Notices
C8 General Discussion The place to discuss the next generation of Corvette, be it mid-engine, Zora, or whatever form it may take.
Sponsored by:
Sponsored by:

DCT and Turbo combo < C7 stick

 
Old 01-17-2019, 09:51 PM
  #21  
SBC_and_a_stick
CF Senior Member
Thread Starter
 
SBC_and_a_stick's Avatar
 
Member Since: Nov 2012
Location: North California
Posts: 4,639
Thanked 494 Times in 280 Posts
Default

Originally Posted by DocHollywood View Post
You really think a PDK 911 is boring to drive? I loved the pdks I dove, I'd take one over the tractor-pull-lever in my GS any day.
That's not what I said. The GT3 RS is not turbo. There are much better sticks than the Corvette ones.

Originally Posted by BEAR-AvHistory View Post
So much feel good BS from the buggy whip fans. MT has been done for a long time except among the great drivers who tell you they are great driver because they can push a clutch pedal. When big time racing goes back to a MT you might have a case to make. Agree that MT is fun to drive but don't see it as anything super special that separates the"real" drivers from everybody else.

Before anyone gets two out of shape I drive 3 MTs on a regular basis, also owned a 7DCT & drive an 8ZF. A 7DCT in the C8 can do nothing other than help make it a success. For people who want stick there might still be that wonderful 7MT you have now
I'd say manual is fun first and foremost. Someone that can wield a stick properly with perfect rev match and not miss a gear for a whole track day is 99.99% of the time a great driver. Such a driver can jump into any of these DCT cars with TC and AH and put down fast laps. Someone that's only driven DCT cars with TC and AH will be 100% a terrible stick driver. It takes weeks for work for even the best drivers to master rev matching and there is an adjustment period for every car after that.
SBC_and_a_stick is offline  
The Following User Says Thank You to SBC_and_a_stick For This Useful Post:
JustinStrife (01-18-2019)
Old 01-17-2019, 10:05 PM
  #22  
BEAR-AvHistory
CF Senior Member
 
BEAR-AvHistory's Avatar
 
Member Since: Jan 2019
Location: Raleigh, NC
Posts: 153
Thanked 30 Times in 24 Posts
Default

Originally Posted by SBC_and_a_stick View Post
That's not what I said. The GT3 RS is not turbo. There are much better sticks than the Corvette ones.



I'd say manual is fun first and foremost. Someone that can wield a stick properly with perfect rev match and not miss a gear for a whole track day is 99.99% of the time a great driver. Such a driver can jump into any of these DCT cars with TC and AH and put down fast laps. Someone that's only driven DCT cars with TC and AH will be 100% a terrible stick driver. It takes weeks for work for even the best drivers to master rev matching and there is an adjustment period for every car after that.
Problem with that is everyone on the internet who drives a stick is a wonderful driver, just ask them. If they were all hanging out in a bar you would need hip boots to deal with the claims. Also true a wonderful driver in a 7DCT car would also have a 99.9% chance of hosing the wonderful stick driver in a similar 6MT car.

Issue is not that its fun, drive a fun car most days, its the built in pretentious superiority of most MT drives on any car forum you might want to read.

Last edited by BEAR-AvHistory; 01-17-2019 at 10:09 PM.
BEAR-AvHistory is offline  
Old 01-18-2019, 04:33 PM
  #23  
thebishman
CF Senior Member
 
Member Since: Aug 2000
Location: Overland Park KS
Posts: 2,536
Thanked 309 Times in 229 Posts
Default

Opinions are like ‘****-holes’; everybody has one.

The OP’s opinion is but one data point, and many, many owners and manufacturers disagree with his statements re: turbocharged engines and DCTs.

Bish
thebishman is offline  
Old 01-18-2019, 05:31 PM
  #24  
painexpert
CF Senior Member
 
painexpert's Avatar
 
Member Since: Aug 2002
Posts: 409
Thanks: 0
Thanked 3 Times in 2 Posts
Default

My 2018 Porsche GT3 shifting at 9000 RPM and wailing liked a "raped ape" is good enough for me !!!!!
painexpert is offline  
The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to painexpert For This Useful Post:
ByByBMW (01-20-2019), thebishman (01-19-2019)
Old 01-18-2019, 05:47 PM
  #25  
Tool Hoarder
CF Senior Member
 
Tool Hoarder's Avatar
 
Member Since: Feb 2013
Location: Virginia Beach Virginia
Posts: 4,206
Thanked 616 Times in 381 Posts
Default

I love my C7 with auto-rev match on track. So much such that I'm making it a track car and getting a C5 vert for the street to cruise.

I'm hoping the C8 comes with a stick... I'll take a C8 spyder with a NA V8 and a stick shift.
Tool Hoarder is online now  
The Following User Says Thank You to Tool Hoarder For This Useful Post:
pdiddy972 (01-23-2019)
Old 01-18-2019, 06:23 PM
  #26  
SBC_and_a_stick
CF Senior Member
Thread Starter
 
SBC_and_a_stick's Avatar
 
Member Since: Nov 2012
Location: North California
Posts: 4,639
Thanked 494 Times in 280 Posts
Default

Originally Posted by thebishman View Post
Opinions are like Ď****-holesí; everybody has one.

The OPís opinion is but one data point, and many, many owners and manufacturers disagree with his statements re: turbocharged engines and DCTs.

Bish
Whenever I forget what an opinion is I always come back to the corvette forum. This place really defines it for me. Of all forums that define opinions the best one is...umm...wait I don't have an opinion about that. Checking below...yep, still have an ****-hole.

Many manufacturers will disagree with my opinion. For example, McLaren only makes turbo cars so I'm guessing they say turbo is the future. Ferrari makes, oh wait, both turbo and naturally aspirated engines. What's their opinion again?
SBC_and_a_stick is offline  
Old 01-18-2019, 07:54 PM
  #27  
HMDS
CF Senior Member
 
HMDS's Avatar
 
Member Since: Dec 2015
Posts: 122
Thanked 25 Times in 13 Posts
Default

I don't get out much so forgive this question.

Is there another manufacturer among those listed beside porche that offers dct and manual in the same model.

I hope that Chevy puts a manual back in at some point, as porshe did - maybe for the hot rod version - but I fear it may not be possible with space/layout constraints.
HMDS is offline  
Old 01-18-2019, 08:01 PM
  #28  
ltomn
CF Senior Member
 
ltomn's Avatar
 
Member Since: Jan 2018
Location: Mountain West
Posts: 364
Thanked 97 Times in 71 Posts
Default

Your only problem is you assume that everyone that buys one of these cars wants to take it to the track. There is a major percentage of present and future owners that have no desire to do that and a DCT will serve them with utmost efficiency.
ltomn is offline  
Old 01-18-2019, 08:10 PM
  #29  
JoesC5
CF Senior Member
 
Member Since: Sep 1999
Location: Springfield MO
Posts: 39,823
Thanked 1,294 Times in 935 Posts
Default

Originally Posted by HMDS View Post
I don't get out much so forgive this question.

Is there another manufacturer among those listed beside porche that offers dct and manual in the same model.

I hope that Chevy puts a manual back in at some point, as porshe did - maybe for the hot rod version - but I fear it may not be possible with space/layout constraints.


Porsche's manual and PDK are both supplied by ZF and many of the internal components are the same, so space/layout constraints are not a factor, if one plans ahead.



JoesC5 is offline  
Old 01-18-2019, 08:15 PM
  #30  
JoesC5
CF Senior Member
 
Member Since: Sep 1999
Location: Springfield MO
Posts: 39,823
Thanked 1,294 Times in 935 Posts
Default

Originally Posted by ltomn View Post
Your only problem is you assume that everyone that buys one of these cars wants to take it to the track. There is a major percentage of present and future owners that have no desire to do that and a DCT will serve them with utmost efficiency.
Ultra high percentage. Most won't give a **** if a mid engine Corvette with a DCT will go around a 3 mile track 0.00001 seconds quicker than a front engine Corvette with an A8 or a M7. Most of the talk about the mid engine/DCT superiority is nothing but bench racing for the 10 year old's on this forum.

JoesC5 is offline  
Old 01-18-2019, 08:52 PM
  #31  
SBC_and_a_stick
CF Senior Member
Thread Starter
 
SBC_and_a_stick's Avatar
 
Member Since: Nov 2012
Location: North California
Posts: 4,639
Thanked 494 Times in 280 Posts
Default

In this list you can see two cars that came stick: Lambo Gallardo 550-2, and the Porsche GT3 (but not the RS model). The Gallardo has been replaced by the Huracan model circa 2014, which is DCT only.

I evaluated the cars based on mixed track/street use. That's why I prefer the Lambo V10 over the GT3, because for street use I think the Lambos sound better at any throttle position. The body shape is also more to my liking. On track with the flat 6 on full boil the GT3 sounds fantastic and looks don't matter. I'd say for purely track use I'd change my choice to GT3. I wouldn't use any of them on track to be honest, I'm a big fan of ultra lights for track use not these heavy girls.

Last edited by SBC_and_a_stick; 01-18-2019 at 08:53 PM.
SBC_and_a_stick is offline  
Old 01-18-2019, 10:39 PM
  #32  
descartesfool
CF Senior Member
 
descartesfool's Avatar
 
Member Since: Dec 2013
Posts: 878
Thanked 114 Times in 70 Posts
Default

It's all a matter of opinion. I love DCT on track. I had 3 cars at the same time with manual boxes and tracked them all simultaneously, including my C7 M7. I could heel and toe with the best of them. Sold all those manual tranny cars. But at the same time as I had my C7, I also have had a Nissan GT-R, and I've done thousands of laps with it. I have never, ever missed the manual since I first got my GT-R in 2008. I was driving both my Vette and my GT-R, and whether the car had a manual of not, had a turbo or not was just not an issue for me. What I like most about a DCT is that you can take all the attention required for executing perfectly timed shifts when entering a corner to braking and turning, and you can exit the corner harder as the car can upshift mid-corner without upsettting the car. Every iota of attention required to manually shift the car can be transferred to to the parts of the driving fast. Driving a DCT on track allows you more latitude to improve your laptimes. And as for turbos, when on track you are always near the top of the engine's power band, so lag is never an issue. Sound is not so good, unless of course you are driving a car like my AMG GT-S.

I now have 3 cars with DCT's and turbos, including a 718 Cayman, and no manusl or cars with NA engines. I like my Nissan GT-R so much I ordered a new 2019 one. And my 2009 one has never ever had an issue with it's DCT, because I knew from the first day on track that it needed an extra transmission cooler, and that was fitted right quick, and DCT has been totally bullet proof. That was a first few model year issue. I am upgrading it to a newer model as they have now made the car including the DCT much smoother. And when you drive the cars in traffic on the street, the DCT's are fantastic. No more tiring clutch work in stop and go traffic. All my track buddies swear by manuals, but none of them have ever had a fast car with a DCT, except one buddy who relentlessly tracks a Viper T/A has just ordered a 2019 Porsche Turbo S and like many, many modern sports cars, it only comes with a DCT. Time will tell how he likes that compared to that big manly stick in his Viper.

The head of all Porsche GT cars, Adreas Preuninger, has an opinion about his creation, the GT3. Go to the 16 minute mark in the video on the 991.2 GT3, where he says if you want a car for the track, get the one with the PDK, and if you want to drive on the street and enjoy it, get the manual. He also says a bit earlier than that that he found it quite tiresome dealing with all the opinions about what the transmission should be, manual or PDK, so they brought back the PDK due to all the whining (my interpretation of what he said)


Now I know for guys like my track buddies including George, nothing I say will change their opinions about manuals, light cars, and NA engines, but I have a real ton of fun on track with DCT's and turbos. I do have two track buddies who each have both a Viper ACR E and an AMG GT-R, and they each like both cars on track. Your opinion may vary.
descartesfool is offline  
The Following 3 Users Say Thank You to descartesfool For This Useful Post:
BEAR-AvHistory (01-19-2019), fasttoys (01-21-2019), thebishman (01-19-2019)
Old 01-18-2019, 11:08 PM
  #33  
bebezote
CF Senior Member
 
Member Since: May 2013
Posts: 652
Thanked 35 Times in 28 Posts
Default

Originally Posted by TheSenator View Post
As an owner of a GTR I couldn't disagree more. I've driven the PDK cars, and they are were 10x smoother.
Nissan has had nearly a 10 year TSB because every GTR before 2017 would rattle itself to death.
Several threads on the forums echoing this comparison from GTR owners themselves who owned both.

A turbo V8 DCT ME car is the REASON I want to come back to Corvette.

Where is this 15K limit for DCT operational life coming from? Source?
Also, what is a "low priced exotic" in terms of definition?
AGREED

the only "track" I've ever been on is the 1320 so its very hard for me to even know what a good curvy track car is supposed to be like... my interest, and I suspect many owners also, want 1/4 mile cars and even roll racing .. ive no business trying to power slide a car into gravel or off a mountain.. but love DR's since the rotors aint gonna allow small wheel thick slicks... AWD please GM...
bebezote is offline  
Old 01-19-2019, 12:04 AM
  #34  
Michael A
CF Senior Member
 
Michael A's Avatar
 
Member Since: Jun 2001
Location: Ventura County CA
Posts: 4,068
Thanked 223 Times in 152 Posts
Default

Originally Posted by Chrisrokc View Post
You think those are boring? Just wait till every sports car is electric powered. No transmission, perfect traction, no noise and faster than anything else ever made.
Faster for about 10 minutes. Then fizzle.

Electric cars are one trick ponies.
Michael A is offline  
Old 01-19-2019, 12:11 AM
  #35  
Michael A
CF Senior Member
 
Michael A's Avatar
 
Member Since: Jun 2001
Location: Ventura County CA
Posts: 4,068
Thanked 223 Times in 152 Posts
Default

Considering how many times I hear the DCT is faster on the track, they must be giving out a lot of trophies at the HPDE events.
Michael A is offline  
Old 01-19-2019, 01:12 AM
  #36  
SBC_and_a_stick
CF Senior Member
Thread Starter
 
SBC_and_a_stick's Avatar
 
Member Since: Nov 2012
Location: North California
Posts: 4,639
Thanked 494 Times in 280 Posts
Default

Originally Posted by Michael A View Post
Considering how many times I hear the DCT is faster on the track, they must be giving out a lot of trophies at the HPDE events.
Gold I tell ya! The only time separating the first from last is a tenth of a second. That gosh darned stickshift transmission.
SBC_and_a_stick is offline  
Old 01-19-2019, 01:45 AM
  #37  
ltomn
CF Senior Member
 
ltomn's Avatar
 
Member Since: Jan 2018
Location: Mountain West
Posts: 364
Thanked 97 Times in 71 Posts
Default

Originally Posted by JoesC5 View Post
Ultra high percentage. Most won't give a **** if a mid engine Corvette with a DCT will go around a 3 mile track 0.00001 seconds quicker than a front engine Corvette with an A8 or a M7. Most of the talk about the mid engine/DCT superiority is nothing but bench racing for the 10 year old's on this forum.
I don't mean to demean those that enjoy track time. It's just that I, an old speed freak, love the hi performance cars but don't use them for hi performance.
ltomn is offline  
Old 01-19-2019, 10:21 AM
  #38  
NORTY
CF Senior Member
 
NORTY's Avatar
 
Member Since: Dec 2005
Location: Carlsbad Ca
Posts: 8,611
Thanked 39 Times in 24 Posts
Default

GM has just got to laugh at these threads. All the way to the bank. I'm not buying a C7, until I see a C8 in the plastic. Then, I'll make my decision on whether to buy another Corvette or not. Right now, I'm leaning towards "not."
NORTY is offline  
Old 01-19-2019, 01:43 PM
  #39  
TheSenator
CF Senior Member
 
TheSenator's Avatar
 
Member Since: Sep 2015
Location: Houston Tx
Posts: 140
Thanked 36 Times in 24 Posts
Default

This must be a record to have this many professional manually-driven race car drivers, in one thread.
TheSenator is offline  
Old 01-19-2019, 03:13 PM
  #40  
JoesC5
CF Senior Member
 
Member Since: Sep 1999
Location: Springfield MO
Posts: 39,823
Thanked 1,294 Times in 935 Posts
Default

Originally Posted by ltomn View Post
I don't mean to demean those that enjoy track time. It's just that I, an old speed freak, love the hi performance cars but don't use them for hi performance.
That describes 95% of Corvette owners, including me.

JoesC5 is offline  

Thread Tools
Search this Thread
Quick Reply: DCT and Turbo combo < C7 stick


Sponsored Ads
Vendor Directory

Contact Us - About Us - Archive - Advertising - Cookie Policy - Privacy Statement - Terms of Service

© 2019 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands

We are a participant in the Amazon Services LLC Associates Program, an affiliate advertising program designed to provide a means for us to earn fees by linking to Amazon.com and affiliated sites.
 
  • Ask a Question
    Get answers from community experts
Question Title:
Description:
Your question will be posted in: