JerriVette

Enjoyable Porsche review of 87 thousand dollar mid engine cayman s ..

http://www.autoblog.com/2013/08/29/2...yman-s-review/

punky

Best looking Porsche for sure at this point. Much more curb appeal than the 911. Local Porsche dealer had a '14 Cayman next to a 911 convt. The Cayman looks far better as th 911 has that retarded hump behind the roof line, bad side profile.The Cayman is too small, underpowered and painfully overpiced. $87,000 for that car is absolutely ridiculous even with the 10 grand discount that they will usually do around here. No wonder why they push the champagne in those joints. You would need to be half goned up to go for that.

RedLS6

Driver confidence and ability with a particular platform often makes or breaks laptimes, even with pro drivers. Even pro drivers can slow considerably when placed in unfamiliar or uncomfortable territory. This applies also to a large percentage of folks who track their cars - laptimes are not always about the fastest car, but are often the product of the best car/driver combination. Tests like this may not produce "bragging rights" laptimes that we like to flaunt, but they do shine light on the overall performance envelope from a different angle, which is not a bad thing at all, but it can mask the car's absolute potential.

The Sport Auto Hockenheim results were possibly a little different. These were 2012s with cup tires, and horsepower was not as much of an advantage on this shorter track.

Please forgive the somewhat humorous Google translation of the Sport Auto webpage that I pasted here, below:

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Z06
For traction, the feedback from the steering and turn-in and the brake with deceleration values ​​of up to 13.6 m/s2's the first school grade In words: Absolute neutral and certainly manageable. Clearly, in view of the foot on the accelerator 512 PS may not play cleaver, otherwise it exaggerates the slightly oppressive under load with its rear lunges. After the second flying lap of the test editor of this story does not believe his eyes when a blazing lap time of 1.08,7 minutes on a 2D monitor.

ZR1
The small weight shortcoming is then felt on the small track of Hockenheim with its tight corners by a minimal understeer and a slight tendency to push the front axle when braking. But to whine about these tiny disadvantage is as if a sheikh would complain about a slight drop in its oil pipeline..................With Hockenheim lap time of 1.08,3 minutes, the Corvette ZR1 is crowned as the second fastest on the small track in Hockenheim of sports car measured in the last three years.
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The GT3 RS time was around a 1:09.5 here. Fantastic car, nonetheless. I'm looking forward to seeing what the new GT3 PDk can do.




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gofobroke

The Corvette from C5 on is no doubt a great sports car. The C7 looks to be upping the ante even more. As a guy who tracks my cars 4-5 times a year at road courses with NASA and sometimes PCA what I see is VERY FEW OLD CORVETTES and LOTS OF 30 year old 911's. The GT3 is a much tougher car and just plain more suited as a car that can take far more abuse. The GT3 will be there 20-30 yrs from now screaming around the track when the new C12 comes out touted as the best corvette ever. The vette has yet to prove itself over the long haul being passed from one track guy to another. That being said there are lots of old Miatas too!! I agree that in magazine one lap test the various vettes can go faster, but keep going and brakes start to heat up and fade, tires get less grippy. Not the the whole picture, just headline grabbers to sell cars.
How many of you know that the GT3 in mostly stock form is also a Rally car? The German rally where this same car goes flying over dirt crests, through mud, gravel getting pounded at 10/10ths. Not a rally prepped million dollar Subaru or EVo just a stock GT3 with different struts, springs and tires. TRY THAT WITH A CORVETTE!! it would be in lots of pieces all over the course.

Guibo

You are correct. That was a group test between the Grand Sport, C6Z and Z06 (the latter two on Cup tires). There has not yet been any test of the C6's on Cup tires submitted for the supertest (which includes the Nordschleife and wet laps).
Rough google translation of the ZR1 on the Nurburgring with PS2:
"The problem is that the axles do not uniformly lose contact with the ground - which would manage the landing perfectly on - but only the lower weight loads and also dominated by a slight boost to the rear axle. The recipe that follows shortly thereafter, extremely fast right turns in the direction of Flugplatz - we say - out of focus resting phase, and address from the correct transfer point is no longer possible after such a bizarre leap into the air.
The horizontal load changes that have occurred automatically through the mountain and valley profile of the Nordschleife, inasmuch as a somewhat unpleasant consequence is kept as the correct line only with difficulty."

The same car at Hockenheim:
"As long as the distances are as flat as a pancake on the small track in Hockenheim, the Corvette ZR1 is in her element. The unusually direct give in proving in connection with the reliable self-steering behavior as the perfect recipe for targeted persecution of the envisaged ideal line. By accessed at any time and well-controlled power-oversteering any angle even in the minute range is displayed. With the ceramic brake a lasting alliance is guaranteed. To succeed in the U.S. sports car in a test Hockenheim round TIMES of 1.09,7 minutes."

The Corvettes' great times at Hockenheim underscore a point: If Sport Auto were so biased toward German cars, why are the Corvettes faster here than just about all of the Porsches? If AutoBild is so biased toward German cars, why are the TIKT and Geiger 730+ hp Corvettes at the top of their time chart at Sachsenring, faster than tuned McLaren, GT-Rs, and Porsches? The answer appears to be that on a smooth track with great sight lines, plenty of run-off space, and more consistent surface, the Corvette can be more easily driven to its max potential. There is next to zero run-off space on the bumpy downhill run at the Foxhole on the Nordschleife, at the bottom of which there is a huge compression.

Kappa

ByByBMW

For the folks in this thread that appreciate both marquee's, here is a quote from a user on a well traveled Porsche forum I think you will understand and appreciate.

"I look at cars in somewhat the same way I look at guitars. All guitars have the same basic function; which is making sound. But a Strat emits a much different tonality than a Les Paul; so each is typically used in different styles of music, in which their unique tonality is more pleasing/effective. But the question I'm always asked is "which is better?" That's a totally irrelevant question; as both are excellent pieces and it really depends on what style of music you want to play.

What style of car (music) are you looking to drive (play)?" The poster's username is Bluzpwr and he did give me permission to repost his comment.

I thought this was a very unique and eloquent way to put an analogy between the Corvette and a Porsche.

YMMV

Cruiter

Back in the mid/late 70's and into the 80's I did an eight year stint selling Porsche and Audi's when they were together. Even then I was tuned to the fact we weren't the only game in town and everyone coming in the door didn't walk to the same drum beat. They had pre-concieved notions of what for them was best and you just had to get them talking to see what was important to them as an individual. The post you provided is good, thanks for posting. It say's in so many words 'what is real' to an individual.

RedLS6

There are good reasons that nobody of sane mind is out beating on an '81 or '82 Corvette on a road course.......but you cannot carry those arguments forward and apply them to the current models.




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vetteLT193

While the Corvette has had some lulls in its production overall it has always been a great Sports Car. As a testament to that I can drive my 1966 along side modern day cars and not only do I get along just fine... I'm pretty sure I get along better than I did with my 2003 Mustang GT that I just sold. I also have a 67 Mustang and it is a scary POS to drive on the road today which is why I parked it about 5 years ago.

As racing goes... racing is much more a part of Porsche culture. It is for many reasons we don't need to get in to here. The bottom line is the chances that a Porsche owner races is higher than that of a Corvette owner. It is fairly easy to sell a track prepped Porsche and not so easy to sell a track prepped Corvette. It's not because the Corvette makes a bad track car regardless of year. It's because the market for the average joe Corvette racer is limited.

However... there have been Corvette rally cars including a couple of C3's. Before the C5 came out the C4 was the most raced and best racer in the history of Corvette... Chevy wanted to continue and improve that.

Another reason you don't see dog old Corvettes at the track like you do Porsche is you can simply buy a newer one and get a better value. Why the heck race an old car when you can simply buy a lot nicer newer one that will end up costing less?

gofobroke

The post C4 generation of vettes which far outnumber Porsche GT3's have yet to prove they can still be there years later tearing it up. We will see. But based on my observations at the track I seriously doubt it. Corvettes have caught up performance wise. As have the Nissan GTR which whips GT3 butt at the road courses. What remains is durability, build quality and resale.

punky

"Caught up" has equivalent overtones about the comparison and that is not reality at all. Comparing equivalently priced Porsches and C7s yields performance deficiencies on the Porsche side that are gross and laughable in many categories.

The import lovers who expound about the German engineering and track prowess always run for the woods when it is time to explain why a Porsche that can hang with a C7 is going to cost double or triple. That is a very painfull reality for the Porsche boys as evidenced by their absurd attempts to rationalize this fact away.

johnglenntwo

The Ring and another VID from the out side as little as I view them I think I saw a comprehensive funny little wiggle thing going on?

gofobroke

That generally means you are on their butt in the braking zone and they are struggling to stay ahead just before they spin out or let you by.

99C5JA1

Plenty of C4's out there tearing it up at the events I have been to. They're going on 30 years. I see no reason why the C5/C6 won't continue this trend. Time will tell, but I don't see any of the C5's showing major problems yet.

Actually the carbon brakes on the C6Z cars are praised for being fade free despite repeated abuse. But like any car heat soak and tire issues will crop up with repeated abuse.

BlueOx

Why not? You're pounding your chest about a V10 Viper w/180 hp advantage barely beating the small v8 C7 in the 0-60 with narrow tires.

BlueOx

Yes...
http://gmauthority.com/blog/2013/08/...parison-video/

gofobroke

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That pretty much sums it up.

? [/QUOTE

Since when does changing oil, rotors, and brake pads year after year cost more then buying a new car to race? I've learned the $$ way that some cars are just not built to be raced regularly.

Just an opinion nothing more. Most Porsche folks will stick with the GT3.

JerriVette

I'm not quite sure I'd choose a new just released gt3 over a comparably priced soon to be released c7 z06.

When it does we can compare the two.

Until then I'd suggest a more appropriate comparison would be the z51 c7 MRC with NPP and competition seats versus either a cayman S or a 911..

The gt3 is more radical and focused which is why I suggest holding off that comparison until the corvette c7Z06 arrives.

I assume that's a Porsche that qualifies to have its empirical data compared with whereas the other porsche models are for the image and fine quality of leather.

911 is a truly a fine sports car..

Not as much my choice as the new z51 stingray and I would also purchase the unknown c7 z06 over the recently released gt3 just based off the superiority of corvette in past generations (z06 vs GT3 IMO )

Carnut12

The 991 Cab does not have the Hump you are talking about, shows how much you actually know tool bag. By the way lets not talk about discounts, the Vette will have rebates in less than 2 years after the Newness wears off, you can get $20K off a 2013 now if your a current vette owner. Show me where you can get a Cayman for $10K off sticker, your full of $hit, you have no idea what you are talking about.