Is the A8 triple flush an outdated TSB?
02-16-2019, 02:32 PM
#1
Is the A8 triple flush an outdated TSB?
I took my 2016 ZO6 in before the warranty was up to get the armrest console replaced due to the mushy foam wrinkles, and to get the fuel door solenoid fix as it lock the fuel door shut and to get the new transmission fluid as a preventive maintenance from dreaded shutter. I had no problems with my tranny whatsoever at 17000 miles I picked up the car used with 12,000 miles in April. My bumper to bumper warranty is about up in a month.
The question at hand is they called me and they said they couldn't replicate any shutter so they didn't do anything that transmission and I told a service writer that GM change the fluid that there should be a TSB for it. He called me back today saying that they did the triple flush.... So is a triple flush an outdated TSB? Is there a newer fluid? Should I still be concerned about the torque converter?
Or am I lucky that they did the triple flush as I read somewhere that they weren't doing the triple flush anymore?
The question at hand is they called me and they said they couldn't replicate any shutter so they didn't do anything that transmission and I told a service writer that GM change the fluid that there should be a TSB for it. He called me back today saying that they did the triple flush.... So is a triple flush an outdated TSB? Is there a newer fluid? Should I still be concerned about the torque converter?
Or am I lucky that they did the triple flush as I read somewhere that they weren't doing the triple flush anymore?
Last edited by Ruderegime; 02-16-2019 at 02:33 PM.
02-16-2019, 03:16 PM
#2
I cant answer your question with any authority, but I do know the "flush" involved in this new flush replaces the previous fluid with a new Mobil One synthetic ATF fluid. I wouldn't trust the service writer for an accurate response, I'd ask the mechanic who did it or ask for a copy of the work order and see if they spelled out what kind of fluid replaced it.
02-16-2019, 10:24 PM
#4
Safety Car
Actually the new TSB takes 24 quarts when only 8 quarts can be removed from the pan. So it could still be called a triple flush. But that is necessary as there is still old fluid in the TC itself. It takes 3 applications of the 8 quarts each application to get most of the fluid changed out.
Next I am going to do some guessing as to the remaining oil in the TC itself as I don't actually know the residual, but lets say for example the total fluid capacity is 12 quarts and the pan itself only holds 8 of the 12 quarts. If you change the 8 quarts in the pan you have 8/12ths new oil in the transmission. If you change 8 quarts again you have 8 new quarts new oil and the remaining 4 quarts is now 8/12ths new. Or you add 8/3rds of a quart of new oil for a total of 10 and 2/3rds quarts of new oil out of 12 quarts in the transmission. On the third try you change 8 more quarts and you now have 8 new quarts plus the remaining oil is 10.67/12ths new oil. So you have about 11.5 quarts of new oil out of 12 quarts in the system. It is not that you are flushing it totally 3 times, but that you need to change what you can 3 times to get an acceptable concentration of new oil in the transmission.
And the TSB is time consuming because the car must be lowered and run in a bit to mix the new oil with the old for a time between each 8 quart change.
Next I am going to do some guessing as to the remaining oil in the TC itself as I don't actually know the residual, but lets say for example the total fluid capacity is 12 quarts and the pan itself only holds 8 of the 12 quarts. If you change the 8 quarts in the pan you have 8/12ths new oil in the transmission. If you change 8 quarts again you have 8 new quarts new oil and the remaining 4 quarts is now 8/12ths new. Or you add 8/3rds of a quart of new oil for a total of 10 and 2/3rds quarts of new oil out of 12 quarts in the transmission. On the third try you change 8 more quarts and you now have 8 new quarts plus the remaining oil is 10.67/12ths new oil. So you have about 11.5 quarts of new oil out of 12 quarts in the system. It is not that you are flushing it totally 3 times, but that you need to change what you can 3 times to get an acceptable concentration of new oil in the transmission.
And the TSB is time consuming because the car must be lowered and run in a bit to mix the new oil with the old for a time between each 8 quart change.
Last edited by pkincy; 02-16-2019 at 10:36 PM.
02-16-2019, 11:17 PM
#5
Update
Okay got my car back today and looked at the work order. Looks like they did a drain and fill, and then they noticed another tsb and then did the triple flush with a synthetic Mobil 1 ATF.
So I'm thinking I got a four flush
So I'm thinking I got a four flush
02-17-2019, 04:05 AM
#6
Le Mans Master
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Was that done under warranty, or did they charge for this?
02-17-2019, 11:04 AM
#7
The triple flush is a band-aid temporary fix, and GM knows it. The shudder will eventually come back, they are just buying time. If you’re not concerned about warranty, AND catch it early enough, it can be eliminated with a transmission tune. GM’s TCC lock-up strategy is what it is to prevent the driver from noticing lockup at all, and in most cases it’s never truly locked, rather a controlled low rpm “slip” to smooth the feel. I say lock it and be done....
John
John
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NSC5 (02-17-2019)
02-17-2019, 12:18 PM
#8
Melting Slicks
The triple flush is a band-aid temporary fix, and GM knows it. The shudder will eventually come back, they are just buying time. If you’re not concerned about warranty, AND catch it early enough, it can be eliminated with a transmission tune. GM’s TCC lock-up strategy is what it is to prevent the driver from noticing lockup at all, and in most cases it’s never truly locked, rather a controlled low rpm “slip” to smooth the feel. I say lock it and be done....
John
John
Last edited by mig1980; 02-17-2019 at 12:35 PM.
02-17-2019, 12:37 PM
#9
I’m not sure about the DS, but I can do it with HP tuners or EFI Live. I disabled DOD in my ‘16 GMC truck and it will still shudder, triple flush done at 21k and now at 38k and the shudder is back. They will all do it, I don’t think the DS would have this capability, I have always used a laptop...going back to the days when data logging and tuning needed 2 separate software companies to get the job done. We have an EASY button now 
02-17-2019, 01:23 PM
#10
Yes the triple flush was done under warranty and I have zero shutter problems before and after. I also have a Range device
Last edited by Ruderegime; 02-17-2019 at 01:34 PM.
02-28-2019, 11:27 PM
#13
Melting Slicks
03-01-2019, 11:12 AM
#15
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I think it depends on the dealer. Had mine done in Nov. 2018 during that TSB before this latest one. One dealer would not do it unless I left the car for days and they can replicate the shudder. I then moved on to another dealer that I usually get my car serviced at and insisted on the change. Although they could not replicate it, I was just getting it a a precaution. They still did the 9 quart change as a courtesy to me with the newest fluid (at that time) under warranty. They did state at that time (Nov 2018) that a new TSB was coming out Q1 2019 and that I might have to bring it back. Never really had the shudder, I just did it while I had the B2B warranty. I believe it depends on the dealer and if you get your car serviced at the same dealer.
03-01-2019, 11:13 AM
#16
Safety Car
The necessity to use the PicoScope and to submit it to GM originated with the new TSB. Also if they only changed the ATF in the pan (you state 9 quarts, but I think it is generally 8 quarts) you only have 70% of your fluid changed and it is to the older "new" ATF. That is why it takes 3 flushes of 8 quarts each. As the fluid remaining in the TC is 3 quarts after the 8 quarts in the pan is changed. Changing the pan fluid 3 times gets over 90% new fluid in the tranny if the car is lowered and started and the transmission run through all 8 gears between each flush.
So 24 quarts of 19417577 part nos blue label Mobil One ATF is needed, the proper drain tools and 1.6 hours of time for the Corvette Triple Drain and Fill charged to the powertrain warranty.
Again this is all in black and white in the TSB. If your dealer is unable to read english, and unfortunately that is a common occurrence, you should change dealers.
And the new TSB referring to the warranty charge as powertrain and not B2B certainly tells me GM is stepping up to fix this problem as many of the trucks and daily driver cars likely are well out of the B2B warranties.
Given that it is March now, all dealers should have the 19417577 in quarts but if not the 55 gallon drum is 19417904 part number. However that is not the way the ATF will be delivered once the quart bottles are available. And as Summit Racing now has it in stock, I suspect all GM dealers do also.
So 24 quarts of 19417577 part nos blue label Mobil One ATF is needed, the proper drain tools and 1.6 hours of time for the Corvette Triple Drain and Fill charged to the powertrain warranty.
Again this is all in black and white in the TSB. If your dealer is unable to read english, and unfortunately that is a common occurrence, you should change dealers.
And the new TSB referring to the warranty charge as powertrain and not B2B certainly tells me GM is stepping up to fix this problem as many of the trucks and daily driver cars likely are well out of the B2B warranties.
Given that it is March now, all dealers should have the 19417577 in quarts but if not the 55 gallon drum is 19417904 part number. However that is not the way the ATF will be delivered once the quart bottles are available. And as Summit Racing now has it in stock, I suspect all GM dealers do also.
Last edited by pkincy; 03-01-2019 at 11:44 AM.
03-01-2019, 02:05 PM
#17
The triple flush is a band-aid temporary fix, and GM knows it. The shudder will eventually come back, they are just buying time. If you’re not concerned about warranty, AND catch it early enough, it can be eliminated with a transmission tune. GM’s TCC lock-up strategy is what it is to prevent the driver from noticing lockup at all, and in most cases it’s never truly locked, rather a controlled low rpm “slip” to smooth the feel. I say lock it and be done....
John
John
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JHEBERT (03-01-2019)
03-01-2019, 02:39 PM
#18
Burning Brakes
What is the latest TSB # for this??
The necessity to use the PicoScope and to submit it to GM originated with the new TSB. Also if they only changed the ATF in the pan (you state 9 quarts, but I think it is generally 8 quarts) you only have 70% of your fluid changed and it is to the older "new" ATF. That is why it takes 3 flushes of 8 quarts each. As the fluid remaining in the TC is 3 quarts after the 8 quarts in the pan is changed. Changing the pan fluid 3 times gets over 90% new fluid in the tranny if the car is lowered and started and the transmission run through all 8 gears between each flush.
So 24 quarts of 19417577 part nos blue label Mobil One ATF is needed, the proper drain tools and 1.6 hours of time for the Corvette Triple Drain and Fill charged to the powertrain warranty.
Again this is all in black and white in the TSB. If your dealer is unable to read english, and unfortunately that is a common occurrence, you should change dealers.
And the new TSB referring to the warranty charge as powertrain and not B2B certainly tells me GM is stepping up to fix this problem as many of the trucks and daily driver cars likely are well out of the B2B warranties.
Given that it is March now, all dealers should have the 19417577 in quarts but if not the 55 gallon drum is 19417904 part number. However that is not the way the ATF will be delivered once the quart bottles are available. And as Summit Racing now has it in stock, I suspect all GM dealers do also.
So 24 quarts of 19417577 part nos blue label Mobil One ATF is needed, the proper drain tools and 1.6 hours of time for the Corvette Triple Drain and Fill charged to the powertrain warranty.
Again this is all in black and white in the TSB. If your dealer is unable to read english, and unfortunately that is a common occurrence, you should change dealers.
And the new TSB referring to the warranty charge as powertrain and not B2B certainly tells me GM is stepping up to fix this problem as many of the trucks and daily driver cars likely are well out of the B2B warranties.
Given that it is March now, all dealers should have the 19417577 in quarts but if not the 55 gallon drum is 19417904 part number. However that is not the way the ATF will be delivered once the quart bottles are available. And as Summit Racing now has it in stock, I suspect all GM dealers do also.