made it up to great lakes tonight. My previous best was:

R/T .027
60 1.87
330 5.162
1/8 7.822
mph 93.82
1000 10.084
1/4 11.991
mph 118.76

My best 3 times tonight were:

R/T .259
60 1.882
330 5.082
1/8 7.684
mph 95.20
1000 9.911
1/4 11.790
mph 120.12

R/T .162
60 1.899
330 5.100
1/8 7.703
mph 95.12
1000 9.932
1/4 11.812
mph 120.08

R/T .125
60 1.898
330 5.106
1/8 7.708
mph 95.12
1000 9.937
1/4 11.816
mph 120.38

My conclusion: Removal of TM gave me 2 tenths, and possibly more if I had drag radials. I was spinning in my 1-2 and 2-3 shifts alot more than before I removed it. There was virtually no improvement in my 60'....I truly believe that it is my tires, and my inexperience, that is holding the car back in the 60'. Not really convinced it is TM. I'm also convinced that with DRs, I can acheive the magical 11.49....where I would get kicked off anyway.

I was getting alot of comments and people walking up to me asking if I was supercharged, what my mods were, etc...people weren't used to seeing a regular C6 putting up times like that. That part was really fun.

BTW - the weather was very similar...in fact, it was warmer tonight and more humid than on the night I got my previous best.

Originally Posted by Tommy D

*&%^$# Torque management, knock retard & heat soak ........ I want them all dead 1.99, to 1.96 sixty foots and I can't go any faster than 12.65 in the heat of the day. Then there is that wonderful honker my hptuners indicated the IAT in RED it was pulling so much timing

Why worry about the launch when the car pulls a bunch of timing and then even more when you shift ....... Oh and as usual the better my sixty foot was the slower my ET...... gotta love that Torque mangement

Sorry I just had to rant a bit

Originally Posted by Wingrider

Did the C5 have a torque management system?