Is there demand for a mid-engine Corvette?
11-05-2018, 10:40 AM
#81
Melting Slicks
I am one of the old guys that have owned Corvettes for almost fifty years. I bought my first one when I got home from my 1st tour in Vietnam and have owned them in the good and bad years. I have three today C6Z06, C6GrandSport and a C5 track toy and do not plan on buying a new one until GM addresses quality issues that cause reliability issues. It has become even more difficult as GM has stopped supplying replacement parts. As a systems engineer for thirty years on aerospace programs I worked with reliability and maintainability as a part of product development which did give us a better product. I don't see anything about GM trying to improve the car and even on this forum I didn't read anything about a better car, just different. When GM improves the car and not just new part numbers and telling me the Kool-Aid taste great I will keep my money. KISS needs to be understood by GM designers and management as todays cars cannot be maintained by the dealerships.
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pdiddy972 (11-19-2018)
11-05-2018, 11:16 AM
#82
E-Ray, 3LZ, ZER, LIFT
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Zaro Tundov (11-05-2018)
11-05-2018, 01:39 PM
#83
Drifting
The cargo thing, I dunno. They may do something similar to Cayman and have a rear cargo area above the engine, but that's still not as much room (though with a front storage boot and a rear cargo hatch itd better than most. Will it fit golf clubs? Maybe. Will it fit a weekend beach trips worth of stuff including a big *** cooler? Probably not.
Competitive pricing is open to interpretation. If they say that the 488 is their competition and it's a bargain at 170k base, they're not lying but the car fails. They wont ne able to price it in line with the c6 due to massive research and production investments, the c7 was fundamentally a c6, which was fundamentally a c5. The savings from building off an existing platform cannot be overstated. GM has to recoup its investments, and I'm sure they know a midengine car will sell less than the previous car so they have to recoup that money over fewer units... more money. I cant see it starting at less than 100k unless it's a loss leader, and there is no reason to do something like that.
I dont think a midengine Corvette Carrie's any additional coolness factor. Midengine cara arent non existant, you can buy an mr2 for nothing. Porsche sells a lot of boosters anand caimans. Lotus struggles to sell their mid engine cars. To 99% of people, mid engine means nothing, and adds no coolness.
Competitive pricing is open to interpretation. If they say that the 488 is their competition and it's a bargain at 170k base, they're not lying but the car fails. They wont ne able to price it in line with the c6 due to massive research and production investments, the c7 was fundamentally a c6, which was fundamentally a c5. The savings from building off an existing platform cannot be overstated. GM has to recoup its investments, and I'm sure they know a midengine car will sell less than the previous car so they have to recoup that money over fewer units... more money. I cant see it starting at less than 100k unless it's a loss leader, and there is no reason to do something like that.
I dont think a midengine Corvette Carrie's any additional coolness factor. Midengine cara arent non existant, you can buy an mr2 for nothing. Porsche sells a lot of boosters anand caimans. Lotus struggles to sell their mid engine cars. To 99% of people, mid engine means nothing, and adds no coolness.
As for cargo space, we'll just have to wait and see. Those who know have been upbeat but they won't spill the beans.
I guess if a Porsche seems mundane to you then the C8 will just be another boring car. Ultimately they're all just manufactured contraptions that take you from point A to point B.
11-05-2018, 07:18 PM
#84
Advanced
I'm a young guy and what drew me Corvettes is that they dominated FIA GT for so long with their "archaic" technology-- the fact that they WEREN'T mid engines with DOHCs. I will miss the rowdy FR cars but I'm glad we got three great ones C5-7 and will look forward to owning and building a few as I get older. I'm not really interested in a mid engine high tech car but I understand that's where the world is now.
11-05-2018, 07:44 PM
#85
Team Owner
The cargo thing, I dunno. They may do something similar to Cayman and have a rear cargo area above the engine, but that's still not as much room (though with a front storage boot and a rear cargo hatch itd better than most. Will it fit golf clubs? Maybe. Will it fit a weekend beach trips worth of stuff including a big *** cooler? Probably not.
Competitive pricing is open to interpretation. If they say that the 488 is their competition and it's a bargain at 170k base, they're not lying but the car fails. They wont ne able to price it in line with the c6 due to massive research and production investments, the c7 was fundamentally a c6, which was fundamentally a c5. The savings from building off an existing platform cannot be overstated. GM has to recoup its investments, and I'm sure they know a midengine car will sell less than the previous car so they have to recoup that money over fewer units... more money. I cant see it starting at less than 100k unless it's a loss leader, and there is no reason to do something like that.
I dont think a midengine Corvette Carrie's any additional coolness factor. Midengine cara arent non existant, you can buy an mr2 for nothing. Porsche sells a lot of boosters anand caimans. Lotus struggles to sell their mid engine cars. To 99% of people, mid engine means nothing, and adds no coolness.
Competitive pricing is open to interpretation. If they say that the 488 is their competition and it's a bargain at 170k base, they're not lying but the car fails. They wont ne able to price it in line with the c6 due to massive research and production investments, the c7 was fundamentally a c6, which was fundamentally a c5. The savings from building off an existing platform cannot be overstated. GM has to recoup its investments, and I'm sure they know a midengine car will sell less than the previous car so they have to recoup that money over fewer units... more money. I cant see it starting at less than 100k unless it's a loss leader, and there is no reason to do something like that.
I dont think a midengine Corvette Carrie's any additional coolness factor. Midengine cara arent non existant, you can buy an mr2 for nothing. Porsche sells a lot of boosters anand caimans. Lotus struggles to sell their mid engine cars. To 99% of people, mid engine means nothing, and adds no coolness.
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11-06-2018, 06:35 PM
#86
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St. Jude Donor '05
Has Lotus ever sold large #s of anything out here, not sure on that one.
ME will sell like crazy, GMs going after a different crowd that doesnt complain as much imo.
Til they dumb down these electronic systems a LOT dont plan on less issues, for some reason Corvettes have always been a high maintenance car no matter what they year.
Love hate thing for em.
ME will sell like crazy, GMs going after a different crowd that doesnt complain as much imo.
Til they dumb down these electronic systems a LOT dont plan on less issues, for some reason Corvettes have always been a high maintenance car no matter what they year.
Love hate thing for em.
11-06-2018, 06:45 PM
#87
Team Owner
Has Lotus ever sold large #s of anything out here, not sure on that one.
ME will sell like crazy, GMs going after a different crowd that doesnt complain as much imo.
Til they dumb down these electronic systems a LOT dont plan on less issues, for some reason Corvettes have always been a high maintenance car no matter what they year.
Love hate thing for em.
ME will sell like crazy, GMs going after a different crowd that doesnt complain as much imo.
Til they dumb down these electronic systems a LOT dont plan on less issues, for some reason Corvettes have always been a high maintenance car no matter what they year.
Love hate thing for em.
11-06-2018, 07:13 PM
#88
Le Mans Master
11-06-2018, 07:18 PM
#89
Burning Brakes
Here is my .02,
I understand that since the C2 there have been talks about “mid engine this” and “supercar that”.
look at the track record. Chevrolet has not been very successful in any of their attempts to create a mid engine car. If it isnt broken why fix it? This European look needs to go too. The ZR1 has been capable of 755hp since its C6 re-introduction and it has set un disclosed records at Nurburgring. But Due to a “gentlemans agreement” they were black balled into cutting back the power and restrict the car from doing whatever it was designed to do. Top European manufacures couldnt believe that American Muscle at 1/3 the price was able to beat thier “super cars”. I dont believe for one minute that the FR setup is close to its peak, change the transverse springs give it a coilover set up make the car wider just my opinion. The car still has plenty and I mean plenty of room to grow.
To top all that off here is a scenario:
so picture this, you head to a chevrolet dealer and one of these Mid Engine “corvettes” are staring back at you. You decide to buy it, drive it home and park it in the garage. Ohh well now its time for an oil change. You head back to the dealer you bought it from turn the keys over and head into the “waiting room”. I dont know about you but have you seen the waiting rooms? I personally wouldn’t want to hang out in a shitty waiting room watching soap operas listening to bubba talk about his lifted Silverado and the buck he killed last night. If i spend $160-170k on a car, it isn’t going to share interior parts with a Fiero, Cruze, Volt, HHR, or Malibu.
I understand that since the C2 there have been talks about “mid engine this” and “supercar that”.
look at the track record. Chevrolet has not been very successful in any of their attempts to create a mid engine car. If it isnt broken why fix it? This European look needs to go too. The ZR1 has been capable of 755hp since its C6 re-introduction and it has set un disclosed records at Nurburgring. But Due to a “gentlemans agreement” they were black balled into cutting back the power and restrict the car from doing whatever it was designed to do. Top European manufacures couldnt believe that American Muscle at 1/3 the price was able to beat thier “super cars”. I dont believe for one minute that the FR setup is close to its peak, change the transverse springs give it a coilover set up make the car wider just my opinion. The car still has plenty and I mean plenty of room to grow.
To top all that off here is a scenario:
so picture this, you head to a chevrolet dealer and one of these Mid Engine “corvettes” are staring back at you. You decide to buy it, drive it home and park it in the garage. Ohh well now its time for an oil change. You head back to the dealer you bought it from turn the keys over and head into the “waiting room”. I dont know about you but have you seen the waiting rooms? I personally wouldn’t want to hang out in a shitty waiting room watching soap operas listening to bubba talk about his lifted Silverado and the buck he killed last night. If i spend $160-170k on a car, it isn’t going to share interior parts with a Fiero, Cruze, Volt, HHR, or Malibu.
11-06-2018, 07:29 PM
#90
Instructor
First, you DON'T have to do oil changes and services at the Chevy dealership if it's not up to your standards. Secondly, who said it ain't broken? Look at all the recent reviews about the C7 both Z06 and ZR1, ZR1 makes all the power it needs, but it's too nose heavy and can't put the power down properly, the Z06 had plenty of overheating issues, since GM was lazy enough to put 200 hp more than base model, yet leave the base model bumper with barely any opening in it. It's simple, if you don't like it, don't buy it. But to say that it ain't "broken" is wrong. ZR1 got it's *** handed to it by MotorTrend. C7 has never been a really good chassis for a lot of power.
P.S. The Corvette NEEDS a different and more exotic look.
P.S. The Corvette NEEDS a different and more exotic look.
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Zaro Tundov (11-07-2018)
11-07-2018, 10:47 AM
#91
Team Owner
11-07-2018, 11:32 AM
#92
Burning Brakes
Thread Starter
To top all that off here is a scenario:
so picture this, you head to a chevrolet dealer and one of these Mid Engine “corvettes” are staring back at you. You decide to buy it, drive it home and park it in the garage. Ohh well now its time for an oil change. You head back to the dealer you bought it from turn the keys over and head into the “waiting room”. I dont know about you but have you seen the waiting rooms? I personally wouldn’t want to hang out in a shitty waiting room watching soap operas listening to bubba talk about his lifted Silverado and the buck he killed last night. If i spend $160-170k on a car, it isn’t going to share interior parts with a Fiero, Cruze, Volt, HHR, or Malibu.
so picture this, you head to a chevrolet dealer and one of these Mid Engine “corvettes” are staring back at you. You decide to buy it, drive it home and park it in the garage. Ohh well now its time for an oil change. You head back to the dealer you bought it from turn the keys over and head into the “waiting room”. I dont know about you but have you seen the waiting rooms? I personally wouldn’t want to hang out in a shitty waiting room watching soap operas listening to bubba talk about his lifted Silverado and the buck he killed last night. If i spend $160-170k on a car, it isn’t going to share interior parts with a Fiero, Cruze, Volt, HHR, or Malibu.
You are right though. $170k and GM don't go together. It would at least have to be something from the Cadillac brand to give it some artificial status somehow and may a few techs trained on how to work on them.
Last edited by falcon5619; 11-07-2018 at 11:37 AM.
11-07-2018, 01:15 PM
#94
I would say the corvette is a GT car. As a matter fact the race version is in the GTE class formerly known as GT2. GTE stands for Grand Touring Endurance. The C6 and C7 compete against the Aston Martin Vantage, BMW M3, Farrari 458, Porsche 911 and ect
11-07-2018, 02:07 PM
#95
E-Ray, 3LZ, ZER, LIFT
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To top all that off here is a scenario:
so picture this, you head to a chevrolet dealer and one of these Mid Engine “corvettes” are staring back at you. You decide to buy it, drive it home and park it in the garage. Ohh well now its time for an oil change. You head back to the dealer you bought it from turn the keys over and head into the “waiting room”. I dont know about you but have you seen the waiting rooms? I personally wouldn’t want to hang out in a shitty waiting room watching soap operas listening to bubba talk about his lifted Silverado and the buck he killed last night. If i spend $160-170k on a car, it isn’t going to share interior parts with a Fiero, Cruze, Volt, HHR, or Malibu.
Now I admit when the wife had a Porsche Cayenne that wating room was very nice. Since the bill for an oil change was ~$250 it should have been. And frankly I’d rather talk to Bubby, whose 4 door diesel truck with every available option cost more than the Grand Sport than the snob in the Porsche waiting room who thought his new 911 still had an air cooled engine!
Last edited by JerryU; 11-07-2018 at 02:11 PM.
11-08-2018, 12:22 AM
#96
Intermediate
I agree with you. I bought my c7 last year at 43, and my buddies asked why I bought an old man car. Wanted to know if I was having a crisis. If you don't bring new enthusiasts to the table, the old ones die off and so does the product. It's past time for this. I would personally like to see corvette used like Cadillac and have multiple vehicles. Then they could really chase the big boys and remain relevant. I don't think many share my thoughts, but I'd like to see the current stingray stay, have a mid engine, a performance crossover, etc.
11-08-2018, 10:37 AM
#97
Melting Slicks
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St. Jude Donor '09-'11
Hmm, all Chevy dealers aren’t the same! The large Chevy, BMW, Mercedes Dealer in town has a large nice Chevy waiting room. Granted when I bring the wife’s BMW in for service in that wating room I get to pick the type of coffee and from a selection of snacks where the Chevy waiting room just has standard coffee! However I do all my own oil changes because it’s quicker and I know it’s done right. If in for something else as I was for my free alignment at ~400 miles on the Grand Sport my MO is to stand by the open service bay door and watch! Let the tech know there will be a tip if done right!
Now I admit when the wife had a Porsche Cayenne that wating room was very nice. Since the bill for an oil change was ~$250 it should have been. And frankly I’d rather talk to Bubby, whose 4 door diesel truck with every available option cost more than the Grand Sport than the snob in the Porsche waiting room who thought his new 911 still had an air cooled engine!
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JerryU (11-08-2018)
11-08-2018, 05:40 PM
#99
Team Owner
My C6 Z06 is nowhere near it's usable front-mid performance limit, and neither the supercharger or the coilovers will decrease it's excellent highway gas mileage, or decrease it's great cargo capacity, when I'm on a two week road trip, all over the USA..
Last edited by JoesC5; 11-08-2018 at 05:44 PM.
11-08-2018, 06:21 PM
#100
Advanced
I'm not sure they considered it, but if they did I'm guessing a huge factor was there isn't a way to fit the BMW straight 6 into a small mid engine car. Also, Toyota already has a mid engine car they are considering reviving (the MR2), and there's no need to have 2 smaller mid engine cars.
Last edited by Randy Miller; 11-08-2018 at 06:26 PM.