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I am in need of some help since I just did headers, cam, catless x-pipe and intake on my Grand Sport and the npp open is just way too loud around town and seems to open sooner than before. I was talking to bjmsam in private and he suggested I post here to help anyone else that may have questions.
I think I have the general idea on how to wire the rpm switch and how to get the tach wire to it. The issue I have is I have a m2w switch already installed and need some help with a splice location and if I can splice where I show it, or even splice it at all? I have attached a couple of images to try to get my question across. Any help would be greatly appreciated.
Thanks to BJMSAM for all his help so far...
Do these images make sense and will the switch work wired as shown?
I would suggest one of these $55 units to switch your npp solenoid at dufferent RPMs. From the vendor:
With our ARWSr module, you can adjust between eight different RPM windows. Each RPM of the eight windows is programed at the time of purchase to whatever you request. Each RPM window must have a lower turn-on RPM, at/above which it turns-on its output, and it can (optionally) have a higher turn-off RPM, at/above which it would turn-off its output. Each window is selected by moving three switches into any one of eight different configurations.
The module is factory reprogrammable, so if you decide that you need a different set of eight windows you can contact us for return/reprogramming instructions.
I'm trying to figure out what is the purpose of this endeavor? How do you envision this RPM switch operating?
My thoughts were on mine that the drone with the valves open is really bad at cruising speeds and 1500 rpm. Using a rpm device I can block the valves opening say between 1200 - 2500 rpms. Thats similar to the factory npp which blocks anything below 3500
The way you have you it drawn, I can't tell if the RPM controller is supplying power to the relay coil tab on 86, or drawing power instead.
Also, can't tell if the RPM controller has a controlled negative on 85 that is going to control the relay energizing as well.
Also, are you trying to remove the mild to wild controller, use it and have the NPP gate open up at higher RPM with it set in mild mode, or what????.
If the later with mild to wild still in play, you want to the gate to open up at higher RPMS with the mild to wild controller set in mild mode, and using the MSD 8950 RPM Activated Switch. http://www.jegs.com/InstallationInst...1/121-8950.pdf
The the power from the heater circut goes to the mds RPM controller red wire, the mild to wild controller red wire and 86 on the relay.
The msd ground wire (black) goes to the same ground that the mild to wild screw is using for it ground. The yellow wire out of the MSD RPM controller will go to 85 on the relay.
Note:The rest of the wires for the MSD rpm controller are self explanatory in the diagram provided.
On the mild to wild white wire in between the mild to wild controller and where it plugged back into the fuse box, cut it in two, and one side of the wire gets connected to 30, and the other side of the wire gets connected to 87a.
So the way this works, with the RPMs below the threshold level, hence for the RPM controller make the ground path needed for the 12v relay coil to energize, the Normal closed rated path of the relay for contacts is closed (30 to 871 is normally closed, NC) and the mild to wild controller is acting normal since it suppling power to the NPP circut in the fuse box.
When the RPM's are reached for the RPM controller to kick in/ to close the negativity path in the RPM controller through the yellow wire to ground, the relay coil is energized, and this breaks the path from 30 to 87a (contact through the relay becomes 30 to 87 with the relay coil energized) and the white wire out of the mild to wild controller to the NPP fuse box circuit is not longer supping power to the NPP to hold the muffler closed.
As for amperage draw, the relay is only drawing 160micro amps, so it not a concern in the big picture, but what you have to be conserved about is the amount of power that the RPM controller is drawing instead. If the RPM controller is only drawing around 1 amp, then it wired to the same as the mild to wild controller main red wire circuit is not going to case a problem. If the RPM controller is drawing more amps instead, then it may need to be wired to another ignition controlled circuit in the fuse box, or may end up with the mild to wild main fuse blowing since your trying to draw too much amperage through the single fuse instead.
So again, the relay coil is energinzed through 85 and 86.
30 will have a connection to 87a when the relay coil is not energized, and when the relay coil is engergized with 12 volts through 85 and 86, connection from 30 to 87a is lost, and the connection through the relay become 30 to 87 instead.
As for the relay, the coil only draws around 160 micro amps when energized, so not really a power consumption concern, but you need to figure out what the RPM controller is drawing in power instead.
If more than say 1 amp that the RPM controller is drawing, then the RPM controller red main power wire may need to be wired to another ignition power circuit at the fuse box, instead of the same heater circuit that the mild to wire controller is using instead.
Or, there is a much easy way instead!!!!!!
Unplug the mild to wild and remove it.
Unplug the NPP fuse in the passanger fuse box.
Get a hose cap and in the back of the car, unplug the vacuum ball from the NPP hose and cap that line,
Next use a hose fitting disconnect the vacuum line in and out of the NPP pneumatic solenoid and connect the two lines directly together instead.
When you start the car, the NPP muffler valves will close.
When you are just cruising around at any RPM's, the NPP muffler valves will stay closed.
Now when you go WOT at any speed, the vacuum in the intake manifold will drop to zero, and the NPP muffler will open up.
So here, you stay out of deep in the throttle, and the NPP gates stay closed all the time.
But better, at a stop light and you nail the throttle from a stand still, the NPP gates in the muffler will open up, and you don't have to wait for the RPM's to climb up before the OEM system would normally open the gates instead.
Thanks for the responses. The main reason I want to change the opening rpm is as I stated in my post. "I am in need of some help since I just did headers, cam, catless x-pipe and intake on my Grand Sport and the npp open is just way too loud around town and seems to open sooner than before."
The intention is to leave the m2w in place and run the rpm switch in series with it so I can have the wide open mode when I go to the track and still maintain legal decibals with it in mild mode except the valves will open much later, say 5000 rpm rather than the 3500 stock.
My top image shows or rather asks if I can splice to the m2w wire shown on the second image using 87 to get in series with the m2w.
The other question is related to the exhaust power leg of the fuse where the m2w is installed. It is alwayd energized so I am asking if it makes sense to use a fuse tap on the seat heater/wiper circuit as it is switched.
I hope this clears up why I want to do this and how I am proposing to do it ...
Thanks again,
Now I see what you are doing with the relay the way you have it designed.
You want the relay to send power to the cars NNP circut in the fuse box when the rpm controller energizes the relay, no matter what the mild to wild controller is doing, and will work as designed for that.
87 to the mild to wild wire white wire will re energize the NPP circut if the mild to wild controller is in wild mode and not sending power to the NPP cars fuse circut instead.
But you are back to what the cars OEM NPP is going to do instead (3500rmps and 80 percent throttle is going to end up with the NPP muffler gates opening back up instead.
So a better solution, instead of wiring 87 to the white wire of the mild to wild controller to the Npp cuircut in the fuse box (leaving the OEM Npp cars controller in play in mild mode with the mild to wild controller, run 87 to the positive wire on the Pneumatic solenoid itself.
Mild to wild does it thing to either supply power to the BCM NPP circut to all it to work or not, the cars OEM NPP controller will do its thing if powered up by the mild to wild controller in mild mode, and for the RPM's that you want the NPP muffler gates closed that may be above the range of the cars OEM NPP controller if energized by the mild to wild controller, the Rpm controller with relay will control the Pneumatic solenoid directly itself instead to hold the muffler gate closed.
Bluntly put all the NPP OEM system does is controls the Pneumatic solenoid by either sending power to it or not to either allow vacuum flow through it or not for the muffler gates to be open or closed. The mild to wild controller just controls the power to the OEM cars controller in the BCM to either work or not instead.
With you now adding power to Pneumatic solenoid to energize it when needed directly for the given RPM ranges instead via the rpm controller with relay, it does not matter what the mild to wild or the BCM controller are doing, and the muffler gates will stay closed for the desired RPM range instead.
As for the RPM and relay power, just make sure to power them off a circuit that is ignition switch so you don't drain the battery when the car is off. and again, if the RPM controller is not pulling too much power, you can use the same power sources as the mild to wild controller switch sources too (read worst that is going to happen is you pull too much power for the add a circuit fuse for the mild to wild controller, and it just going to blow the fuse).
Now I see what you are doing with the relay the way you have it designed.
You want the relay to send power to the cars NNP circut in the fuse box when the rpm controller energizes the relay, not matter what the mild to wild controller is doing, and will work as designed for that.
87 to the mild to wild wire white wire will re energize the NPP circut if the mild to wild controller is in wild mode and not sending power to the NPP cars fuse circut instead.
But you are back to what the cars OEM NPP is going to do instead (3500rmps and 80 percent throttle is going to end up with the NPP muffler gates opening back up instead.
So a better solution, instead of wiring 87 to the white wire of the mild to wild controller to the Npp cuircut in the fuse box (leaving the OEM Npp cars controller in play in mild mode with the mild to wild switch, run 87 to the positive wire on the Pneumatic solenoid itself.
Mild to wild does it thing, the cars OEM NPP controller will do its thing if powered up by the mild to wild controller in mild mode, and for the RPM's that you want the NPP muffler gates closed that may be above the range of the cars OEM NPP controller if energized, the Rpm controller with relay will control the Pneumatic solenoid directly itself instead to hold the gate closed.
Bluntly put all the NPP OEM system does is controls the Pneumatic solenoid by either sending power to it or not to either allow vacuum flow through it or not for the muffler gates to be open or closed. The mild to wild controller just controls the power to the OEM cars controller in the BCM to either work or not.
With you now adding power to Pneumatic solenoid to energize it when needed directly for the given RPM ranges instead, it does not matter what the mild to wild or the BCM controller are doing, and the muffler gates will stay closed for the desired RPM range instead.
As for the RPM and relay power, just make sure to power them off a circuit that is ignition switch so you don't drain the battery when the car is off, and again, if the RPM controller is not pulling too much power, you can use the same power sources as the mild to wild controller switch sources as well (read worst that is going to happen is you pull too much power for the add a circuit fuse for the mild to wild controler, and it just going to blow the fuse).
Thanks again !!
So as I understand what you are saying, neither wire coming off the m2w will go directly to the solenoid and the m2w will over-ride my rpm switch? either wire go only to the bcm? If that is the case, where can I pick up the solenoid wire to achieve my goal? Or will I have to run a new wire from the engine compartment?
I am really happy that someone understood what my intentionswere and was able to interpret my drawing.
It is good to know I am on the right track here ..
Start with the above like for a wiring diagram of the NPP system.
The fuse is top left, and all the the Mild to wild controller is supping power to the cars NPP control module or not to allow it to work in the first place or not.
The Npp Pneumatic solenoid control circut is down line of the NPP control module.
To get to the Npp Pneumatic solenoid, remove the inner passenger rear tail light, and it's straight down inside the fender cover void under a rubber type cover.
The connector on the Pneumatic solenoid has two wires, being the ground wire black that leads to ground, and the positive into it, being tan/white per the diagram above.
Start with the above like for a wiring diagram of the NPP system.
The fuse is top left, and all the the Mild to wild controller is supping power to the cars NPP control module or not to allow it to work in the first place or not.
The Npp Pneumatic solenoid control circut is down line of the NPP control module.
To get to the Npp Pneumatic solenoid, remove the inner passenger rear tail light, and it's straight down inside the fender cover void under a rubber type cover.
The connector on the Pneumatic solenoid has two wires, being the ground wire black that leads to ground, and the positive into it, being tan/white per the diagram above.
I went into the tail light this morning and disconnected the solenoid to confirm the exhaust stays open that way. My understanding now is that I would need to tap a fuse at say the seat heater/wiper relay to get power to the relay. then tie to the tan/white wire from 87 on the relay? Question is do i leave the tan/white wire connected from the module to the solenoid or just cut it at the module? Or am I comepletely lost now?
Power to the tan/white wire will energize the solenoid to open it, to allows vacuum to pass through it from the intake manifold to close the gates/hold them closed.
So lets back this up a touch, and keep in mind that the throttle at WOT will drop all the vacuum from the intake manifold and the vacuum reserve ball has just about half of second vacuum reserve to keep the muffler gates closed until that reserve vacuum is drained down as well.
So, mild to wild will work to either power up the OEM NPP control to work as normal, or to chop powder to it so it not working at all (nothing more).
The NPP controller when powered up is going to kill the power to the solenoid when it reaches it's set RMP/throttle percentage to kill the power to the solenoid to open the gates normally (again about a 1/2 second delay on the gates opening up as the vacuum reserve ball vacuum is drained off if your close to the RPM limit when you go WOT, and not WOT from idle instead).
Why I bring this up, if the plan is to hold the gates closed during WOT in the desired RPM ranges with a RPM controller, then a vacuum pump will be needed (supply vacuum to the line when the intake manifold vacuum has dropped to zero and the vacuum in the reserve ball bleed off as well).
Now if the plan is to hold the gate closed at specific rpms range, but still have the muffler gates open up when you go WOT (lose the vacuum from the intake manifold/reserve ball), then you just need to spice into the tan/white wire with power with the connector still connected to the solenoid . The rest of the system will work normally as it does now ,and if the OEM NPP controller is not supplying power to the solenoid to hold it open to allow the intake manifold vacuum to pass through it at less than WOT, then the RPM controller will have the solenoid powered up instead.
If on the other hand, you want the gates to stay closed for a specific RPM, even when full throttle longer than the vacuum ball has reserve, then instead of messing with the solenoid at all, you will install a vacuum pump down line of the solenoid in the vacuum tubing instead. Here instead of relaying on intake manifold or reserve ball vacuum, it will the vaccum pump that will supply the needed vacuum to hold the muffler vavles closed instead.
If you check around, you should be able to find a 12V vacuum pump on the cheaper side (like the Dorman 904-214 Mechanical Vacuum Pump for Ford Trucks), and if it does not have a check valve on it so you are not loosing vacuum through the pump with it not running and drawing a vacuum, the just install one way check vavle in line between the pump and the NNP vacuum tubing you are tapping into.
And just a FYI, even if you over ride the stock programming in the OEM NPP controller for your desired rpm parameters, your still run into the lack of vacuum problem off the intake manifold at WOT.
Simply put as you go WOT from idle, the vacuum reserve ball only has enough reserve to hold the muffler gates closed for about a half second, since GM figured that during WOT from idle, that is the only reserve vacuum time needed for the car to hit the RPM range for the controller to chop the power the solenoid and open the gates anyways.
So to short bus this topic instead it turning into a novel instead , I need you to be very specific on that you want the muffler NNP gates to do, at what RPM range, and what at WOT as well.
As for the RPM controller itself, will be hard to beat Baker electronixs ARWSr controller since it can be programmed for the multi RPM range windows to supply switch power for the needed relays . http://www.bakerelectronix.com/products_rws/
And before you ask, if you just want to attack reprogramming the NPP controller, get in touch with SunsetOrangeCreations and see if that is something that there controller can do with their OBDII plug in device.
Power to the tan/white wire will energize the solenoid to open it, to allows vacuum to pass through it from the intake manifold to close the gates/hold them closed.
So lets back this up a touch, and keep in mind that the throttle at WOT will drop all the vacuum from the intake manifold and the vacuum reserve ball has just about half of second vacuum reserve to keep the muffler gates closed until that reserve vacuum is drained down as well.
So, mild to wild will work to either power up the OEM NPP control to work as normal, or to chop powder to it so it not working at all (nothing more).
The NPP controller when powered up is going to kill the power to the solenoid when it reaches it's set RMP/throttle percentage to kill the power to the solenoid to open the gates normally (again about a 1/2 second delay on the gates opening up as the vacuum reserve ball vacuum is drained off if your close to the RPM limit when you go WOT, and not WOT from idle instead).
Why I bring this up, if the plan is to hold the gates closed during WOT in the desired RPM ranges with a RPM controller, then a vacuum pump will be needed (supply vacuum to the line when the intake manifold vacuum has dropped to zero and the vacuum in the reserve ball bleed off as well).
Now if the plan is to hold the gate closed at specific rpms range, but still have the muffler gates open up when you go WOT (lose the vacuum from the intake manifold/reserve ball), then you just need to spice into the tan/white wire with power with the connector still connected to the solenoid . The rest of the system will work normally as it does now ,and if the OEM NPP controller is not supplying power to the solenoid to hold it open to allow the intake manifold vacuum to pass through it at less than WOT, then the RPM controller will have the solenoid powered up instead.
If on the other hand, you want the gates to stay closed for a specific RPM, even when full throttle longer than the vacuum ball has reserve, then instead of messing with the solenoid at all, you will install a vacuum pump down line of the solenoid in the vacuum tubing instead. Here instead of relaying on intake manifold or reserve ball vacuum, it will the vaccum pump that will supply the needed vacuum to hold the muffler vavles closed instead.
If you check around, you should be able to find a 12V vacuum pump on the cheaper side (like the Dorman 904-214 Mechanical Vacuum Pump for Ford Trucks), and if it does not have a check valve on it so you are not loosing vacuum through the pump with it not running and drawing a vacuum, the just install one way check vavle in line between the pump and the NNP vacuum tubing you are tapping into.
And just a FYI, even if you over ride the stock programming in the OEM NPP controller for your desired rpm parameters, your still run into the lack of vacuum problem off the intake manifold at WOT.
Simply put as you go WOT from idle, the vacuum reserve ball only has enough reserve to hold the muffler gates closed for about a half second, since GM figured that during WOT from idle, that is the only reserve vacuum time needed for the car to hit the RPM range for the controller to chop the power the solenoid and open the gates anyways.
So to short bus this topic instead it turning into a novel instead , I need you to be very specific on that you want the muffler NNP gates to do, at what RPM range, and what at WOT as well.
As for the RPM controller itself, will be hard to beat Baker electronixs ARWSr controller since it can be programmed for the multi RPM range windows to supply switch power for the needed relays . http://www.bakerelectronix.com/products_rws/
And before you ask, if you just want to attack reprogramming the NPP controller, get in touch with SunsetOrangeCreations and see if that is something that there controller can do with their OBDII plug in device.
Thanks for all your help. I finished it yesterday and it works as intended. Case closed ...
NPP RPM Activated Switch
