Run Flats
#2
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The only advantage of non run flats is lower replacement cost.
Bill
Bill
#5
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less bent wheel issues as well.
run flats are worse in every way except driving without air pressure. the only reason there are run flats on the vette is so GM can save weight and money without a spare.
run flats are worse in every way except driving without air pressure. the only reason there are run flats on the vette is so GM can save weight and money without a spare.
#6
Melting Slicks
And lighter weight.
#8
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Let us look at the so called disadvantages of run flats.
Less noise depends on factors other than the sidewall construction of the tires. My Hoosiers with no tread make just as much road noise as my Cup2s and my MPSS. There are other tires that make less noise.
Bent wheel issues. My experience it isn't any different than non run flat tires. My wife damaged both right side wheels on our Malibu when she drove over a pot hole. The Bu didn't have run flats and it had soft easy riding high profile tires.
As for tire weight given equal sizes, tread pattern and construction (other than sidewall inserts and reinforced beads) how much weight is added when a tire has a single sidewall with an insert and two reinforced beads. Maybe a couple of pounds. Multiply that by 4 and you still get less than the weight of a mini spare. As to how that weight affects handling it isn't very obvious when you compare tires like we get on the Vette with DOT R tires. They are very comparable and some forum responders are turning in fantastic lap times running Cup2 ZP tires.
Again, the only real advantage non run flats have is lower replacement cost. That may not have been true at the end of the C5 era but it was definitely true before the end of the C6 era. Just like the 3K/3Mo oil change interval from the 60s has gone away non run flat tires have lost all but one of their advantages and are missing one huge advantage.
Bill
Less noise depends on factors other than the sidewall construction of the tires. My Hoosiers with no tread make just as much road noise as my Cup2s and my MPSS. There are other tires that make less noise.
Bent wheel issues. My experience it isn't any different than non run flat tires. My wife damaged both right side wheels on our Malibu when she drove over a pot hole. The Bu didn't have run flats and it had soft easy riding high profile tires.
As for tire weight given equal sizes, tread pattern and construction (other than sidewall inserts and reinforced beads) how much weight is added when a tire has a single sidewall with an insert and two reinforced beads. Maybe a couple of pounds. Multiply that by 4 and you still get less than the weight of a mini spare. As to how that weight affects handling it isn't very obvious when you compare tires like we get on the Vette with DOT R tires. They are very comparable and some forum responders are turning in fantastic lap times running Cup2 ZP tires.
Again, the only real advantage non run flats have is lower replacement cost. That may not have been true at the end of the C5 era but it was definitely true before the end of the C6 era. Just like the 3K/3Mo oil change interval from the 60s has gone away non run flat tires have lost all but one of their advantages and are missing one huge advantage.
Bill
#9
Burning Brakes
The advantage or disadvantage is dependent upon the wants, uses, and preferences of the driver. I have never had any runflat on any of my autos that was as good a ride as a non runflat. Some RFs are worse than others, Michelin does make a quality runflat. Also, the use of the automobile is a factor. For a street car I had Michelin Pilot Sport A/s 3+s on my 2014 Stingray and they were wonderful. I drove Route 66 twice with them and the ride and noise improvement were significant. Also, since they were an all season tire they were usable year round and did not require changing tires seasonally. I still have the OEM Michelins on the Z06 and even though I don't track it I will leave them on it as they are a better tire for it in my opinion due to the power of the Z. If there was a non runflat that could meet the requirements for it I would replace them with it, but there is not and most likely will not be one in the future. And, the OEM tires (non cup) on it are by far the best riding runflats I have ever had. Bottom line is the Z is parked in the toy shed when it is below 40F.
Last edited by Kyflyer; 09-16-2017 at 04:55 PM. Reason: grammar correction
#10
Racer
Run Flats are for track use only as they are designed or intended to be capable of going 50 miles only at 50 mph only, that's enough to get you back to the pit area for a replacement. You are increasing your risk using them as a daily driven tire on streets and highways as when one gives it up you will most likely be 150 miles from anywhere and when you get towed to anywhere no one will be able to repair it without damaging a wheel or something else and neither will anyone have a replacement tire. Your odds are better with Non-Run Flats and carrying an electric-pump and sealant, plugs and a plug-tool.
With that said, I run the Michelin Run-Flats, but I have had my Z07 for two years and have 7000 miles on it, but I hold my breath where the tires are concerned ever time I leave the house even though I have had no flats yet . . . knock on wood as they say!!!
_
With that said, I run the Michelin Run-Flats, but I have had my Z07 for two years and have 7000 miles on it, but I hold my breath where the tires are concerned ever time I leave the house even though I have had no flats yet . . . knock on wood as they say!!!
_
Last edited by Sk8Man_; 09-17-2017 at 03:35 PM.
#11
Pro
Let us look at the so called disadvantages of run flats.
Less noise depends on factors other than the sidewall construction of the tires. My Hoosiers with no tread make just as much road noise as my Cup2s and my MPSS. There are other tires that make less noise.
Bent wheel issues. My experience it isn't any different than non run flat tires. My wife damaged both right side wheels on our Malibu when she drove over a pot hole. The Bu didn't have run flats and it had soft easy riding high profile tires.
As for tire weight given equal sizes, tread pattern and construction (other than sidewall inserts and reinforced beads) how much weight is added when a tire has a single sidewall with an insert and two reinforced beads. Maybe a couple of pounds. Multiply that by 4 and you still get less than the weight of a mini spare. As to how that weight affects handling it isn't very obvious when you compare tires like we get on the Vette with DOT R tires. They are very comparable and some forum responders are turning in fantastic lap times running Cup2 ZP tires.
Again, the only real advantage non run flats have is lower replacement cost. That may not have been true at the end of the C5 era but it was definitely true before the end of the C6 era. Just like the 3K/3Mo oil change interval from the 60s has gone away non run flat tires have lost all but one of their advantages and are missing one huge advantage.
Bill
Less noise depends on factors other than the sidewall construction of the tires. My Hoosiers with no tread make just as much road noise as my Cup2s and my MPSS. There are other tires that make less noise.
Bent wheel issues. My experience it isn't any different than non run flat tires. My wife damaged both right side wheels on our Malibu when she drove over a pot hole. The Bu didn't have run flats and it had soft easy riding high profile tires.
As for tire weight given equal sizes, tread pattern and construction (other than sidewall inserts and reinforced beads) how much weight is added when a tire has a single sidewall with an insert and two reinforced beads. Maybe a couple of pounds. Multiply that by 4 and you still get less than the weight of a mini spare. As to how that weight affects handling it isn't very obvious when you compare tires like we get on the Vette with DOT R tires. They are very comparable and some forum responders are turning in fantastic lap times running Cup2 ZP tires.
Again, the only real advantage non run flats have is lower replacement cost. That may not have been true at the end of the C5 era but it was definitely true before the end of the C6 era. Just like the 3K/3Mo oil change interval from the 60s has gone away non run flat tires have lost all but one of their advantages and are missing one huge advantage.
Bill
#12
Pro
Many things you said are not true. Run Flats are not just meant for the track! My co-worker has a new Honda van that came STOCK with run flats. There is absolutely no increased risks of using them on a daily basis. Honestly I don't know where you are driving but I'm almost ALWAYS within 50 miles of someplace. BTW many places are now able to repair these tires. Things have changed in the last few years.
Run Flats are for track use only as they are designed or intended to be capable of going 50 miles only at 50 mph only, that's enough to get you back to the pit area for a replacement. You are increasing your risk using them as a daily driven tire on streets and highways as when one gives it up you will most likely be 150 miles from anywhere and when you get towed to anywhere no one will be able to repair it without damaging a wheel or something else and neither will anyone have a replacement tire. Your odds are better with Non-Run Flats and carrying an electric-pump and sealant, plugs and a plug-tool.
With that said, I run the Michelin Run-Flats, but I have had my Z07 for two years and have 7000 miles on it, but I hold my breath where the tires are concerned ever time I leave the house even though I have had no flats yet . . . knock on wood as they say!!!
_
With that said, I run the Michelin Run-Flats, but I have had my Z07 for two years and have 7000 miles on it, but I hold my breath where the tires are concerned ever time I leave the house even though I have had no flats yet . . . knock on wood as they say!!!
_
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BearZ06 (09-18-2017)
#13
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While todays era run flats are light years over the C5 hard as rock run flats, there make a lot more noise compared to non run flats, and the ride is more harsh compared to non run flats, at least that is what I found in replacing my 16' and now my 17' Z06 run flat tires. On my 16' I used extreme contacts continentals, on my 17' I used Nitto Invo's and 345's on the rear, front stock size, extreme contacts were back ordered, and I have Nitto's on my hellcat and they work great
#14
Safety Car
Continental EC and Nitto Invo's might be adequate for your usage which I imagine is different than mine. I don't drive around town and only on the highways getting to fun, challenging roads where performance is my only criteria regarding tires.
I wouldn't run the Continental EC or Nitto's if they were given to me for free. They are not in the same league as the MPSS ZP from a performance perspective. This has been proven by many with quantitative lap times.
For performance the Nitto's are just terrible and the EC better, but not by much. Same with the Pirelli run flats, just not is the same league as the MPSS.
Last edited by rikhek; 09-18-2017 at 08:12 AM.
#15
Melting Slicks
So far the Pirelli racing slicks work good for me on the track and they are not run flat.
#16
Race Director
I replaced the OE with Pirelli runflats on mine and while not a racer by any means they did awesome on my 2800 mile road trip and gripped great on several runs through the Tail of the Dragon.
#17
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Blanket statements like this are misleading to people ignorant of tire characteristics and performance on the C7 chassis.
Continental EC and Nitto Invo's might be adequate for your usage which I imagine is different than mine. I don't drive around town and only on the highways getting to fun, challenging roads where performance is my only criteria regarding tires.
I wouldn't run the Continental EC or Nitto's if they were given to me for free. They are not in the same league as the MPSS ZP from a performance perspective. This has been proven by many with quantitative lap times.
For performance the Nitto's are just terrible and the EC better, but not by much. Same with the Pirelli run flats, just not is the same league as the MPSS.
Continental EC and Nitto Invo's might be adequate for your usage which I imagine is different than mine. I don't drive around town and only on the highways getting to fun, challenging roads where performance is my only criteria regarding tires.
I wouldn't run the Continental EC or Nitto's if they were given to me for free. They are not in the same league as the MPSS ZP from a performance perspective. This has been proven by many with quantitative lap times.
For performance the Nitto's are just terrible and the EC better, but not by much. Same with the Pirelli run flats, just not is the same league as the MPSS.
#18
Safety Car
Everyone uses their car differently, and drives different roads, and different events. Nitto's on my hellcat hookup great on the streets I drive in the summer, the cars got 840 plus rwhp and it's the only things that worked on the street that was not a drag radial. I have cup tires that came with the car for events, but they don't work in the rain and cold, so the Invo's get me there and work in water and cold, got a lift so changing wheels and tires are like washing the car, although washing takes much longer, but then again I am old.
My intent was to express exactly the point you make. Different usage demands different tires. There are options out there to suit anyone's needs. No one tire will work for everybody. Selection should be based upon your needs. The OP's question of what others are using instead of run flats is impossible to answer without stating his goal.
Last edited by Steve Garrett; 09-18-2017 at 10:12 PM. Reason: Merged Posts-please use the Multi-Quote button (the middle icon) in the lower right hand corner of each post to make your reply look like this.
#20
Racer
Many things you said are not true. Run Flats are not just meant for the track! My co-worker has a new Honda van that came STOCK with run flats. There is absolutely no increased risks of using them on a daily basis. Honestly I don't know where you are driving but I'm almost ALWAYS within 50 miles of someplace. BTW many places are now able to repair these tires. Things have changed in the last few years.
As I see it, your main complaint is because I used the adjective "only" rather than "primarily" when I stated in my first post that run-flats were for track use "only". NO! One can run them for street use, I do, but one is placing themselves at a greater risk for hours if not days of inconvenience, possible damage to their car, to the wheel, and a greatly increased cost by doing so. It's a simple common sense consideration of logistics.
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Last edited by Sk8Man_; 09-19-2017 at 12:17 AM.