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OP you are in a unique position to make some dreams come true and pocket some extra cash.
Buy back the salvage title. Pull the engine and advertise it on PerformanceTrucks.net. Back when I had my Silverado (regular cab) I was wanting to do a 6.2L swap. I would have paid $8k for the complete engine without batting an eye.
Do they same for the transmission but I'm not sure what the market would be for that.
Finally advertise the roller on racingjunk.com. Probably could get $10-$15k from someone looking to do a promo or outlaw build.
I've been in the airplane business for many years, although not a "structures" guy (Avionics) many, many airplane structures have and are currently being repaired for cracks, bird strikes, and ramp damage, time fatigue etc etc. They are all aluminium, alloys and carbon structures etc.. I think on our cars (Corvettes) because it's such an unusual repair with engineering costs, setup costs, and special equipment the costs FAR outweigh the value of the car. Maybe a 400K Ferrari or Indy Car frame repair would be cost effective, but I doubt a 75/90K street car would even come close. JMHO -- tom
So what is really being said here? The Corvette is disposable if you have any frame damage in an accident? Cant the frame just be replaced? They do frame off restorations all day long. [/url]
It's not "Can it be done?" -- it's "is it cost effective to be done?"
C7 isn't like the cars of old where you remove a dozen bolts and a couple brake/gas lines and lift the car off the frame. It would, literally, be like disassembling the entire car, (including the miles of wiring) and putting it back together piece by piece on the new frame.
I'm not even going to guess how many hours that would take, but at $150+/hour, you can see where it quickly will total the car just on labor costs alone.
And, as others have said, it's not the ability to repair, but rather the resulting liability if something would fail in the future. How much risk of a multi-million $ lawsuit would a deep-pockets company like GM be willing to take, just to save a measly $20k or so on a total (which is going to be paid by the insurance company anyway)?
A one-off irreplaceable vehicle? Sure.
A mass-produced car that you can walk down the street and buy an exact duplicate right off any GM lot? Not worth the effort.
.... Frame is made of multiple sections welded together and the main connection points are made out of cast aluminum, and all the welds failed at the cast aluminum places. Because you cannot weld cast aluminum.
Know you were just quoting what was said and can't speak to why this frame cracked or how much it was stressed but cast aluminum (unlike cast steel) is welded all the time. Just need to have the correct filler material and with aluminum there are many choices. It's not like cast iron that is best brazed not welded.
Below are some pics of the C7 MIG fillet welds on a cast aluminum frame section.
There are 3 pics that follow that I took on welding a cast aluminum cylinder head we got from Richard Petty Diving Experience. Unlike the race team, they have a lot of cars, use race car type engines but do rebuilds and head repairs to keep costs down.
These pics are from my book published by CarTech in 2015 called "Weld Like a Pro." They were also used in my prior 2012 CarTech book, "Advanced Automotive Welding." It also covers the GM recommended procedures on how to repair a C6 Z06 aluminum frame, which unlike the C7 frame, uses long hydroformed sections.
Agree with your comment, before I would trust the welds, need to find someone who knows how to weld aluminum and ICAR certifies folks to do that for auto repair. It's not every body shop.
MIG Fillet Welds to cast aluminum C7 Frame member.
Cylinder head from Richard petty Driving Experiance Engne needeng repair.
Need to preheat the thick cylinder head. Can be done in a large barbecue grill! TIG torch and the proper filler rod are being used.
Finished weld needs grinding and machining to complete the head repair.
Know you were just quoting what was said and can't speak to why this frame cracked or how much it was stressed but cast aluminum (unlike cast steel) is welded all the time. Just need to have the correct filler material and with aluminum there are many choices. It's not like cast iron that is best brazed not welded.
Below are some pics of the C7 MIG fillet welds on a cast aluminum frame section.
There are 3 pics that follow That I took on welding a cast aluminum cylinder head we got from Richard Petty Diving Experience. Unlike the race team, they have a lot of cars, use race car type engines but do rebuilds and head repairs to keep costs down.
These are from a a book published by CarTech in 2015 called "Weld Like a Pro." They were also used in a prior 2012 CarTech book, "Advanced Automotive Welding." It also covers the GM recommended procedures on how to repair a C6 Z06 Aluminum frame, which is not like the C7, it uses long hydroformed sections.
Agree before i would trust the welds, need to find someone who knows how to weld aluminum and ICAR certifies folks to do that. It's not every body shop.
MIG Fillet Welds to cast aluminum C7 Frame member.
Cylinder head from Richard petty Driving Experiance Engne needeng repair.
Need to preheat the thick cylinder head. Can be done in a large barbecue grill! TIG torch and the proper filler rod are being used.
Finished weld needs grinding and machining to finish.
"you can't weld cast aluminum". Hmmm... how does the frame get constructed again? Pretty sure it's welded.
Also, "The frame welds failed at every weld point within the cars' frame" -- from a low-speed impact?
"car was never tested"?
I would be leery of a repaired frame C7 too, but the above story sounds like utter garbage -- I think Cherry is going nuclear with the hyperbole, hoping to hit the lawsuit lottery.
I read the same discrepancies but I chalked it up to a person that is not a mechanical engineer; just a lady Corvette owner who is suffering from the loss of her son in law and her own injuries, in a crash in which she expected the car to stay intact.
My 2014 conv got hit by 18 wheeler in the left rear corner. It was his left front wheel lug nuts that did most of the damage; took out trans cooler and rear corner of body. $8000 worth of damage at end; cracked the rear cross member weld to frame also. I didn't know all this at the time. I was on vacation at time and just traded it in on a 2016 conv that dealer had on lot. I figured life is too short to fool around with 4 months of repairs, etc. I may have lost a bit of money on trade in value, but I didn't lose a day of my vaction and driving a corvette. If crack can't be repaired, no way would I expose myself and wife to possible failure of a repair. JMHO.
So what is really being said here? The Corvette is disposable if you have any frame damage in an accident? Cant the frame just be replaced? They do frame off restorations all day long. I would contact a custom yacht yard such as Burger Yachts in Wisconsin they weld and repair Aluminium super structures all day long. If they can weld these when the owners poke holes in them they can indeed weld a C7 frame. I know the owner. PM me. http://www.burgerboat.com/
Even though the C4, C5, C6, and the C7 have a "space frame" they are not your typical "body on frame" vehicles, but are unibody cars since the "frame" is an integral part of the body.
You can't just remove a few bolt's and lift the body off the "frame" in order to repair the frame.
It's not "Can it be done?" -- it's "is it cost effective to be done?"
C7 isn't like the cars of old where you remove a dozen bolts and a couple brake/gas lines and lift the car off the frame. It would, literally, be like disassembling the entire car, (including the miles of wiring) and putting it back together piece by piece on the new frame.
I'm not even going to guess how many hours that would take, but at $150+/hour, you can see where it quickly will total the car just on labor costs alone.
I made some similar points above. As a couple of others also have commented, almost anything can be done, but it needs to be done cost-effectively, even aside from the liabiiity questions that you also mentioned.
Even though the C4, C5, C6, and the C7 have a "space frame" they are not your typical "body on frame" vehicles, but are unibody cars since the "frame" is an integral part of the body.
You can't just remove a few bolt's and lift the body off the "frame" in order to repair the frame.
The body is dropped on the frame at the plant not to much else except the tranny and rear diff and suspension is attached once the motor is removed.
I read the same discrepancies but I chalked it up to a person that is not a mechanical engineer; just a Corvette owner who is suffering from the loss of her son in law and her own injuries, in a crash in which she expected the car to stay intact.
"not a mechanical engineer" is not the same as "making wild and false accusations about what happened".
If she isn't an engineer, then she shouldn't make wild illogical claims about engineering stresses, procedures, and outcomes.
OP you are in a unique position to make some dreams come true and pocket some extra cash.
Buy back the salvage title. Pull the engine and advertise it on PerformanceTrucks.net. Back when I had my Silverado (regular cab) I was wanting to do a 6.2L swap. I would have paid $8k for the complete engine without batting an eye.
Do they same for the transmission but I'm not sure what the market would be for that.
Finally advertise the roller on racingjunk.com. Probably could get $10-$15k from someone looking to do a promo or outlaw build.
I have thought about this, it will just remain to be seen what the salvage price may be for the car. One other big problem is that I don't have a shop or the tools (like an engine hoist) to remove the engine myself. I imagine it has been done with leaving the removal to the buyer.
The body is dropped on the frame at the plant not to much else except the tranny and rear diff and suspension is attached once the motor is removed.
Incorrect.
The Body and Frame are pre-assembled as a unit, and are dropped onto the driveline assembly.
The damage in question is to the frame, not the driveline/powerplant assembly.
The aluminum frame (the part that was damaged in the OP's case) has hundreds of parts bolted and glued to it at the factory before it is 'married' to the powerplant assembly (sometimes called the Powerplant Frame or PPF) at the end of the production line.
I guess I should have highlighted the text on the estimate that says: Per GM engineering the rear transmission tunnel section (cast aluminum) is not available for purchase. Replacing part compromises the structure of the vehicle.
But wait for it.....I just got off the phone with my insurance company and they feel that GM does offer the parts. This is going to be quite the experience for a few days. Anyone got a good crystal ball?
I guess I should have highlighted the text on the estimate that says: Per GM engineering the rear transmission tunnel section (cast aluminum) is not available for purchase. Replacing part compromises the structure of the vehicle.
But wait for it.....I just got off the phone with my insurance company and they feel that GM does offer the parts. This is going to be quite the experience for a few days. Anyone got a good crystal ball?
Im guessing its going to be to cut off and replace the whole rear section of the frame. They always make weldable repair sections on a frame for collision repair.
I had the same question but one thread suggests this doesn't include all the labor necessary to disassemble and reassemble all the parts necessary to make the car whole.
I guess I should have highlighted the text on the estimate that says: Per GM engineering the rear transmission tunnel section (cast aluminum) is not available for purchase. Replacing part compromises the structure of the vehicle.
But wait for it.....I just got off the phone with my insurance company and they feel that GM does offer the parts. This is going to be quite the experience for a few days. Anyone got a good crystal ball?
You have taken some nice pictures and I would usually NOT make a suggestion without seeing the parts (and never make recommendations unless consulting, only suggestions!)
From what you show, the area near the crack (that I can see it your first post) still has the three spot welds visible and almost all intact. They are joining aluminum to the aluminum below that top plate. There is little metal removed from the area. A skilled welder can grind out the crack so no crack is visible and make a weld repair. He (or she; have met the gal on all girls garage and she is a good welder!) could add some additional reinforcement. Frankly military ships use aluminum superstructure and some welds are made overhead all the time!
Would GM tell you that is OK. Doubt it. Would I think that is a better repair than removing all welds, installing a new casting and rewilding all the joints? Considering alignment, distortion etc-I would think so.
Get what the insurance company offers then find a body shop that is certified for aluminum welding (lots of trucks using aluminum today etc) and get their opinion. Because of the location the weld repair can be checked periodically but doubt it would be a problem.
Just my $0.02.
Keep in mind a salvage title makes it difficult to sell the car so that would NOT be my 1st choice.
08-23-2017, 01:33 PM
