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Those of you using Mityvac to pressure bleed from the master, be aware that Mityvacs metal cap WILL ruin your master cylinder reservoir. It makes your stock plastic cap not lock on correctly. I am 100% positive that there will be people here who will argue with me on this and swear theirs is fine, I will not respond to you. I thought the same thing, until I bought a new reservoir and tested the OEM cap on it. Night and day different than the reservoir I used the Mityvac cap on. The cap was locked on, but still felt loose after using the metal cap. On the new one, when it's locked on, its clearly locked on. It has a clear feel that it locked into place, the old reservoir has no feel and doesn't feel like it locks. This is extremely important to minimize moisture in your brake fluid.
I contacted Mityvac about this, they sent me a plastic version of the metal cap. They said the plastic version would work better, nope. The plastic one also goes on so tight that it will mess up the reservoir too. I went back to bleeding the old school way with someone pumping the brake pedal. Not worth ruining another master cylinder reservoir.
Also, I tried explaining to the Mityvak rep that they just need a thinner rubber gasket, and it would work, the person didn't seem interested in a solution. So, if you can find a rubber gasket that's thinner than the thin one, they provide you with, it would probably work great.
I've been using this bleeder successfully on my Harley brakes and clutch. I am considering doing the C7 myself soon. This one is designed to draw fluid from the large tank attached to the reservoir. I read in the factory service manual that the ABS pump is circulated at some point to move the old fluid out of it. Has anyone done this step? My Autel diag tool can activate the ABS pump.
Bingo, that is why I use a pressure bleeder. If all one is trying to do is replace brake fluid on a working car, you can just ignore the bubbles you see in the clear hose. They are in the hose only so no effect on the car. If you suck out a 3/4 reservoir amount of fluid at each caliper, you know you have replaced all the fluid. But, if you are trying to fix a problem, say bleeding after replacing a caliper, the bubbles in the hose make it hard to be sure you have done a complete bleed. Edit to ad; A crap I didn't click 'quote'. The above is a reply to aklim's post, "Way I see it, you can get a good seal on the bleeder screw but if it has to be open to suck fluid out, how do you keep a seal around the screw threads?"
I have used the Motive on old and new cars with success. I use it a bit different than the directions. The directions say to put fluid in the Motive bleeder and pump the fluid under about 10 psi into the reservoir. This way the reservoir will be totally full and a bit difficult to remove the cap without spilling fluid. I don't put any fluid in the Motive bleeder. I make sure the reservoir is full,,,, and that it doesn't run dry,,, and then bleed fluid from each wheel. Some people say to start from the farthest bleeder, some say to start from the closest bleeder,,,, hummmm. I do both. Start from the farthest bleeder and work to the closest,, then go back in reverse order to the farthest bleeder.
DON"T RUN THE RESERVOIR DRY! Easy peasy. Fool proof!
I don't know how the physics works for sure, but it just seems to me, it's better to push the fluid from the reservoir out the bleeder screws than try to suck it out. I have used the Motive bleeder on 1961 cars to 2014 cars and it works very well.
The operation is the same whether you lower the pressure at the caliper or raise the pressure at the master cylinder reservoir. You end up with a higher pressure at the reservoir and a lower pressure at the caliper either way. The disadvantage of the vacuum system is it tends to pull air around the threads of the bleeder screws so you see more air coming out than is actually inside the brake line. I had a compressed air-powered vacuum bleeder but it tended to suck the brake fluid out of the master so quick it was hard to keep filled even with a person ready to add fluid watching it. One squeeze on the handle and the fluid in the master would disappear.
Not sure it's the same. Air bubbles are, always, on top of the liquid. Sucking from the bottom will always suck the liquid from the bottom. Pushing from the top, has a chance to push some of the air bubbles out. Air bubbles move slowly through a semi thick liquid, and can be forced through small tubes with pressure behind them.
This way the reservoir will be totally full and a bit difficult to remove the cap without spilling fluid. I don't put any fluid in the Motive bleeder.
I make sure the reservoir is full,,,, and that it doesn't run dry,,, and then bleed fluid from each wheel.
Some people say to start from the farthest bleeder, some say to start from the closest bleeder,
,,, hummmm. I do both. Start from the farthest bleeder and work to the closest,, then go back in reverse order to the farthest bleeder.
DON"T RUN THE RESERVOIR DRY! Easy peasy. Fool proof!
How so? I depressurize it and the fluid goes back into the bleeder. If you insist on it being perfectly dry, open the bleeder screw before you put the wheel back and gravity bleed the fluid and some gap will happen at the top of the brake fluid reservoir. Besides, if any fluid spills, I really don't care. A gallon of water and all is cleared.
How? I am at the bleeder not watching the reservoir. What happens when it runs low? Depressurize the system, fill it and start over by pressurizing the system again?
I thought the order is RR, LF, LR, RF?
Why? If you suck out the reservoir and flush enough fluid, why do it again in reverse order or whatever order?
I don't know if that is easy. Sounds like a Royal PITA to me. How much fluid is in the reservoir? Not a lot. Probably under a pint if I had to guess. I follow the instructions and I have a half a gallon in the Motive Bleeder jug. That won't run out anytime soon. On my 3rd caliper, I just check it. I honestly don't see the reason for your procedure. Any spilled brake fluid can be cleaned off with water or brake cleaner.
I use the Motive pressurized system along with the Autel MX808 to open the valves on the ABS system. Not bleeding the ABS leaves the module with old fluid. The bleed order I use is RR - LR - RF - LF but I've also seen guys use the opposite order too. By the time you've flush a quart of fluid through the system, I'm relatively sure there isn't any old brake fluid left in the system
I use the Motive pressurized system along with the Autel MX808 to open the valves on the ABS system. Not bleeding the ABS leaves the module with old fluid. The bleed order I use is RR - LR - RF - LF but I've also seen guys use the opposite order too. By the time you've flush a quart of fluid through the system, I'm relatively sure there isn't any old brake fluid left in the system
My thoughts exactly. Not circulating the ABS pump could still leave air or contamination in the remaining fluid.
If you don't have the Autel,,,, I wonder if you bled the brake system and then drove the car, activating the ABS, and bled it again, would that accomplish the same thing?
If you don't have the Autel,,,, I wonder if you bled the brake system and then drove the car, activating the ABS, and bled it again, would that accomplish the same thing?
Yes, as long as you activated the ABS long enough to push the fluid out.
How so? I depressurize it and the fluid goes back into the bleeder. If you insist on it being perfectly dry, open the bleeder screw before you put the wheel back and gravity bleed the fluid and some gap will happen at the top of the brake fluid reservoir. Besides, if any fluid spills, I really don't care. A gallon of water and all is cleared.
How? I am at the bleeder not watching the reservoir. What happens when it runs low? Depressurize the system, fill it and start over by pressurizing the system again?
I thought the order is RR, LF, LR, RF?
Why? If you suck out the reservoir and flush enough fluid, why do it again in reverse order or whatever order?
I don't know if that is easy. Sounds like a Royal PITA to me. How much fluid is in the reservoir? Not a lot. Probably under a pint if I had to guess. I follow the instructions and I have a half a gallon in the Motive Bleeder jug. That won't run out anytime soon. On my 3rd caliper, I just check it. I honestly don't see the reason for your procedure. Any spilled brake fluid can be cleaned off with water or brake cleaner.
I do the same thing kodpkd does. It keeps everything clean. If you're just bleeding the brakes, it's not that bad. Yes, you have to depressurize the tank, remove the cap, fill the res, and then pump the tank back up. Usually, I have to do it 4 times, 1 at each wheel. It allows me to bleed the brakes without worrying about brake fluid spilling in the engine bay when I am working by myself at the caliper. Once you get the hang of it, you know exactly when to stop before the res goes dry.
To clarify, I no longer do this process because motive can't make a cap that doesn't destroy the OEM reservoir. I'm back to old school 2 person bleeding now.
Be careful with brake fluid spills, its high corrosive. I would not just use water if you get it on any painted surfaces.
Are you saying that you store a half gallon of brake fluid in the Motive jug and then use it when you need it?
I had the same discussion about bleeding brakes on a C3. Everybody said to start at the back then do the front in a certain order. If you understand how the system is designed it makes NO difference what so ever what end you start on, in the C3. The two systems are totally two independent systems. No fluid or air can go between the two systems.
I did the same thing bleeding the dual calipers on each wheel. Outside, inside, outside inside on each wheel. The way it's designed there is as much chance air can get to the other side, either way you do it. It doesn't take much fluid each time once all the lines are clear. A rubber hammer helps also.
I do the same thing kodpkd does. It keeps everything clean. If you're just bleeding the brakes, it's not that bad. Yes, you have to depressurize the tank, remove the cap, fill the res, and then pump the tank back up. Usually, I have to do it 4 times, 1 at each wheel. It allows me to bleed the brakes without worrying about brake fluid spilling in the engine bay when I am working by myself at the caliper. Once you get the hang of it, you know exactly when to stop before the res goes dry.
To clarify, I no longer do this process because motive can't make a cap that doesn't destroy the OEM reservoir. I'm back to old school 2 person bleeding now.
Be careful with brake fluid spills, its high corrosive. I would not just use water if you get it on any painted surfaces.
Are you saying that you store a half gallon of brake fluid in the Motive jug and then use it when you need it?
I really haven't had that much of a spill. I have probably had a few drops at worst. I depressurize at the tank before I am done. After which, just open the bleeder screw and gravity bleed to get the level down before screwing it in. While I might have an idea of when the reservoir goes dry, I don't know that I want to risk it. Not sure what the reward for the risk of having to redo would be? I guess I prefer to "set it and forget it".
I don't screw it in till it clicks. Just firm enough seems to work the last couple of times. So far, the plastic cap seems to work and the thing clicks on when I am done.
What do you use? I haven't gotten it on painted surfaces but maybe a couple drops on the reservoir. I towel it off and then pour some warm water to rinse it off. After the job, I take it to the car wash and let the jets go to town on the car to wash the calipers off.
Absolutely not. On brake flush day, I have 2 gallons of DOT4 LV around. This does the 3 cars, UTV and trike. Sure, some is left over but who cares? Better than having to stop halfway and drive to the parts store to get more. At the end of the job, top everything off and dump the fluid. I only keep fluid that isn't opened. IF the foil is broken, I dump it.
The next time I'm going to bleed the system with my Motive system, yes I have tried both metal and their plastic caps, neither really works well. Im going to try to modify a stock cap by adding a coupler to it and see if it will work.
But I just might be stuck in just using a thinner rubber gasket on the Motive bleeder like I finally did but still could not tighten the cap all the way.
Already got stuck in replacing the reservoir once due to the damage the metal cap.
If i had the ability and equipment I would just re-machine the metal cap and remove their reservoir destroying notches.
The next time I'm going to bleed the system with my Motive system, yes I have tried both metal and their plastic caps, neither really works well. Im going to try to modify a stock cap by adding a coupler to it and see if it will work.
But I just might be stuck in just using a thinner rubber gasket on the Motive bleeder like I finally did but still could not tighten the cap all the way.
Already got stuck in replacing the reservoir once due to the damage the metal cap.
If i had the ability and equipment I would just re-machine the metal cap and remove their reservoir destroying notches.
I have found rubber material at the local hydraulic hose company. They can fabricate most anything along the lines of gasket materials.
The cap doesn't have to be that tight. You don't need it to click. 10psi is all that is needed.
If you don't put fluid in the Motive tank, you don't need to worry about a little leak.
The cap doesn't have to be that tight. You don't need it to click. 10psi is all that is needed.
If you don't put fluid in the Motive tank, you don't need to worry about a little leak.
I put fluid and I don't have a puddle or even a few drops. I purposely don't have a rag so I can see it leak or not.
I really haven't had that much of a spill. I have probably had a few drops at worst. I depressurize at the tank before I am done. After which, just open the bleeder screw and gravity bleed to get the level down before screwing it in. While I might have an idea of when the reservoir goes dry, I don't know that I want to risk it. Not sure what the reward for the risk of having to redo would be? I guess I prefer to "set it and forget it".
I don't screw it in till it clicks. Just firm enough seems to work the last couple of times. So far, the plastic cap seems to work and the thing clicks on when I am done.
What do you use? I haven't gotten it on painted surfaces but maybe a couple drops on the reservoir. I towel it off and then pour some warm water to rinse it off. After the job, I take it to the car wash and let the jets go to town on the car to wash the calipers off.
Absolutely not. On brake flush day, I have 2 gallons of DOT4 LV around. This does the 3 cars, UTV and trike. Sure, some is left over but who cares? Better than having to stop halfway and drive to the parts store to get more. At the end of the job, top everything off and dump the fluid. I only keep fluid that isn't opened. IF the foil is broken, I dump it.
Doing it my way just ensures that there is zero chance of brake fluid spilling in the engine bay anywhere. I just do it this way as a precaution. I spilled brake fluid many years ago on down the firewall of a car and never again, just not worth the risk of clean up to me.
In regard to the cap, I am guilty of turning the motive cap on hard enough that it didn't leak. This is probably what ruined my reservoir. I tried putting it on snug, but it would leak unless I held the cap, and I was trying to do this as a one-person job.
I thought my OEM cap was good until I felt someone else while working on their car. Made me realize my reservoir was ruined and it wasn't sealing so I replaced it. Night and day different with the new one.
I would agree with how you cleaned up the brake fluid. Personally, if I get it on paint, I clean it asap with dawn because it breaks down oils and then rinse well and dry. Don't know if that's proper or not, but it's worked for me.
Glad to hear you aren't storing brake fluid in the motive jug lol
