Port Injection
06-30-2018, 01:17 PM
#1
Drifting
Thread Starter
Port Injection
What are our current options for port injection?
Weapon X SPI
Crawford Racing Fueler
ProSpeed
LMR
42 Autosports
Katech - Currently doesn't work with centri builds due to bolting location
??
- What's the most tuner friendly setup? And avg cost for install?
- Do these setups require lowside support?
- What if any, units can support live e85 adjustments without 2 tunes?
- Can you run rails without modifying a procharger (PC) manifold or is it required?
- Are there significant benefits from switching to a different manifold ie. G1PRO over the standard PC manifold?
- With the stock fuel system in place what injectors would be recommended for 950-1050whp (low side, cam 35% meth currently) Are guys dropping big money on ID1200s or are Bosch or FAST units being widely used?
Weapon X SPI
Crawford Racing Fueler
ProSpeed
LMR
42 Autosports
Katech - Currently doesn't work with centri builds due to bolting location
??
- What's the most tuner friendly setup? And avg cost for install?
- Do these setups require lowside support?
- What if any, units can support live e85 adjustments without 2 tunes?
- Can you run rails without modifying a procharger (PC) manifold or is it required?
- Are there significant benefits from switching to a different manifold ie. G1PRO over the standard PC manifold?
- With the stock fuel system in place what injectors would be recommended for 950-1050whp (low side, cam 35% meth currently) Are guys dropping big money on ID1200s or are Bosch or FAST units being widely used?
07-01-2018, 12:44 PM
#2
Le Mans Master
I think it all it all depends on what ECU is used to drive the port injection in regard to tuner friendly. It does bring the tuners back to the LS approach they usually only run the PI in boost.
It does require low side support. The aux pump runs the port injection.
The kit LMR does has a flex fuel sensor on the secondary ECU and auto adjusts like the DI side. No need for two tunes.
The Procharger intake comes with rails specific to their intake. All the other intake manufacturers pretty much offer the same thing. There are specific rails for the intake you choose. You’ll have to go with an intake that has injector bungs. There isn’t enough room in a stock intake for the bungs and rails. Your options are really just pro charger, G1, or LME.
I think the PI injectors are usually like 850s just for room to grow and run full E85
It does require low side support. The aux pump runs the port injection.
The kit LMR does has a flex fuel sensor on the secondary ECU and auto adjusts like the DI side. No need for two tunes.
The Procharger intake comes with rails specific to their intake. All the other intake manufacturers pretty much offer the same thing. There are specific rails for the intake you choose. You’ll have to go with an intake that has injector bungs. There isn’t enough room in a stock intake for the bungs and rails. Your options are really just pro charger, G1, or LME.
I think the PI injectors are usually like 850s just for room to grow and run full E85
What are our current options for port injection?
Weapon X SPI
Crawford Racing Fueler
ProSpeed
LMR
42 Autosports
Katech - Currently doesn't work with centri builds due to bolting location
??
- What's the most tuner friendly setup? And avg cost for install?
- Do these setups require lowside support?
- What if any, units can support live e85 adjustments without 2 tunes?
- Can you run rails without modifying a procharger (PC) manifold or is it required?
- Are there significant benefits from switching to a different manifold ie. G1PRO over the standard PC manifold?
- With the stock fuel system in place what injectors would be recommended for 950-1050whp (low side, cam 35% meth currently) Are guys dropping big money on ID1200s or are Bosch or FAST units being widely used?
Weapon X SPI
Crawford Racing Fueler
ProSpeed
LMR
42 Autosports
Katech - Currently doesn't work with centri builds due to bolting location
??
- What's the most tuner friendly setup? And avg cost for install?
- Do these setups require lowside support?
- What if any, units can support live e85 adjustments without 2 tunes?
- Can you run rails without modifying a procharger (PC) manifold or is it required?
- Are there significant benefits from switching to a different manifold ie. G1PRO over the standard PC manifold?
- With the stock fuel system in place what injectors would be recommended for 950-1050whp (low side, cam 35% meth currently) Are guys dropping big money on ID1200s or are Bosch or FAST units being widely used?
07-01-2018, 09:21 PM
#3
Le Mans Master
Member Since: Aug 2001
Location: Savannah GA
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Cruise-In IV Veteran
Just so you know what you are getting into here you need:
- ACM (I had ProSpeed and went with HRFueler Holley 2.0 w/ wastegate control, e85, etc). This is primarily what your tuner is comfortable with (Can range from $3k to $5500). I was in that happy medium b/c I wanted some extra features.
- Fuel support (low side system but also know you have to tie that into the fuel rails for the port injection setup, no two are generally alike so you will run into extra $$ for fittings, hoses, etc.). I went with the WeaponX 550lph (upgraded) low side with E85 sensor. $2k it's on their site.
- You can be just fine with FIC injectors or Bosch. I chose FIC 1000 to support even my future power goals. To fit my G1Pro LTx manifold with holley rails I used 38mm shorty LS3 style injectors with 14mm top/bottom o-rings. $900
- You will need Holley Rails, and brackets to mate those to the intake.
- Intake manifold with injection bungs welded in (either have ProCharger do it when you order it's $500 I believe or get a custom to order G1Pro, LME, MSD, intake that fits your power needs (I wanted a 103mm intake to match my katech 103 TB). The newer G1Pro's hold up solid and are proven to gain power look at the cars that run them. Custom intakes are from $1300 to 4500.
- HP Tuners and other tuning software/cables to allow tuning of both stock and port inj computers. That will cost ya. '17 and up years are a bit more $$.
- You are talking $7k to $15k easily for port injection (right way in my opinion)
- Talk to Chris @ Crawford his service sold me. Second to none!
OR
30% larger DI injectors + low side + high side + cam (33-37% fuel lobe) + Tuning may get you 1000 wheel safely, my pure uneducated guess??? But you need 30% more fuel just to make the same power on E85 so I chose port inection and just being done with it all.
- ACM (I had ProSpeed and went with HRFueler Holley 2.0 w/ wastegate control, e85, etc). This is primarily what your tuner is comfortable with (Can range from $3k to $5500). I was in that happy medium b/c I wanted some extra features.
- Fuel support (low side system but also know you have to tie that into the fuel rails for the port injection setup, no two are generally alike so you will run into extra $$ for fittings, hoses, etc.). I went with the WeaponX 550lph (upgraded) low side with E85 sensor. $2k it's on their site.
- You can be just fine with FIC injectors or Bosch. I chose FIC 1000 to support even my future power goals. To fit my G1Pro LTx manifold with holley rails I used 38mm shorty LS3 style injectors with 14mm top/bottom o-rings. $900
- You will need Holley Rails, and brackets to mate those to the intake.
- Intake manifold with injection bungs welded in (either have ProCharger do it when you order it's $500 I believe or get a custom to order G1Pro, LME, MSD, intake that fits your power needs (I wanted a 103mm intake to match my katech 103 TB). The newer G1Pro's hold up solid and are proven to gain power look at the cars that run them. Custom intakes are from $1300 to 4500.
- HP Tuners and other tuning software/cables to allow tuning of both stock and port inj computers. That will cost ya. '17 and up years are a bit more $$.
- You are talking $7k to $15k easily for port injection (right way in my opinion)
- Talk to Chris @ Crawford his service sold me. Second to none!
OR
30% larger DI injectors + low side + high side + cam (33-37% fuel lobe) + Tuning may get you 1000 wheel safely, my pure uneducated guess??? But you need 30% more fuel just to make the same power on E85 so I chose port inection and just being done with it all.
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Mikec7z (07-01-2018)
07-01-2018, 10:39 PM
#4
Melting Slicks
I am using the M2K Motorsports Motec Port Injection Setup on my car, both with my old F1X and now with the new turbo setup. It really comes down to what your tuner is comfortable with, if they like Holley, go Holley, if they like Motec go Motec, if they like ProEFI go ACM.
Cost wise, Holley is the most affordable PI EMS from what I've seen. Motec is similar to the ACM (maybe a few hundred more depending on how you equip it). Expect to spend around $3-5k on a well equipped PI EMS not counting the fuel setup. I am using the Fore triple and the Motec bypasses the need for a primer switch (it handles that itself), and I am using ID1300cc injectors and the LME Billet intake manifold. You can definitely do it cheaper, but I have always been impressed with the Fore quality and service, almost every tuner I know swears by ID (outside of cost....some think other injectors are just as good for less, but I've never heard any argue the ID isn't the best), and the LME Intake has been proven to make over 100whp more than the Procharger sheet metal IM...but it's a $4500 piece of engine art....but well worth it imo.
Cost wise, Holley is the most affordable PI EMS from what I've seen. Motec is similar to the ACM (maybe a few hundred more depending on how you equip it). Expect to spend around $3-5k on a well equipped PI EMS not counting the fuel setup. I am using the Fore triple and the Motec bypasses the need for a primer switch (it handles that itself), and I am using ID1300cc injectors and the LME Billet intake manifold. You can definitely do it cheaper, but I have always been impressed with the Fore quality and service, almost every tuner I know swears by ID (outside of cost....some think other injectors are just as good for less, but I've never heard any argue the ID isn't the best), and the LME Intake has been proven to make over 100whp more than the Procharger sheet metal IM...but it's a $4500 piece of engine art....but well worth it imo.
07-01-2018, 11:02 PM
#5
Safety Car
Member Since: Jan 2012
Location: Cin City
Posts: 4,885
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St. Jude Donor '14
What are our current options for port injection?
Weapon X SPI
- What's the most tuner friendly setup? And avg cost for install?
- Do these setups require lowside support?
- What if any, units can support live e85 adjustments without 2 tunes?
- Can you run rails without modifying a procharger (PC) manifold or is it required?
- Are there significant benefits from switching to a different manifold ie. G1PRO over the standard PC manifold?
- With the stock fuel system in place what injectors would be recommended for 950-1050whp (low side, cam 35% meth currently) Are guys dropping big money on ID1200s or are Bosch or FAST units being widely used?
Weapon X SPI
- What's the most tuner friendly setup? And avg cost for install?
- Do these setups require lowside support?
- What if any, units can support live e85 adjustments without 2 tunes?
- Can you run rails without modifying a procharger (PC) manifold or is it required?
- Are there significant benefits from switching to a different manifold ie. G1PRO over the standard PC manifold?
- With the stock fuel system in place what injectors would be recommended for 950-1050whp (low side, cam 35% meth currently) Are guys dropping big money on ID1200s or are Bosch or FAST units being widely used?
We have had a lot of success with these so far and to my knowledge is the only kit that is a complete solution with controller, custom plug and play harness, low side kit complete with premade lines, fittings, regulator, billet rails, big fuel pump, injectors, flex fuel sensor for petrol to E85 auto tuning, dual widebands, fuel pressure gauge, custom mounting plate for the gauges, etc! The kit has dual wideband control for bank to bank fueling if necessary and closed loop correction as well as an auto learn feature - all for under $5,000 for the kit and we have an installed sale price of $2,999 installed and tuned. This controller and components are all top notch, this is by no means some off brand alternative, and while we offer a full Pro version of the controller as well with launch control, boost by gear, etc that I have on my compound boost ZL1, you simply do not need a full on stand alone controller for something that is simply driving the injectors. GM proved that with their port controller introduced on my ZR1, but we even have a lot of extra bells and whistles like closed loop wideband control and dual bank wideband control as previously mentioned, along with several other channel inputs.
PS we're even raffling one off for our Independence Day Sale starting Wednesday
SPI Kit Info:
https://weaponxmotorsports.com/produ...=5777974296603
You'd have to modify the PC manifold unless you did the G1 Pro manifold which we did on our flagship C7 build with an air to water intercooler inside and our chiller kit. I'll get more info on that up this week, but this setup is chilling the F1X air temps by 160* and this is also controlled with the SPI kit if equipped!
We're even rolling out our own billet fuel rails for the SPI kits! Here are a couple shots of the prototype.
07-02-2018, 03:58 PM
#6
In for the raffle, do another for the 2.9 as well 😋
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Ben@WeaponX (07-09-2018)
07-02-2018, 04:31 PM
#7
Le Mans Master
Member Since: Aug 2001
Location: Savannah GA
Posts: 6,070
Received 280 Likes
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Cruise-In IV Veteran
Ben, I have to say I love those billet fuel rails they look so much nicer than the Holley Rails. Nice work there! Thanks for shipping me out your custom low side fuel system today also!! Excited to see it.
07-03-2018, 11:05 AM
#9
Supporting Vendor
We have our own system that is in house install only. We would be happy to get you squared away. Our system is straight forward and simple. Give us a call if you have any questions.
Last edited by Late Model Racecraft; 07-03-2018 at 11:05 AM.
07-04-2018, 11:03 AM
#10
Melting Slicks