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C8's new electronics system

 
Old 05-20-2019, 06:24 PM
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PCMIII
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Default C8's new electronics system

The Digital Vehicle Platform, will be on nearly all GM vehicles, debuting in new models as they replace the current ones. It will be able to handle 4.5 terabytes of data an hour, five times as much as today. GM developed advanced cyber security systems for the architecture, including assaults by “red team” hackers probing for weaknesses and benchmarking aviation and defense systems. The architecture includes wiring and electronic control units throughout the car in what compares to a distributed computing network.

Digital Vehicle Architecture is likely to run electronics of the eagerly awaited mid-engine Chevrolet Corvette that debuts in July. More than 300 electrical engineers working in GM’s tech center in Warren and its proving ground in Milford worked on the system. GM has more than 100 patents on it. Benefits from the new system go way beyond current buzz words like “autonomy” and “driver assistance.” Over-the-air software updates will allow GM to improve engine performance, fuel economy, ride comfort, steering, navigation and almost every feature on a vehicle, possibly even including updates for safety standards that come into effect years after the vehicle was built. https://www.freep.com/story/money/ca...ms/3736468002/

This system of computers and electronics should make the C8 state of the art, well beyond what Tesla has done. Obviously some questions about reliability are going to be raised. Good luck to GM.

Last edited by PCMIII; 05-20-2019 at 06:25 PM.
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Old 05-20-2019, 06:28 PM
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And this is supposed to come on a $62,000 car? Along with a number of other new features that add significantly to the cost of it!
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Old 05-20-2019, 06:34 PM
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Sounds like a nightmare. My car will now be less reliable than my cell phone.

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Old 05-20-2019, 06:44 PM
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Originally Posted by ltomn View Post
And this is supposed to come on a $62,000 car? Along with a number of other new features that add significantly to the cost of it!
If it's being developed for all future GM vehicles, this is irrelevant. If it is SPECIFICALLY and ONLY for the C8, then I agree that it would have a massive impact on price. However, that's not what this is and it will become the new platform and, therefore, be costed across all future models. That is, it won't have much price impact on any individual car model.

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Old 05-20-2019, 06:49 PM
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Could definitely be a nightmare, but it is the future of the automobile industry. I definitely expect glitches. Dealerships will need to be staffed with Geek squads.

This is most likely the biggest technology advancement to the V8 Corvette, but because the cost of this technology will be shared across the GM family of products, I don’t see any over the top cost to the C8 Corvette buyer. Nothing to indicate the C8 will cost more than maybe 10% more than a comparable C7.
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Old 05-20-2019, 06:51 PM
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big brother is watching you

no more car mods
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Old 05-20-2019, 06:54 PM
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Originally Posted by PCMIII View Post
This system of computers and electronics should make the C8 state of the art, well beyond what Tesla has done. Obviously some questions about reliability are going to be raised. Good luck to GM.
Tesla can already update and add new features remotely. Specifically how does this system go "well beyond" what Tesla has done? Or is that someone's wishful thinking with nothing to back it up?
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Old 05-20-2019, 06:59 PM
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Lots of painful issues will come from this - forget mods, on the 2019 Chrysler products, you can't even use an OBDII code reader to clear codes and CELs, the new system requires the car authenticate with a cloud based FCA server through dealership engine computer link, to even get into the part of the ECU that allows you to clear codes. This new GM system will surely be similar, perhaps even more advanced. And the black box data logging of your driving habits et al, will be huge. I wonder if GM will claim the right to upload and sell that data from your car - for marketing purposes. My bet is yes.
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Old 05-20-2019, 07:01 PM
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Originally Posted by mschuyler View Post
Tesla can already update and add new features remotely. Specifically how does this system go "well beyond" what Tesla has done? Or is that someone's wishful thinking with nothing to back it up?
How many terabytes of data per hour does a Tesla process? GM also has 100 patents on this system. Obviously, you have no facts.
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Old 05-20-2019, 07:08 PM
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Originally Posted by mschuyler View Post
Tesla can already update and add new features remotely.
You say that like it is a good thing, it is not. It now transforms a car to an unstable software product (all SW products are) and opens the car to being hacked. It is absurd.

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Old 05-20-2019, 07:17 PM
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The level of negativism here is amazing. My suggestion, donít buy a C8!

(That will leave plenty of C8ís for me to pick from next Spring.).
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Old 05-20-2019, 07:19 PM
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Originally Posted by BIG Dave View Post
The level of negativism here is amazing. My suggestion, donít buy a C8!

(That will leave plenty of C8ís for me to pick from next Spring.).
When you car pukes at an intersection and is rear ended by an f350 and your family ends up in the hospital check back here with an update.

yes... Teslaís have died in the middle of the street during updates.

Last edited by NY09C6; 05-20-2019 at 07:23 PM.
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Old 05-20-2019, 07:25 PM
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If the C8 is the lead car for GM on this technology, it sure would explain the alleged "delay" in introduction of the C8 because of "electrical" problems.

It might even explain the Vett that couldn't be restarted and had to be hauled off on a truck. Was that a computer glitch? Is the computer located under the front hood? Couldn't the team "re-boot" the system?

For sure, this intro would cause a bunch of folks to consider delaying purchase until the "bugs" are worked out which IMO will never happen. This level of technology will need an entire rethink on the part of the customer on the subjects of reliability, maintenance, repair and acceptable dependability.

There's a very old joke about a meeting between Bill Ford (senior) and Bill Gates. Gates is criticizing Ford. "If you made the performance improvements in cars that we've made in computers, cars would get 100 mpg, cost $1,000, create no pollution and last 10 years." Bill Ford thinks for a minute and then says "Ya, but would you want your car to "crash" a 10 times a day?"

Well do you? And what makes you think this system won't crash 10 times a day?

Last old story. Chrysler moved several engineers from the space program to their auto program when computers were first introduced on cars. Modern cars have a LOT of computer controls integrated into their systems, including engines. The biggest shock and challenge for the engineers was that the auto program had MUCH HIGHER reliability requirements.

In case you haven't guessed this scares the stuffings out of me.
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Old 05-20-2019, 07:29 PM
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Originally Posted by NY09C6 View Post
When you car pukes at an intersection and is rear ended by an f350 and your family ends up in the hospital check back here with an update.

yes... Teslaís have died in the middle of the street during updates.
So have Fords with those crappy DCTs they built, but many very loud GM apologists said that was no reason for concern either.
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Old 05-20-2019, 07:31 PM
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Originally Posted by BIG Dave View Post
The level of negativism here is amazing. My suggestion, donít buy a C8!

(That will leave plenty of C8ís for me to pick from next Spring.).

What makes you think any of the sky is falling guys are going to buy one in the first place? They read like people who are unhappy their older cars are no longer the pick of the litter but can't get a new one.
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Old 05-20-2019, 07:33 PM
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Originally Posted by Jeff V. View Post
So have Fords with those crappy DCTs they built, but many very loud GM apologists said that was no reason for concern either.
A DCT with an ECM that supports and over the air update is about as bad as it gets until self driving tech is added in X years from now.

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Old 05-20-2019, 08:46 PM
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Originally Posted by PCMIII View Post
How many terabytes of data per hour does a Tesla process? GM also has 100 patents on this system. Obviously, you have no facts.
I am asking you to provide some facts. How, specifically, is Tesla better than GM's system? It's great GM has 100 patents. Although I'm not surprised, So? What are they? Tesla open sources theirs. Did GM? And what specifically do you mean by "terabytes per hour"? What do those terabytes contain? Are they for one car or a centralized server? Are they processing technical information to let the car run better, or are they uploading marketing data to GM? "Terabytes per hour" is a useless statistic unless you can tell what is being processed and how that improves performance. It's YOUR claim that GM is far better than Tesla, therefore the onus is upon YOU to prove what you say, not mine. What do you base your statements on? Anything?

Originally Posted by NY09C6 View Post
You say that like it is a good thing, it is not. It now transforms a car to an unstable software product (all SW products are) and opens the car to being hacked. It is absurd.
Cars are ALREADY "unstable software products." In five years you will be complaining if a car does NOT have this capability. The need to install a USB drive for a simple software update - or visit a dealer, for God's sake, (like for the MSRC upgrade) is what will be considered absurd. Oh, and be sure to invoke the Boogeyman Hacker to scare the little children. Maybe the Russians will do it!

Last edited by Steven Bell; 05-20-2019 at 11:00 PM. Reason: Merged Posts - Please use the Multi Quote button to make your responses look like this.
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Old 05-20-2019, 09:02 PM
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Originally Posted by NY09C6 View Post
You say that like it is a good thing, it is not. It now transforms a car to an unstable software product (all SW products are) and opens the car to being hacked. It is absurd.
Just as my original 2005 Sonos system has had over the air updates for 14 years, so has my Tesla Model 3 for almost a year now. I am a huge fan of my purchases improving over the years at no extra cost. Its the future, its called progress, and frankly I think its a good thing. The worlds banking, utilities, energy grids, etc. are all vulnerable to hacking as well. I wont stop using them do to this concern either. -IMO/YMMV
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Old 05-20-2019, 09:21 PM
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300 engineers and a few shop mechanics to fix built in problems, help
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Old 05-20-2019, 09:23 PM
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Originally Posted by mschuyler View Post
Cars are ALREADY "unstable software products." In five years you will be complaining if a car does NOT have this capability. The need to install a USB drive for a simple software update - or visit a dealer, for God's sake, (like for the MSRC upgrade) is what will be considered absurd. Oh, and be sure to invoke the Boogeyman Hacker to scare the little children. Maybe the Russians will do it!
My cars are not and will not be.

progress is however great. this is not progress.

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