When you click on links to various merchants on this site and make a purchase, this can result in this site earning a commission. Affiliate programs and affiliations include, but are not limited to, the eBay Partner Network.
Agree. The Holy Grail of achieving a first pass design is still far from being achieved by any product development company in the world.
Bill
To have a "critical path" you must first have a path... then find the items that legitimately require re-direction of resources, or re-scheduling.
Every group in a project is going to "poor-mouth" to buy slack. Some pushing of deadlines is necessary to squeeze this out, but also to flush out the legitimate problems.
More art than science, but that's how the sausage gets made. As a "halo" car the "rumored" C8 has to dazzle to do its job (which is not to improve GM's bottom line). Stubbing your toe to meet some arbitrary launch date is a recipe for failure.
IMHO, GM (and the US auto industry in general) has been so poor at this for decades that even for true believers on this site "Don't buy a first model-year car" is still embedded in car-buying mythology.
I prefer some delay for the confidence that, whenever I decide to buy, the car will be right.
My new house was scheduled to be done January, now the builder has no idea when it'll be done... nah... not delayed.[/QUOTE
Ahh, but builders live by a completely different set of rules than the rest of the planet! A price given by a builder, is a mere suggestion of what the cost might be and a completion date is a reference to a point in time in the future when something may or may not happen. I'm just jealous of builders, because my clients actually expect me to do things for the prices I quote and deliver them on dates as stated.
Apparently you and some on this forum have never heard or don't understand 'scope creep'. That is to say you order a 1 bedroom house to be built in X days, then you ask the builder to make it a 4 bedroom house. It will now be done in X + Y days.
Simple, can you understand that or do you need another explanation.
Apparently you and some on this forum have never heard or don't understand 'scope creep'. That is to say you order a 1 bedroom house to be built in X days, then you ask the builder to make it a 4 bedroom house. It will now be done in X + Y days.
Simple, can you understand that or do you need another explanation.
Well considering I'm a project manager by trade, I understand it very well. My point was simply to illustrate with the best evidence we have, that the car has been delayed. I feel it was supposed to be revealed in January. The reason for the delay could be a bunch of things ranging from a change in requirements to issues arising during testing. I am not criticizing GM for the delay... that's what they're supposed to do. Make it right, not fast. Requirements change is what plagued the NSX going from one engine configuration, I can't recall if it was a V8, to a V6TT electric front drive when they had the car nearly done. Whomever was in charge decided the car had to be a technology showcase to be relevant to the brand. That decision was a major misstep. Not only did it draw out the development of the car, it made the car into something the market didn't want.
Curious, what evidence do we have that it is delayed?
If August comes around and no C8, then maybe it is delayed..
There has not been one official comment about the car or delay from GM.
Plant tours were scheduled to re-start in January, now they are delayed indefinitely. They halted tours to do the new paint shop and plant expansion and now they're building the test C8s and testing production engineering. They couldn't re-open to the public when the expansion and paint shop were done because the C8 early development was underway. They could only re-open when the C8 was public. If the C8 wasn't supposed to be revealed by January they would have never advertised that date.
It's a stupid argument anyway. The car was announced in Jan 2013. It wasn't secret any more. By late summer there were tons of photos of totally uncovered, production spec cars. Even if for some unknown reason there were still camo cars running around at that time, the presence of the production ready and fully public cars would have made it a moot point.
Here is Aug 2013 - C7 still running around in Camo. Delayed? NO.
Camo wrapping? Eh, you'll still see that after a reveal, its a pain to rip off and to be completely honest it isn't unusual for every body panel under it to be a different color. Some people enjoy taking it off though.
The big black body panels? We don't even like keeping those on when we are required to, those don't stay on a moment longer than required by the OEM. It is loud while driving, annoying, is prone to being lost anyhow, and is a pain to open any body paneling that is covered by it (hoods, rear hatch, etc). We're generally ripping that crap off while the reveal is going on :thumbs;
Plant tours were scheduled to re-start in January, now they are delayed indefinitely. They halted tours to do the new paint shop and plant expansion and now they're building the test C8s and testing production engineering. They couldn't re-open to the public when the expansion and paint shop were done because the C8 early development was underway. They could only re-open when the C8 was public. If the C8 wasn't supposed to be revealed by January they would have never advertised that date.
Since NCM is not a GM entity, I think they simply failed to clearly communicate with GM, and made an assumption on when plant tours could definitely resume based upon an optimistic guess by someone probably at the BGA plant. In short, someone at NCM blew it, misinterpreted or failed to determine what GM's official position actually was, and it should always have been TBD. That simply means the aggressive internal timeline has probably slipped based upon test results, but that's completely normal in every major project.
The C8 was never going to be revealed in January (nor earlier). I feel the ME excitement too, but our excitement does not mean that our wishing was ever GM’s reality.
The C8 was never going to be revealed in January (nor earlier). I feel the ME excitement too, but our excitement does not mean that our wishing was ever GM’s reality.
So GM intentionally and knowingly scheduled the key fob FCC filing, and a firmware release, both containing C8 logos, to go public prior to January. The museum was told plant tours would re-open in January,only to later change it to "unknown". But you're still going to say January was never the intent.
The evidence we have at hand is at odds with your claims.
The evidence we have at hand is at odds with your claims.
Interestingly, all other Chevys, except Corvette, already have their 2019 final order dates, 2020 initial order acceptance dates and 2020 production start dates. https://www.donlen.com/buildstart-chevy.html
Corvette is TBD on all future dates so nothing is scheduled to happen. Corvette is in a twilight zone on future production at this point.
So GM intentionally and knowingly scheduled the key fob FCC filing, and a firmware release, both containing C8 logos, to go public prior to January. The museum was told plant tours would re-open in January,only to later change it to "unknown". But you're still going to say January was never the intent.
The evidence we have at hand is at odds with your claims.
How do you know that someone at the top of GM told the NCM that plant tours could resume in January 2019? Isn't it just possible that someone at NCM asked a buddy at BGA when they might resume plant tours, and were told "probably January 19," and NCM didn't verify that with GM corporate and ran with it. This kind of sloppy communication goes on all the time everywhere.
However, this is all just speculation, but I find it amazing that people are making such a big deal out of the NCM plant tour thing. NCM has no official affiliation with GM, and I seriously doubt they have any senior exec connections to GM corporate at the Renaissance Center in Detroit.
It could easily be the same deal with the key fob. It is not at all unusual for the left hand to not know what the right hand is doing in a large organization.
How do you know that someone at the top of GM told the NCM the museum, plant tours could resume in January 2019? Isn't it just possible that someone at NCM asked someone at BGA when they might resume plant tours, and were told "probably January 19," and NCM didn't verify that with GM corporate and ran with it. This kind of sloppy communication goes on all the time everywhere.
However, this is all just speculation, and I find it amazing that people are putting so much so much stock in the NCM plant tour. NCM has no official affiliation with GM.
It could easily be the same deal with the key fob. It is not at all unusual for the left hand to not know what the right hand is doing in a large corporation.
I'd agree with you if we took any one of those things in isolation. But all of them, together? Along with the recently leaked (lack of) ordering info? I'm just not buying the idea that everything is just peachy and on schedule.
If it's late, then so be it. GM certainly doesn't owe us any explanations regarding an unannounced product. But what I can't understand is why a certain few people here seem hell bent on making excuses for GM in the face of mounting evidence to the contrary. It's getting a little weird.
Yes, there certainly is circumstantial evidence to suggest that some original, internal timetable has probably slipped. It is also clear that is true of virtually every single major new product development project in history in every industry. That why internal timetables are kept as secret as possible, but there are almost always little cracks in the secrecy veil.
The ONLY thing that is actually significant is that GM has made no announcements or promises regarding said project. Geez . . . people need to chill.
I'm certainly not making excuses for GM, and I've never had any relationship with them. I have no brand loyalty to them having purchased cars and trucks from virtually every manufacturer both foreign and domestic. I've just lived through this process a number of times in my career and am trying to explain reality to those who have not. People are making mountains out of mole hills.
What else should we do with our time? Start yet another argument about the shape of the side scoop? Maybe some stupid discussion on how hard it'll be to change the oil? I'm surprised nobody has started a thread asking how much it'll cost to put PPF on this thing.
Plant tours were scheduled to re-start in January, now they are delayed indefinitely. They halted tours to do the new paint shop and plant expansion and now they're building the test C8s and testing production engineering. They couldn't re-open to the public when the expansion and paint shop were done because the C8 early development was underway. They could only re-open when the C8 was public. If the C8 wasn't supposed to be revealed by January they would have never advertised that date.
AFAIK, GM has never got a new Corvette into production when planned. We should be used to that.
But with the exception of the "1983 C4 Corvette", there has never been such a significant delay so near to what appeared to be the release date. Even the delay of the C3 from 1967 to 1968 came early enough that the C2 had noticeable changes when extended from 1966 to 1967, instead of a two year production for one model year like we are headed for now.
When the C8 history is eventually written, I'm confident there will be a chapter about the "delayed release in 2019".
Interesting, but not a big deal.
What's more significant is the reason for the delay.
Unresolved problems with the intended design?
Upgrades, like to the electrical system or engine power?
Adding some partial electric drive?
Etc?
The reason(s) for the delay and how they are handled could produce a C8 that's a real winner or a real turkey. That's far more important than a delay of a few months, and we'll just have to wait.
The big problem with that logic is that it assumes the NCM, which has no official GM affiliation, actually carefully coordinated with the right people at GM. My theory is that they asked someone at BGA who gave them a WAG, and they went with it without official GM confirmation and ended up with egg on face.
The big problem with that logic is that it assumes the NCM, which has no official GM affiliation, actually carefully coordinated with the right people at GM. My theory is that they asked someone at BGA who gave them a WAG, and they went with it without official GM confirmation and ended up with egg on face.
Could it be that the C8 is ahead of schedule rather than delayed. Maybe, just maybe, the NCM posted a Jan restart date as the factory enlargement would have been completed and the C7 would be moving on towards its 2020 model year. The C8 may have been projected for a 2021 model, but they were ahead of schedule and the factory tours could not resume as there were too many C8 parts all over the factory. Just saying, maybe.
02-26-2019, 01:00 PM
