Flat plane crank V8 vs LT2 V8 reliability
Thread Starter
Racer
Joined: Sep 2015
Posts: 286
Likes: 61
From: traverse City, MI
Thread Starter
Racer
Joined: Sep 2015
Posts: 286
Likes: 61
From: traverse City, MI
l think what makes the answer difficult is that nobody has mass produced a 600 HP NA FPC V8 over 5L. So there are no exact points of reference. If we assume the displacement is 5.5l and that GM can overcome FPC vibration issues for an engine that size, extrapolating the Ford voodoo 5.2l v8 power would give a 5.5l 558hp & 453tq. If you stretch that to 600hp you are going to move the power band higher with HP peaks in 8000rpm range and torque probably lower in number with peak in the 5000rpm range. Saying this because you would probably need a shorter intake track that’s has been tuned for higher rpm airflow vs low/midrange. Also your cams will have to be more optimized for top end. The best advice I could give would be to drive a current Shelby gt350. A Z06 with 600hp NA is going to feel more “peaky” than the Ford but the Gt350 would give the sensation of what a larger FPC engine feels like. Good luck on your choice.
Burning Brakes
Joined: Aug 2019
Posts: 1,085
Likes: 582
The talk of electric motors up front are being spoken about for the Zora if it ever really lives and would run $150k+
What I'm talking about or trying to get info about is the probable 600hp NA flat plane in the Z06 not a ZR1 which might likely be twin turbo or the ZORA which might add the electric motor to a ZR1 setup. The reason I'm asking is I am on the verge of cancelling my Z51 vert order and putting down $ for a Z06. I just don't want to lose low end back road fun performance even though the FPC 600hp would be way better on a track, I wouldn't track it more than a couple of times a yr.
What I'm talking about or trying to get info about is the probable 600hp NA flat plane in the Z06 not a ZR1 which might likely be twin turbo or the ZORA which might add the electric motor to a ZR1 setup. The reason I'm asking is I am on the verge of cancelling my Z51 vert order and putting down $ for a Z06. I just don't want to lose low end back road fun performance even though the FPC 600hp would be way better on a track, I wouldn't track it more than a couple of times a yr.
I,m thinking the z06 would be the FPC motor, with the electric motors. Zora would be the twin turbo, with the electric motors.
Pro
Joined: Jul 2019
Posts: 573
Likes: 358
Le Mans Master
Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 6,559
Likes: 4,501
From: North Dallas 40 TX
I recently saw a youtube vlog can't remember from who, but any way the guy says he doesn't think the flat plane crank motor, (likely in the Z06 and up) will hold up nearly as well at the LT2, as the Flat Plan design is inherently weaker. I don't pretend to be knowledgeable in this area would like to know what others with actual expertise in this area think. I hope this has not already been posted as it really brings out the trolls. If it has just ignore it.
Last edited by Racer X; Nov 16, 2019 at 12:52 AM.
Burning Brakes
Joined: Aug 2019
Posts: 1,085
Likes: 582
Race Director
Joined: Oct 2008
Posts: 16,671
Likes: 7,738
From: NJ
I fear the fpc. Now it can be salvaged (in my book) with being force induction. That is the thing it will need to satisfy those of use coming from the last 2 gen Z06's as even the LS7 was no slouch low in the revs. And the C7Z is an animal even under 3k having so much torque it feels and drives nothing like an LT1 car (the LT1 accelerates like Honda vtec v the LT4 a sbc). Both are quick but one is in another league.
You're not going to get that out of an NA fpc given the LT2 at 495/470..
You're not going to get that out of an NA fpc given the LT2 at 495/470..
Corvette Stories
The Best of Corvette for Corvette Enthusiasts
Top 10 Most Expensive Corvettes Ever Sold on Bring A Trailer
Brett Foote
10 Things Every Corvette Owner Needs (2026 Edition)
Michael S. Palmer
8 Most "Only Corvette Owners Understand" Quirks and Problems
Pouria Savadkouei
10 Reasons the C6 Z06 is Still A Performance Benchmark After 20 Years
Joe Kucinski
How Much Horsepower Every Corvette Engine "LOST" in 1972
Joe Kucinski
Top 10 DOs and DON'Ts for Protecting Your Convertible Top!
Michael S. Palmer
Top 10 Most Explosive Corvettes Ever Made: Power-to-Weight Ratio Ranked!
Joe Kucinski
150 hp to 1,250 hp: Every Corvette Generation Compared by the Specs That Matter
Joe Kucinski
8 Coolest Corvette Pace Cars (and Replicas) of All Time
Verdad Gallardo
Thread Starter
Racer
Joined: Sep 2015
Posts: 286
Likes: 61
From: traverse City, MI
I fear the fpc. Now it can be salvaged (in my book) with being force induction. That is the thing it will need to satisfy those of use coming from the last 2 gen Z06's as even the LS7 was no slouch low in the revs. And the C7Z is an animal even under 3k having so much torque it feels and drives nothing like an LT1 car (the LT1 accelerates like Honda vtec v the LT4 a sbc). Both are quick but one is in another league.
You're not going to get that out of an NA fpc given the LT2 at 495/470..
You're not going to get that out of an NA fpc given the LT2 at 495/470..
Thread Starter
Racer
Joined: Sep 2015
Posts: 286
Likes: 61
From: traverse City, MI
If that's the case then the Z will be running no more than 600hp the zR1 the same. I think either your wrong or they will beef up the DCT they are not going to put out substantially lower HP TQ cars than previous gens. A 650/650 in the Z matching the C7 wouldn't surprise me either.
Last edited by mdull; Nov 17, 2019 at 02:54 AM.
Le Mans Master
Joined: Sep 2012
Posts: 5,350
Likes: 91
If that's the case then the Z will be running no more than 600hp the zR1 the same. I think either your wrong or they will beef up the DCT they are not going to put out substantially lower HP TQ cars than previous gens. A 650/650 in the Z matching the C7 wouldn't surprise me either.
It is simple logic that they will upgrade the new LT2 block to the previous 4/5 standards and harness the incredible torque curves that they have to produce acceleration never before seen in a corvette. The HP/Torque numbers should be even slightly higher than in the C7 because of their reportedly “better flow”.
The ratios in the DCT will have to change as well, and the C8 Z cars will not see the relative drop in performance at the high end that the base model is encountering.
This should allow them to launch the Z06 and ZR1 earlier in this cycle than otherwise.
The big question is, how do they control the incredible acceleration and speed that these cars will be able to generate.
They are going to have their work cut out for them to get the handling and braking to match them.
This should not preclude their efforts to develop some new FPC platform as they develop these low fruit. This could lead to the imagined “Zora”.
Thread Starter
Racer
Joined: Sep 2015
Posts: 286
Likes: 61
From: traverse City, MI
They will undoubtedly do whatever it takes for the DCT to handle much higher loads.
It is simple logic that they will upgrade the new LT2 block to the previous 4/5 standards and harness the incredible torque curves that they have to produce acceleration never before seen in a corvette. The HP/Torque numbers should be even slightly higher than in the C7 because of their reportedly “better flow”.
The ratios in the DCT will have to change as well, and the C8 Z cars will not see the relative drop in performance at the high end that the base model is encountering.
This should allow them to launch the Z06 and ZR1 earlier in this cycle than otherwise.
The big question is, how do they control the incredible acceleration and speed that these cars will be able to generate.
They are going to have their work cut out for them to get the handling and braking to match them.
This should not preclude their efforts to develop some new FPC platform as they develop these low fruit. This could lead to the imagined “Zora”.
It is simple logic that they will upgrade the new LT2 block to the previous 4/5 standards and harness the incredible torque curves that they have to produce acceleration never before seen in a corvette. The HP/Torque numbers should be even slightly higher than in the C7 because of their reportedly “better flow”.
The ratios in the DCT will have to change as well, and the C8 Z cars will not see the relative drop in performance at the high end that the base model is encountering.
This should allow them to launch the Z06 and ZR1 earlier in this cycle than otherwise.
The big question is, how do they control the incredible acceleration and speed that these cars will be able to generate.
They are going to have their work cut out for them to get the handling and braking to match them.
This should not preclude their efforts to develop some new FPC platform as they develop these low fruit. This could lead to the imagined “Zora”.
Le Mans Master
Joined: Dec 2000
Posts: 9,917
Likes: 1,877
From: Hot Springs AR
Wait for the C8R debut
mdull,
I think we're going to learn a lot indirectly about Chevy's plans for the upgraded C8s by January. When the C8R debuts (which we know is a flat plane), we'll learn if it's going to be an overhead cam or a pushrod engine. Due to IMSA rules the engines run have to be "based" upon a production engine. Not saying they have to BE a production engine, but just based on one. Since (IMO) the design of the engine is significantly different for a OHC vs. a pushrod engine, that should give us a really good clue as to which way the Z06/ZR1/whatever C8 models will go.
As far as driveability goes, I really, REALLY, hope that they don't sacrifice low end torque; that's where we live from day to day. I've driven an S2000 before, and the wait to get into the powerband just numbed the brain.
So, hang on to your allocation; you may get a lot clearer picture in January.
Have a good one,
Mike
I think we're going to learn a lot indirectly about Chevy's plans for the upgraded C8s by January. When the C8R debuts (which we know is a flat plane), we'll learn if it's going to be an overhead cam or a pushrod engine. Due to IMSA rules the engines run have to be "based" upon a production engine. Not saying they have to BE a production engine, but just based on one. Since (IMO) the design of the engine is significantly different for a OHC vs. a pushrod engine, that should give us a really good clue as to which way the Z06/ZR1/whatever C8 models will go.
As far as driveability goes, I really, REALLY, hope that they don't sacrifice low end torque; that's where we live from day to day. I've driven an S2000 before, and the wait to get into the powerband just numbed the brain.
So, hang on to your allocation; you may get a lot clearer picture in January.
Have a good one,
Mike
Le Mans Master
Joined: Aug 2013
Posts: 5,969
Likes: 1,410
Just do a regular v8 with turbos...what is everyone fantasizing about with this flat plane crap. It has a dct now - there is no need to rev to 15,000. Can still go overhead cams but people will complain more about fpc than they did on the c7 tail lights lol
The Consigliere
Joined: May 2006
Posts: 23,003
Likes: 6,045
From: 2023 Z06 & 2010 ZR1
The marketers have really succeeded with their seduction regarding FPC.
Every modern 4 cylinder and V6 engine in econoboxes and minivans has a FPC. It isn't some magical device. It's simply one approach that could be used in a V8, and it comes with real drawbacks, particularly with higher displacements in that application.
I really hope they don't put a FPC in the higher hp variants.
Every modern 4 cylinder and V6 engine in econoboxes and minivans has a FPC. It isn't some magical device. It's simply one approach that could be used in a V8, and it comes with real drawbacks, particularly with higher displacements in that application.
I really hope they don't put a FPC in the higher hp variants.
Tech Contributor
Joined: Mar 1999
Posts: 10,445
Likes: 4,403
From: Northern VA
"Ask Tadge" Producer
The Consigliere
Joined: May 2006
Posts: 23,003
Likes: 6,045
From: 2023 Z06 & 2010 ZR1
Drifting
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 1,372
Likes: 311
From: Bristol, VT
mdull,
I think we're going to learn a lot indirectly about Chevy's plans for the upgraded C8s by January. When the C8R debuts (which we know is a flat plane), we'll learn if it's going to be an overhead cam or a pushrod engine. Due to IMSA rules the engines run have to be "based" upon a production engine. Not saying they have to BE a production engine, but just based on one. Since (IMO) the design of the engine is significantly different for a OHC vs. a pushrod engine, that should give us a really good clue as to which way the Z06/ZR1/whatever C8 models will go.
As far as driveability goes, I really, REALLY, hope that they don't sacrifice low end torque; that's where we live from day to day. I've driven an S2000 before, and the wait to get into the powerband just numbed the brain.
So, hang on to your allocation; you may get a lot clearer picture in January.
Have a good one,
Mike
I think we're going to learn a lot indirectly about Chevy's plans for the upgraded C8s by January. When the C8R debuts (which we know is a flat plane), we'll learn if it's going to be an overhead cam or a pushrod engine. Due to IMSA rules the engines run have to be "based" upon a production engine. Not saying they have to BE a production engine, but just based on one. Since (IMO) the design of the engine is significantly different for a OHC vs. a pushrod engine, that should give us a really good clue as to which way the Z06/ZR1/whatever C8 models will go.
As far as driveability goes, I really, REALLY, hope that they don't sacrifice low end torque; that's where we live from day to day. I've driven an S2000 before, and the wait to get into the powerband just numbed the brain.
So, hang on to your allocation; you may get a lot clearer picture in January.
Have a good one,
Mike