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Vote on the new cutout shape...

 
Old 03-12-2019, 04:03 PM
  #101  
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Originally Posted by Mikec7z View Post
Looks similar to Khoa's front at Competition Carbon, but it is different, thicker on the side intakes at the bottom.

Anyway, i dont think you need anymore body work, I think you will just need to add some coolers next. I'm trying to hurry, we are almost there. Want to make sure what is released is the best way to do it, with no regrets later.

Let me know how that bumper works out, it looks very long and low in the front, as the car is still at, what looks to be, stock ride height in the photos.
I asked what the ride height was. He stated his was lowered on stock bolts hope it's not too low it's a one piece unit connected to splitter
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Old 03-12-2019, 05:32 PM
  #102  
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yeah, it looks like a great piece, i scrolled around his instagram page and saw the photo of it from the side, it is just very low and pointy out front, so be aware.

(drives me crazy these guys who make these front ends, dont realize a splitter still has to be attached and IT can stick out far and take the punishment, and if mistakes are made, the splitter can take the punishment and be replaced. These front end makers just don't seem to get it)
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Old 03-12-2019, 05:46 PM
  #103  
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Default seems we went same route..

Originally Posted by Mikec7z View Post
yeah, it looks like a great piece, i scrolled around his instagram page and saw the photo of it from the side, it is just very low and pointy out front, so be aware.

(drives me crazy these guys who make these front ends, dont realize a splitter still has to be attached and IT can stick out far and take the punishment, and if mistakes are made, the splitter can take the punishment and be replaced. These front end makers just don't seem to get it)
Other vendors had a ok solutions, but Setrab is from Sweden and as it turned out i also found a new cool bumper from Germany....and i wanted to have something to do this winter, so here is my project
Shopping close made all things easier, and i think i have fairly good solution....
smaller Setrab, as i spoke to their technician on the project and he said 2 x 34 row is plenty enough to extract heat from a continuously running 800 HP engine...
I did double up and cool IC in both corners in front of oil coolers, so my oil coolers will have slightly warmer air and less delta T.... But still OK i hope :-0
IC on road racing can have temp in 90F ambient as high as 200 F OUT before IC bricks in SC, so delta T for them will be 200 -90 in the first corner, crosses over to other corner and temp should be 50 F less, so now delta T is 150-90F, and going into the last cooler, the stock center one it should have gone down to 110F, and how much last cooler will do ???? maybe another 10F down ? So going back into engine is 100F fluid..... ALOT less than a vendor here measured on track with stock setup.

Oil will go serie through two coolers, and my engine builder in Austria promised enough oil pressure so not to worry... pressure drop over the whole system is maybe 5 psi, and i use the thermostat and pressure side (unlike your setup)...
Brackets and way to solve it is almost identical , so great minds think alike :-)
Center IC is now pushing less heat to main radiator, and main radiator is Dewitt 57 mm, and no oil temp going into system so i hope my goals are met.....
90F day and i hope to see max 240 oil temp, and 215F water .... time will tell

If you like to see my project and dont feel i am stealing any thunder i can post them here....
a sneak peak on bumper

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Old 03-12-2019, 06:04 PM
  #104  
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the more ideas, the merrier. I am only bummed I did not bring my ideas to fruition sooner to save a lot of people a lot of money, so it is shame on me.

Please, post away. What's gong on with all these pointed noses on all these aftermarket front ends? Mighty ducks vettes

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Old 03-13-2019, 05:03 AM
  #105  
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Default Cooling solution LT4 ala Norway


Originally Posted by Mikec7z View Post
the more ideas, the merrier. I am only bummed I did not bring my ideas to fruition sooner to save a lot of people a lot of money, so it is shame on me.

Please, post away. What's gong on with all these pointed noses on all these aftermarket front ends? Mighty ducks vettes
You would think living at lattitude 60 (same as Anchorage) our cars didn't need cooling aid.... Well it does.... Some days we actually can see 85-88F, and i had oil temp at 300+ and water 242F :-0

So i was about to pull the trigger on a cooling package and GSpeed seemed the best one and not crazy prized as TIKT (German solution), however as always i think i can do better :-)
Not sure if i always do, but i start with that ..

So my goal was max oil temp 240F, Engine water max 215F and IC coolant going in 100F or less (most of the time we have ambient in the 70s)

How to cure Main engine water temp ? Remove oil temp dumping into it, reduce air temp going over radiator and go bigger radiator (DeWitt)

Oil temp solution: Thermostat by oil filter, only send oil to coolers after temp reach 198F. Goes to driver side oil cooler (2nd in the sandwich), crosses over to passenger side, (second in the sandwich)
and returns to engine by thermostat.

IC circuit: Increase flow by 2.5 times @ 6 psi , larger reservoir (remove the stock tank), Warm fluid out of SC goes into tank, into pump, then into driver side front HX, cross over to passenger side HX, then back to stock center IC HX, and then return to engine...... -should pull temp down to 10-15 above ambient (i hope)

Straight water + water vetter for better heat transfer.......

Thats theory, lets see on track days :-)





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Old 03-13-2019, 05:20 AM
  #106  
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Default Finished painted it looks like stock


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Old 03-13-2019, 06:12 AM
  #107  
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@Z06Norway , you said those are sold in Germany? Link? I'm currently in Germany and would buy one in a heartbeat!
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Old 03-13-2019, 07:56 AM
  #108  
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Hello,
I follow your thread. Interested in a no cut solution. A lot of work, I hope to see your efforts crowned with success.

Mike, you use Setrab too, I see.

See you soon
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Old 03-13-2019, 10:57 AM
  #109  
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alright norway, i commend you for taking a stab at this project. Car looks great, I like the front end now that it is painted, it looked like it was much different before.

A few things....

You did not need that much cooling All you needed was a oil cooler on one side and a blower cooler on the other... youve added weight, imo.

The vendors on these cooling systems have us all believing it takes a lot more than it does... they've never shown us that less is more, so to speak, and that the oil cooler is THE solution and needs to be step 1... they seem to coincidentally keep it for step 3 or 4, or it is put in the chin laying flat, but whatever, ill solve this dilemma soon enough.

But in the meantime, it still has everyone confused... The reason being, it is human nature to ASSUME that if my temp is x when there are 4 new HX added to the car, than my temp would have been much higher if i only add 2 hx to the car.... but thats not true.... air flow across the coolers is harmed with 4 vs 2.

So, am i saying rip coolers off your car? nah, wait for my results and we can compare notes.

One thing that i don't think you want to have is the big vent at the front of the wheel well arch.

this is a VERY HIGH PRESSURE area in front of the front tire.

That means, air will literally flow IN from the BACK.

That means, it literally cancels the force from the front. (and with 2 coolers the air needs to flow through, this is not what you want in a perfect world)

There is a reason I am brainstorming on how to vent out the side, where the turn signal is, which would be behind the dive plane, and thus in an area of vacuum. There is also a reason I am venting out the lower back corner by the engine, with a hose. This area under the car is a LOW pressure area, and it creates vacuum and will pull the air out.

Thats all my 2 cents, do with it what you like, just throwing it out there why im doing what im doing and did not do what so many vendors have had us believe is needed, let alone acceptable.

Overall though, you did a great job

I do like that nose. If that was for sale here in in the USA, i would be much happier. What is it made of? it looked like it was made in sections.

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Old 03-13-2019, 11:56 AM
  #110  
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Originally Posted by 01REDSS View Post
@Z06Norway , you said those are sold in Germany? Link? I'm currently in Germany and would buy one in a heartbeat!

Adress is
Barbiserstr 127-129
37431 Bad Lautenberg
Germany

Its a small garage/shop, his name is Ingo

Not sure if he has stock, but call him.... +49 5524 80800‬

Multitalent and kind person, but his English is..... not so good.
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Old 03-13-2019, 12:10 PM
  #111  
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Originally Posted by Mikec7z View Post
alright norway, i commend you for taking a stab at this project. Car looks great, I like the front end now that it is painted, it looked like it was much different before.

A few things....

You did not need that much cooling All you needed was a oil cooler on one side and a blower cooler on the other... youve added weight, imo.

The vendors on these cooling systems have us all believing it takes a lot more than it does... they've never shown us that less is more, so to speak, and that the oil cooler is THE solution and needs to be step 1... they seem to coincidentally keep it for step 3 or 4, or it is put in the chin laying flat, but whatever, ill solve this dilemma soon enough.

But in the meantime, it still has everyone confused... The reason being, it is human nature to ASSUME that if my temp is x when there are 4 new HX added to the car, than my temp would have been much higher if i only add 2 hx to the car.... but thats not true.... air flow across the coolers is harmed with 4 vs 2.

So, am i saying rip coolers off your car? nah, wait for my results and we can compare notes.

One thing that i don't think you want to have is the big vent at the front of the wheel well arch.

this is a VERY HIGH PRESSURE area in front of the front tire.

That means, air will literally flow IN from the BACK.

That means, it literally cancels the force from the front. (and with 2 coolers the air needs to flow through, this is not what you want in a perfect world)

There is a reason I am brainstorming on how to vent out the side, where the turn signal is, which would be behind the dive plane, and thus in an area of vacuum. There is also a reason I am venting out the lower back corner by the engine, with a hose. This area under the car is a LOW pressure area, and it creates vacuum and will pull the air out.

Thats all my 2 cents, do with it what you like, just throwing it out there why im doing what im doing and did not do what so many vendors have had us believe is needed, let alone acceptable.

Overall though, you did a great job

I do like that nose. If that was for sale here in in the USA, i would be much happier. What is it made of? it looked like it was made in sections.
the noose is polyester cloth, not Carbon Fibre, but i think he can use both material..
Its not made in sections, its just that his mold is a three piece design, and before you sand it down you will se the fine lines between two parts of mold.


I might have overdone it, but rather be on that side of the fence :-)
One 625 cooler is not heavy, and two 625 is not that much bigger than your 640 in surface.
They are aligned up and the little gap in-between them is sealed up. They are glued together with CF strips and a two component 3M glue, stronger than welding..
Same for the brackets, they are clued to the underside of the "stack of coolers" and secured with bolts on top....., so it's easy to remove.

according to Setrab tech, anything above a certain airflow is not doing more work.... i think he said 40 mph directly airflow would be Setrab max heat extraction.
Anything more is just not doing anything more.

I realice pressure in front of wheel is high pressure, but not nearly as high as straight into a closed chamber in front of car... air has to be forced in and out the back , and as long as it does that at 40 mph speed or better... i should be good.
Porsche has corner radiators and they all went into wheel well, so i think i am good... or i hope :-)


I know i improved cooling, hoping to achieve my goals, but only time will tell.... summer testing will show :-0


Keep us posted on your project, will be interesting to see results and compare.....


Thanks

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Old 03-13-2019, 12:16 PM
  #112  
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I think you did a great job, and I KNOW you will no longer have overheat issues

I am VERY GLAD you kept your Z, i remember when you were going to downgrade to a grandsport and I was like STOP!!!

For the amount of money you would have lost, investing in cooling makes much more logical sense. You are going to love this car now
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Old 03-13-2019, 03:28 PM
  #113  
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Default Wheel well air vents

Originally Posted by Mikec7z View Post
I think you did a great job, and I KNOW you will no longer have overheat issues

I am VERY GLAD you kept your Z, i remember when you were going to downgrade to a grandsport and I was like STOP!!!

For the amount of money you would have lost, investing in cooling makes much more logical sense. You are going to love this car now
For sure, but i will always miss NA, less weight ;-)

I found this article, thought it was interesting to read Porsche strategy for radiator , increased cooling..
They lowered the Cw of the car with openings in corner and additional coolers in corner and at the same tie reduced air lift front axle......
So maybe not so bad to dump the air into wheel well ?

I just dont know, so thats what i did, and now i started looking as i haven't cut inner wheel liner yet.....
Maybe do the GT2 RS trick where they open up the inner most part of the liner ?

https://rennlist.com/forums/996-turb...rack-guys.html


anyway good luck to us both :-)
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Old 03-13-2019, 04:15 PM
  #114  
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Thatís very interesting what he did with the fender liners on that GT2.
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Old 03-13-2019, 04:49 PM
  #115  
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if the hole is inline with the tire tread itself, i have heard it is a high pressure area. Over toward the center of the car, toward the engine in the middle, that is a place of vacuum usually.

So, the closer you can do your cutout to the middle of the car, the better you will be.

Ironically, same geometry is on the z06, the small opening at the back of the fender is right where a curved fin redirects air to the inside of the front wheel, to cool the brakes.

This is the exact same spot i plan to cut away material on the floor of the compartment to let more air escape..

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Old 03-14-2019, 05:36 AM
  #116  
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Default ZR1 also exhaust the radiator in front of wheels

Originally Posted by Mikec7z View Post
if the hole is inline with the tire tread itself, i have heard it is a high pressure area. Over toward the center of the car, toward the engine in the middle, that is a place as vacuum usually.

So, the closer you can do your cutout to the middle of the car, the better you will be.

Ironically, same geometry is on the z06, the small opening at the back of the fender is right where a curved fin redirects air to the inside of the front wheel, to cool the brakes.

This is the exact same spot i plan to cut away material on the floor of the compartment to let more air escape..
I looked further around and found this video from Poorcha showing ZR1 wheel well, and it is exhausted in front of tires

Any idea if i can use ZR1 inner liner and put there instead of modifying the Z06 parts ?
Are they identical in all other areas ?


tia


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Old 03-14-2019, 09:32 AM
  #117  
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well, at least you can say your car is no worse than a zr1 Chevy engineers. I would assume that it is the same fitting part, BUT the zr1 does have wider fenders, so it is going to be a dice roll. I like how they pointed the the vent fins down so that rocks cant be thrown through that vent
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Old 03-15-2019, 06:12 AM
  #118  
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Several cars, inc the Audi R8 V10, lotus exige v6, 911s, etc all dump the air in front of the tires. So it can’t be that bad! Yes if you are designing a $2million duct for a F1 car yes the exit is probably more vital than the entry! But on a road / track car the added cooling capacity is probably more important than 100% maxing airflow.
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Old 03-15-2019, 11:07 AM
  #119  
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i guess i dont understand why you wouldn't just dump it in the correct spot, they already have the hole in the back corner of the cheek, toward the engine... why not just make that hole bigger?
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Old 03-16-2019, 06:01 AM
  #120  
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Fair point! I guess if you can then why not? Might be worth getting a little airflow meter to see how much air flow there is in that region at the moment? You can then prove if it’s better or not.
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