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How much FASTER around any given track is the Ford GT? Yes it looks cool, yes it's got lots of spacey materials. But if it's such a race car, where are the lap times?
I don't doubt it'll be a little faster than a C7Z. But nothing I've seen about this car makes me believe it'll be "in another league." I'd be happy to be proven wrong, but I'm just not as impressed with the GT so far as some people.
We have a car costing $450,000 and a car costing $100,000 and they aren't that far apart in performance.
"Performance" isn't the only measurement of a car.
And they race against each other in International GT racing. What's silly about that?
What Snorman said...
There isn't any way to compare a race car to a street car.
The C7R isn't anything similar to a Vette you can buy from a Chevrolet dealer this afternoon.
Originally Posted by Hit Apex
Let's hope the street going version sounds better than the race car. The race car farts all over the track.
You can't compare the 2017 Z to even the 2005/2006 FGT, leave alone the 2017. They are not in the same league, no matter which way you slice it. Even before I swapped the blower to a 4-liter bolt-on Whipple...it was a beast at a severely underrated 550 HP (most dyno at 570-600 RW stock).
Once you drive an FGT...you don't really want to drive anything else.
If that thing was a DD...I'd DD it every day.
I love my Z, (it's one of my fav DD's) but this car is in a different class in every way. Lambo's and Ferrari's aren't even in this class. Ford built the perfect car in each iteration of the FGT from the 60's until today.
I have to disagree with you on a few points.
I own a 2006 Ford GT, plus a Ferrari 458 Italia, a Lamborghini Murcielago V12, two Viper GTS and a 2015 Corvette Z06 vert.
The Ferrari 458 Italia and the Ford GT are the two best driving cars available, in my experience. Driven back-to-back they are very similar dynamically, so I do believe both cars are, in fact, in the same league.
The FGT makes more torque than the 458 Italia, but in my opinion the Ferrari 458 Italia is more controllable, has more precise steering placement and does not wag its tail as much as the FGT under heavy throttle. When hot, the Ferrari's carbon-ceramic Brembo brakes are superior brakes to the FGT as well.
Both the FGT (crank driven blower) and Ferrari 458 Italia (naturally aspirated) produce very similar horsepower numbers, just south of 600 hp, but the 458 revs to 9,000 rpm and is incomparable in exhaust note quality.
The Murcielago is no slouch in the horsepower league either with nearly 600 hp from the 6.2 liter V12, but it is a larger car physically & dimensionally, must be revved to 6,000 rpm and up, to produce lots of power.
My 2015 Z06 lays down impressive numbers, is super fun to drive and is a fantastic value but the Ford GT and the Ferrari 458 are simply easier cars to drive quickly, with higher confidence levels, for the average sports car enthusiast and driver.
Mid-engine cars simply have better balance and steer more precisely, in my opinion; and there is more to a daily-use sports car than raw horsepower numbers and straight line performance.
The 458 is worth having simply for the way it sounds, it is a mechanical virtuoso! If I had the choice of any sports car I wanted it would be the 458! However, I am happy and content with the Z06, dollar for dollar it is a league of its own for value. It is truly America's sports car for overall value performance. I had my first ride in a Ferrari in 1967 and I still remember it fondly, they are great cars.
I have 2 2005 FGT's...and a bunch more cars, including a '16 A8Z.
It cost me 12k to get my white FGT up to over 1050 HP...
That car is worth a cool 300k every day of the week...and my virgin no-milage yellow FGT about 400k. I paid well under half of that for each of them when I bought them years ago.
I wasn't able to obtain a 2017...I tried and am still trying.
You can't compare the 2017 Z to even the 2005/2006 FGT, leave alone the 2017. They are not in the same league, no matter which way you slice it. Even before I swapped the blower to a 4-liter bolt-on Whipple...it was a beast at a severely underrated 550 HP (most dyno at 570-600 RW stock).
Once you drive an FGT...you don't really want to drive anything else.
If that thing was a DD...I'd DD it every day.
I love my Z, (it's one of my fav DD's) but this car is in a different class in every way. Lambo's and Ferrari's aren't even in this class. Ford built the perfect car in each iteration of the FGT from the 60's until today.
There is a reason that FGT's are worth a shitpile more money today than they were new, 12 years ago...and it's not like they only built a few...they built over 4000.
If you were lucky enough to get a 2017 FGT...you'd be doubling your money the instant you got it. And it's still just a ******* Ford, built in Canada!
Well stated and the FGT is what has most likely prompted GM to go mid engine to compete in the same class. However track results are track results and if the current Z06 and ZR-1 are close than that is cool for those of us that can't afford a $200-300K car. I have always like the FGT. I remember when they came out, and how much they cost should have bought one gen because they were within a price range I could swing. But those same cars have doubled in price and they are 10+ years old.
I own a 2006 Ford GT, plus a Ferrari 458 Italia, a Lamborghini Murcielago V12, two Viper GTS and a 2015 Corvette Z06 vert.
The Ferrari 458 Italia and the Ford GT are the two best driving cars available, in my experience. Driven back-to-back they are very similar dynamically, so I do believe both cars are, in fact, in the same league.
The FGT makes more torque than the 458 Italia, but in my opinion the Ferrari 458 Italia is more controllable, has more precise steering placement and does not wag its tail as much as the FGT under heavy throttle. When hot, the Ferrari's carbon-ceramic Brembo brakes are superior brakes to the FGT as well.
Both the FGT (crank driven blower) and Ferrari 458 Italia (naturally aspirated) produce very similar horsepower numbers, just south of 600 hp, but the 458 revs to 9,000 rpm and is incomparable in exhaust note quality.
The Murcielago is no slouch in the horsepower league either with nearly 600 hp from the 6.2 liter V12, but it is a larger car physically & dimensionally, must be revved to 6,000 rpm and up, to produce lots of power.
My 2015 Z06 lays down impressive numbers, is super fun to drive and is a fantastic value but the Ford GT and the Ferrari 458 are simply easier cars to drive quickly, with higher confidence levels, for the average sports car enthusiast and driver.
Mid-engine cars simply have better balance and steer more precisely, in my opinion; and there is more to a daily-use sports car than raw horsepower numbers and straight line performance.
I remember when they came out, and how much they cost should have bought one gen because they were within a price range I could swing.
2 things stopped me at the time: the retro look and the engine.
It seemed the exterior was too close to the original racecar of the 60's aesthetically.
And secondly (and most importantly), the SC engine was, essentially, pulled out of my 2001 Ford Lightening (loved that damn truck ).
I felt it should have had an NA, not FI (it certainly deserved one).
At the time, Ford had a V10 (6L?) it could have used, but decided to go to the parts bin instead.
In retrospect, I should have bought one anyway, sold it and bought a 458 with the proceeds.
I own a 2006 Ford GT, plus a Ferrari 458 Italia, a Lamborghini Murcielago V12, two Viper GTS and a 2015 Corvette Z06 vert.
The Ferrari 458 Italia and the Ford GT are the two best driving cars available, in my experience. Driven back-to-back they are very similar dynamically, so I do believe both cars are, in fact, in the same league.
The FGT makes more torque than the 458 Italia, but in my opinion the Ferrari 458 Italia is more controllable, has more precise steering placement and does not wag its tail as much as the FGT under heavy throttle. When hot, the Ferrari's carbon-ceramic Brembo brakes are superior brakes to the FGT as well.
Both the FGT (crank driven blower) and Ferrari 458 Italia (naturally aspirated) produce very similar horsepower numbers, just south of 600 hp, but the 458 revs to 9,000 rpm and is incomparable in exhaust note quality.
The Murcielago is no slouch in the horsepower league either with nearly 600 hp from the 6.2 liter V12, but it is a larger car physically & dimensionally, must be revved to 6,000 rpm and up, to produce lots of power.
My 2015 Z06 lays down impressive numbers, is super fun to drive and is a fantastic value but the Ford GT and the Ferrari 458 are simply easier cars to drive quickly, with higher confidence levels, for the average sports car enthusiast and driver.
Mid-engine cars simply have better balance and steer more precisely, in my opinion; and there is more to a daily-use sports car than raw horsepower numbers and straight line performance.
Cheers - Dave
Although I love all cars and yours of course I have recently got into retro rods & resto rods...If these GT's and 458's are so amazing and easy to drive fast then why does a ZL1 1LE beat them around Laguna Seca or any other track? Just asking so please educate me.
Although I love all cars and yours of course I have recently got into retro rods & resto rods...If these GT's and 458's are so amazing and easy to drive fast then why does a ZL1 1LE beat them around Laguna Seca or any other track? Just asking so please educate me.
Greg
Because unlike the Zl1 or the 1le they do everything really well not just going fast around a track.
I own a 2006 Ford GT, plus a Ferrari 458 Italia, a Lamborghini Murcielago V12, two Viper GTS and a 2015 Corvette Z06 vert.
The Ferrari 458 Italia and the Ford GT are the two best driving cars available, in my experience. Driven back-to-back they are very similar dynamically, so I do believe both cars are, in fact, in the same league.
The FGT makes more torque than the 458 Italia, but in my opinion the Ferrari 458 Italia is more controllable, has more precise steering placement and does not wag its tail as much as the FGT under heavy throttle. When hot, the Ferrari's carbon-ceramic Brembo brakes are superior brakes to the FGT as well.
Both the FGT (crank driven blower) and Ferrari 458 Italia (naturally aspirated) produce very similar horsepower numbers, just south of 600 hp, but the 458 revs to 9,000 rpm and is incomparable in exhaust note quality.
The Murcielago is no slouch in the horsepower league either with nearly 600 hp from the 6.2 liter V12, but it is a larger car physically & dimensionally, must be revved to 6,000 rpm and up, to produce lots of power.
My 2015 Z06 lays down impressive numbers, is super fun to drive and is a fantastic value but the Ford GT and the Ferrari 458 are simply easier cars to drive quickly, with higher confidence levels, for the average sports car enthusiast and driver.
Mid-engine cars simply have better balance and steer more precisely, in my opinion; and there is more to a daily-use sports car than raw horsepower numbers and straight line performance.
Cheers - Dave
Damn, you could sell those photos to guys with ED!
I own a 2006 Ford GT, plus a Ferrari 458 Italia, a Lamborghini Murcielago V12, two Viper GTS and a 2015 Corvette Z06 vert.
The Ferrari 458 Italia and the Ford GT are the two best driving cars available, in my experience. Driven back-to-back they are very similar dynamically, so I do believe both cars are, in fact, in the same league.
The FGT makes more torque than the 458 Italia, but in my opinion the Ferrari 458 Italia is more controllable, has more precise steering placement and does not wag its tail as much as the FGT under heavy throttle. When hot, the Ferrari's carbon-ceramic Brembo brakes are superior brakes to the FGT as well.
Both the FGT (crank driven blower) and Ferrari 458 Italia (naturally aspirated) produce very similar horsepower numbers, just south of 600 hp, but the 458 revs to 9,000 rpm and is incomparable in exhaust note quality.
The Murcielago is no slouch in the horsepower league either with nearly 600 hp from the 6.2 liter V12, but it is a larger car physically & dimensionally, must be revved to 6,000 rpm and up, to produce lots of power.
My 2015 Z06 lays down impressive numbers, is super fun to drive and is a fantastic value but the Ford GT and the Ferrari 458 are simply easier cars to drive quickly, with higher confidence levels, for the average sports car enthusiast and driver.
Mid-engine cars simply have better balance and steer more precisely, in my opinion; and there is more to a daily-use sports car than raw horsepower numbers and straight line performance.
How much FASTER around any given track is the Ford GT? Yes it looks cool, yes it's got lots of spacey materials. But if it's such a race car, where are the lap times?
I don't doubt it'll be a little faster than a C7Z. But nothing I've seen about this car makes me believe it'll be "in another league." I'd be happy to be proven wrong, but I'm just not as impressed with the GT so far as some people.
Ford published comparison lap times with the 675LT and 488GTB. At Calabogie Motorsports Park in Canada, on the same day, with the same driver, same fuel source, and fresh tires, the GT turned a 2:09.8 lap, besting the McLaren's 2:10.8 and the Ferrari's 2:12.9.
The GT has quite a few advantages over the C7Z. First, it is 300 lbs lighter which helps it brake better, accelerate faster and corner faster. Not a lot better in each area but it all adds up when putting a lap together. The next advantage is for a regular driver Vs a pro is the slower torque build up. It has less torque in the 1 to 3K rpm range which helps the hammer on the throttle types to drop the hammer without spinning the rear tires as much. Then add a 43/57 rear weight bias which helps traction and you get the ability to shoot off corners a little better due to better grip and the ability to put the power down without shocking the tires and encouraging them to spin.
On the street the car will be easier to drive due to lighter steering, better acceleration from a stop due to vastly reduced torque at the 1K rpm level (less than the LT1) and better grip. I suspect some of the softer low end torque curve is due to the V6 engine but most is due to the nature of Turbocharging Vs Supercharging.
We know from all of the complaints about the Z06 turning right under hard acceleration, search for better grip tires and other threads on the forum that a large number of owners have problems driving a low rpm high torque car because they can't manage the throttle. The GT takes that problem away by reducing the torque in the lower ranges and making it far harder to over power the rear tires when slamming the throttle to the floor.
That the Corvette is much more substantially different from its street counterpart than the Ford GT is.
S.
yup...any1 spending a little time around race cars would know
Originally Posted by K.I.T.T.
Apples to oranges....Corvette is a car you can use, enjoy, beat on, maintain fairly affordably, drive to work...it's a Civic, just a hell of a lot faster. Ford Gt is an engineering exercise, an example of execution, a platform for marketing, etc. Both have 4 wheels and carry passengers, but they each have a different purpose for existence.
not really...their purpose is whatever the buyer wants it to be
08-31-2017, 12:50 AM
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