This is the truth. Chrysler has been offering cylinder deactivation on their HEMIs since 2009...but only on automatic-equipped cars. Tadge never said that no one else is offering ARM with a stick...
Rev match on upshift ????
Melting Slicks
Joined: Jun 2005
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St. Jude Donor '12-'13-'14, '16
Yes. Sorry.
It was the C&D article I was thinking of. They asked Tadge Juechter if there is rev-matching on both up and down shifts on the seven speed manual.
He didn't simply respond yes. He said, "We looked at what others had done, and we've added rev-matching on upshifts." He never specifically mentions rev-matching on downshifts. Sorry, I read it fast and took away that for some weird reason there is no rev-matching on downshifts which just made no sense to me when I first read it.
The rev-matching is turned on and off with little paddles on the steering wheel. Stupid place to have an on and off control, but at least the driver can control it.
He also states that no other manufacturer has rev-matching on a manual transmission.
It was the C&D article I was thinking of. They asked Tadge Juechter if there is rev-matching on both up and down shifts on the seven speed manual.
He didn't simply respond yes. He said, "We looked at what others had done, and we've added rev-matching on upshifts." He never specifically mentions rev-matching on downshifts. Sorry, I read it fast and took away that for some weird reason there is no rev-matching on downshifts which just made no sense to me when I first read it.
The rev-matching is turned on and off with little paddles on the steering wheel. Stupid place to have an on and off control, but at least the driver can control it.
He also states that no other manufacturer has rev-matching on a manual transmission.
Team Owner
Joined: Sep 1999
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From: Springfield MO
can anyone actually provide a link to where GM(and that includes anyone that works for GM) says that the rev matching is also on upshifts?
I fail to see why it's necessary on upshifts as you don't heel and toe on upshifts.
I fail to see why it's necessary on upshifts as you don't heel and toe on upshifts.
Safety Car
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I believe it is so when you release the clutch it is smoother. That is, no need to slowly release the clutch.
Last edited by gthal; Mar 29, 2013 at 05:55 PM.
Melting Slicks
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St. Jude Donor '12-'13-'14, '16
http://media.gm.com/media/me/en/chev..._Corvette.html
Team Owner
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From: Springfield MO
Now, on a road course, if you don't know how to operate three pedals with two feet when downshifting(I never use the brake when I'm upshifting as I'm trying to gain speed, not decrease speed) then having the rev matching would be advantageous. Even on a road course, coming out of a corner and accelerating, why would you use the brake pedal at the same time you are mashing the gas pedal?
Pro
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From: N.W. Georgia
Melting Slicks
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From: Cali for ya Republic
It's not as crucial on upshift, but why not. And you can always turn it off.
Pro
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I dont know that GM would specifically recommend it, but I believe the biggest reason for rev matching on upshifts is so you can have a smooth, no-lift shift.
Didn't the old Cobalt SS have a "power shift" feature or something like that? I believe this is a similar feature taken to the next level. Should be pretty interesting.
-T
Didn't the old Cobalt SS have a "power shift" feature or something like that? I believe this is a similar feature taken to the next level. Should be pretty interesting.
-T
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Le Mans Master
Joined: Dec 2004
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From: West coast CA
On the C6, the computer drops revs very slowly when you get off the gas. Presumably the C7 will drop revs ASAP to match the destination gear on upshifts.
Team Owner
Joined: Sep 1999
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From: Springfield MO
"The seven-speed manual incorporates rev-matching technology for upshifts and downshifts."
You don't heel-and-toe upshifts because the driver can't do any more to slow down the engine other than not step on the gas pedal at all. So there's nothing for your heel to do. For that matter, there's nothing for your toe to do, either, because upshifting under braking doesn't make a lot of sense.
On the C6, the computer drops revs very slowly when you get off the gas. Presumably the C7 will drop revs ASAP to match the destination gear on upshifts.
You don't heel-and-toe upshifts because the driver can't do any more to slow down the engine other than not step on the gas pedal at all. So there's nothing for your heel to do. For that matter, there's nothing for your toe to do, either, because upshifting under braking doesn't make a lot of sense.
On the C6, the computer drops revs very slowly when you get off the gas. Presumably the C7 will drop revs ASAP to match the destination gear on upshifts.
Le Mans Master
Joined: Dec 2004
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From: West coast CA
Isn't that what I said, but with a lot less words. You don't heel and toe on up shifts, so what's the point of rev matching by the car's computer. You are only working two pedals on upshifting and you have two feet . Works out perfect and it takes no special skills for the driver to manually rev match with his right foot when upshifting. If a driver can't master that simple task, then maybe he should spring for the automatic transmission.
On the C6, it lets the revs drop to idle, slowly. So what it means to "manually rev match" an upshift on these cars is simply to lift, because you can't close the throttle quickly enough. In practice this works out okay.
On the C7 they've got this system for detecting what the gear selector is doing, so it can drop to the appropriate RPM as quickly as possible without overrunning. This sounds like an improvement to me.
The driver is not in control of engine speed in either case.
Team Owner
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From: Springfield MO
When the driver lifts off the gas, the computer is completely in charge of throttle position. What should it do?
On the C6, it lets the revs drop to idle, slowly. So what it means to "manually rev match" an upshift on these cars is simply to lift, because you can't close the throttle quickly enough. In practice this works out okay.
On the C7 they've got this system for detecting what the gear selector is doing, so it can drop to the appropriate RPM as quickly as possible without overrunning. This sounds like an improvement to me.
The driver is not in control of engine speed in either case.
On the C6, it lets the revs drop to idle, slowly. So what it means to "manually rev match" an upshift on these cars is simply to lift, because you can't close the throttle quickly enough. In practice this works out okay.
On the C7 they've got this system for detecting what the gear selector is doing, so it can drop to the appropriate RPM as quickly as possible without overrunning. This sounds like an improvement to me.
The driver is not in control of engine speed in either case.
Two pedals and two feet and the ability to finesse them is all it takes to upshift. You don't need a computer to intervene.
Last edited by JoesC5; Mar 30, 2013 at 12:56 PM.
Safety Car
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When the driver lifts off the gas, the computer is completely in charge of throttle position. What should it do?
On the C6, it lets the revs drop to idle, slowly. So what it means to "manually rev match" an upshift on these cars is simply to lift, because you can't close the throttle quickly enough. In practice this works out okay.
On the C7 they've got this system for detecting what the gear selector is doing, so it can drop to the appropriate RPM as quickly as possible without overrunning. This sounds like an improvement to me.
The driver is not in control of engine speed in either case.
On the C6, it lets the revs drop to idle, slowly. So what it means to "manually rev match" an upshift on these cars is simply to lift, because you can't close the throttle quickly enough. In practice this works out okay.
On the C7 they've got this system for detecting what the gear selector is doing, so it can drop to the appropriate RPM as quickly as possible without overrunning. This sounds like an improvement to me.
The driver is not in control of engine speed in either case.
Le Mans Master
Joined: Dec 2004
Posts: 5,488
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From: West coast CA
The gas pedal is not an on/off switch. You modulate the RPM's with your right foot. That's were driving comes into play. I've been driving manuals since 1954 and can upshift without jerking the car around. It's not a difficult thing to master. I can upshift in normal driving as smooth as an automatic or jerk your head back, hard, when power shifting.
Two pedals and two feet and the ability to finesse them is all it takes to upshift. You don't need a computer to intervene.
Two pedals and two feet and the ability to finesse them is all it takes to upshift. You don't need a computer to intervene.
When you lift the throttle quickly on a C5 or a C6 _you're_ not "modulating" anything. The revs are dropping at a rate governed by the computer. If you want the revs to drop more quickly for a perfect rev match, you're out of luck. There isn't a pedal for that.
In practice, it doesn't matter much because the motor will shed revs quickly when reengaging the clutch. Upshifts are easy anyway. Nobody finds them "difficult to master."
However, now that the C7 knows where the gear selector is headed, why not incorporate that information into the throttle control circuit? Remember - if you're lifting faster than the computer will allow the revs to drop, the computer is already intervening today.
Last edited by torquetube; Mar 30, 2013 at 01:03 PM.
Drifting
Joined: Nov 2012
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Having ridden bikes with the power commander on them it's every bit as awesome as you think it would be. As if a bike wasn't ''holy ****" fast enough already. 
Most of the newer bikes don't even need the power commander if you know how to feel it in, and have years and years of reliable performance afterwards.
Most of the newer bikes don't even need the power commander if you know how to feel it in, and have years and years of reliable performance afterwards.
Last edited by Aaron Keating; Mar 30, 2013 at 01:05 PM.
Team Owner
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From: Springfield MO
Later on, when Chrysler wanted a performance manual transmission, they went back to tried and proven 4 speed manual transmission where you have to use the clutch when you shift gears.
Kinda like what the Corvette Z06 and the Supercharged 638 HP ZR1 uses and the Viper and the supercharged 680 HP Mustang and the supercharged 580 HP Camaro uses, etc.
Drifting
Joined: Nov 2012
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You mean like with a 1949 Desoto where you use the clutch pedal when stopping/starting, but just let off the gas while manual shifting the transmission and the then giving it the gas after completion of the shift. No clutch involved when shifting over 60 years ago. Worked so well that they discontinued it when they came out with a fully automatic transmission.
Later on, when Chrysler wanted a performance manual transmission, they went back to tried and proven 4 speed manual transmission where you have to use the clutch when you shift gears.
Kinda like what the Corvette Z06 and the Supercharged 638 HP ZR1 uses and the Viper and the supercharged 680 HP Mustang and the supercharged 580 HP Camaro uses, etc.
Later on, when Chrysler wanted a performance manual transmission, they went back to tried and proven 4 speed manual transmission where you have to use the clutch when you shift gears.
Kinda like what the Corvette Z06 and the Supercharged 638 HP ZR1 uses and the Viper and the supercharged 680 HP Mustang and the supercharged 580 HP Camaro uses, etc.
Also, I hate to break this to you, but the ZO6, ZR1, Viper, Lambos, Ferraris of the world? Are Dogs compared to a sport bike in terms of acceleration, and pull a hell of alot more revs doing it.
http://www.sportrider.com/riding_tip...g/viewall.html Here's an article explaining how to do it.
It's almost is if technology has come along way in a relatively short time or something. The setup from the factory isn't quite as good as a power commander (as it requires more technique than having the electronics handle it for you). The powercommander lets you do it at WOT. Period. If you can't see the benefit of keeping your foot down while shifting, there's no hope for you. Because no ''technique'' of yours is going to be faster than Hammer Down and shift.
Last edited by Aaron Keating; Mar 30, 2013 at 01:35 PM.