W88fixer

For those who praise foreign car engineering and cut down domestic cars, here is some info that should challenge those views.

The June 2015 issue of Road & Track has an article by their engineering editor, Jason Camissa. It outlines a number of problems BMW is having with their 4.4L twin turbo N63 engine.

BMW has instituted programs to deal with a variety of issues. One of which is really strange and if I were an owner would be very irritated with. It’s electrical charging system depletes batteries so fast that they’re replaced at every oil change. Wonder who pays for that? I’m sure what is a $150 battery anywhere else is a $300 item at a BMW dealership.

Even if the warranty pays for it, would make me wonder if the battery would croak unexpectedly and even more prematurely than at each 10K mile oil change interval? Don

slickstick

Don't have my C7 yet but the C6 isn't much better... For a lot of people they eat up batteries every couple of years.

MikeLsx

I truly believe Europe engineering WAS better. But times have changed lately.

overall though, i think German luxury is best. if you want a luxury car.

rmorin1249

Agree. Audi is leading the pack now IMHO. Interior design as well as engineering. Their hybrid diesel race car is awesome.

b4i4getit

OK so the C7 has a memory wire trunk closer that does not work. The Z06 and Z51 have overheating problems when used at the track. There are panel fitment and orange peel problems. Thats just a few. What about GM engineering ?

Near Miss

Very difficult car to work on.

ben dover

Or poor execution.

BlueDevilZ51

I haven't had any of those issues..

BIG Dave

From what I've read on the Forum, I'm in the minority, but I've had GREAT luck with most of my Corvettes (except for my C4's). On the other hand, my C5, C6's and now the C7 have been VERY reliable. I've had Asian cars and my previous girlfriend had German cars and we were always dropping them off at the dealership to get things fixed. Not so with most of my Corvettes! From my C5 up through my C7, each car had no more than one trip to the dealership after the sale. IMHO, that's pretty darn good!

slick316

I traded my 2012 550i with the dreaded N63 motor for the Vette.

The battery draining issue was the least of the cars problems. Most of the issues stemmed from the engine bay getting as hot as the sun. I couldn't trust the car anymore and didn't want to keep it passed the warranty period. I do miss it however, it was quite luxurious and for how much it weighed, it was fast.

Who knows how the C7 will hold up, it has a quite a bit of tech in it, and that's what seems like the issue is with German cars, too much new tech and electronics.

Regardless, I'm happy with the C7

GMuffley

I bought my C6Z in May of 2007 and it still has the original battery.

Dan12

Have you ever started the car?

OC Sadler

[QUOTE=W88fixer;1589648591]For those who praise foreign car engineering and cut down domestic cars, here is some info that should challenge those views.






Have the British, Germans or Italians ever put a man on the moon???

BIG Dave

Funny you should say that, I always tell people I only buys cars from countries that have the technical knowledge to put a man on the moon!

W88fixer

You’ve misquoted me. I didn’t say that. Don

LT1 Z51

The "average" new car has a battery warranty rate of just under 50% (meaning that just under 50% of batteries die within 3 years). Some car lines (Jeep Grand Cherokees were bad for a while) have a 70% warranty rate.

The reason isn't poor engineering, the reason is WE HAVE TOO MUCH ELECTRICAL STUFF IN THE CAR!

It's a 12V battery with LIMITED AMP support. Cold cranking amps are only for the start, once running the amperage drops a lot. Add to that your car basically needs your alternator to power the system (it raises the cars voltage to 14.7 or sometimes 15.3 volts to lower amperage draw!) The alternator also puts parasitic drain on the engine so "intelligent" power management systems (which all new cars have) attempt to use the alternator only when the BATTERY can't support the 14.7 volts!

How do they do all this, overcharging the battery during use, mind you again that your battery is being pummeled by the car, and it is slow to react, the alternator doesn't just charge the battery it tries to handle dynamic transient loads (like when you make a quick maneuver with your electric steering and you draw 60-100 amps from the system for 500 ms).

I could go on all day about batteries, alternators, amp usage, and the like in cars. But one thing needs to be said, until we move to a 42 volt (36 + 6 volt margin) or a true 48 volt system we are going to have significant issues in this regard.

You know what type of car doesn't have battery issues.... A HYBRID. That's it, everyone else is boned.

Vegas1500

All manufacturers have issues with engineering. To compare to one doesn't really mean much. I have owned Asian , German and American cars. Some good and some with issues. I've had GM cars that fail engines at 1000 miles. Gm cars that fail transmission 1 month out of warranty and no help offered. I had a Toyota that had corrosion on the block causing the head gaskets not to seal, covered the repair well out of warranty....they are machines, they ALL have good and bad things that can fail at any given time.

hungryhorace

possibly important to note the very strict emissions rules we have in europe so there are bound to be gremlins/issues introduced with complexity. I consider new cars as disposables, no longer can you buy a car and expect 20 years or so to get a return on your investment. This is backed up by the finance purchase models

As someone above said we have too much in cars but whose fault is it? Ours for demanding/expecting more or marketing for saying we expect/demand more?

Electric windows, central locking, climate control, adaptive cruise control, 20 billion airbags, tcs, ecs, ebs, infotainment, mood lighting, heated seats etc all utterly pointless but some with a little merit. 20 CPU's doing various jobs, lights that are sealed so if a bulb goes you have to replace the unit. Citroen (doubt they are over in USA) designed their cars so if you need to change a headlight bulb you had to remove the front end of the car to get the unit out to get to the socket!

Grass is greener and all that, I own the last true simplistic BMW the E39 M5. Everything is designed to be easy to engineer/repair/fix/get to. Clear to see its the last of the BMW era before accountants realised there is more money in servicing and parts than in whole car sales.

Of course, all those utterly pointless things I do like to have but can live without them. I have a classic mini cooper that has no AC, no ABS, no TCS, it has a ****** old fm radio and manual window winders - its horrid to drive in the summer on long distances!

Its funny to watch as each generation car has to have something to differentiate from the last which means more toys to go wrong. Also can someone explain when on earth self opening/closing doors were ever required expect for those with disabilities?!

hungryhorace

it will be interesting to see how the LT's longevity is vs the older style LS's

hungryhorace

Actually yes, we put Neil Armstrong on it!