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Apologies if this has been asked and answered but is this gizmo really necessary? Don't mean to be a party pooper but seems like the engineers at GM would have thought about this as a potential issue? Hard to know what's real and what's just a gimmick to make money. No disrespect to Paragon because their stuff generally seems pretty cool but an oil catch can? And since I have an HTC as we know getting to this can to "check the level regularly" is quite the ordeal. And how do you know when/if you should check the level? What happens if it overflows? Anyone have actual real-world thoughts on this?
Simple answer, no, they are not necessary. They're hardly ever even desirable and often times cause more problems than they solve. The GM engineers put a lot I'd effort into designing an effective crankcase ventilation system for the LT2 dry sump.
Apologies if this has been asked and answered but is this gizmo really necessary? Don't mean to be a party pooper but seems like the engineers at GM would have thought about this as a potential issue? Hard to know what's real and what's just a gimmick to make money. No disrespect to Paragon because their stuff generally seems pretty cool but an oil catch can? And since I have an HTC as we know getting to this can to "check the level regularly" is quite the ordeal. And how do you know when/if you should check the level? What happens if it overflows? Anyone have actual real-world thoughts on this?
It was very easy to mount this catch can using two existing (but unused) threaded holes of a 2020 C8 Z51. Note that the MIGHTYMOUSE Solutions model catch can has a clear viewing port to check for any fluid contents but in ~6,200 miles I've not had to drain any fluid from it!! Those GM engineers have done a great job of controlling blowby on the dry sump small block LT2 engine. Catch Can with a viewing port
Last edited by Jacques Albrecht; Dec 30, 2021 at 05:52 AM.
Reason: correct an error
It is not necessary on the C8, and I was a little disappointed to see Paragon produce this. I love the rest of their stuff, but this felt like a cash grab.
It is not necessary on the C8, and I was a little disappointed to see Paragon produce this. I love the rest of their stuff, but this felt like a cash grab.
Funny you mention that...I thought exactly the same. They put some legit engineering effort into the majority of their products, but this is definitely one as you said, although it looks well-designed and very OEM in fitment, that seems to be a cash-grab. Looking through their catalog a bit further I do realize they have some other rather "ricer" type products beyond this such as the colorful cap covers and the billet engine bay braces. All good though, as a company they have a solid customer base and if people are willing to buy it, might as well offer it!
I bought their lowering wrenches and plan to get their high-flow cats eventually as well. Their air filter shootout test really impressed me so I'd like to support them where I can!
Go over to the C7 forum and you can read hundreds of posts arguing about catch cans. One fact:
They DO catch oil vapors from the PCV system that would otherwise pass over the hot intake valves. This is true on both the LT1 and LT2. Not arguable.
And in spite of what some will say about the dry sump tank in the C8 eliminating this issue, it does not. The hose from the PCV valve goes directly into the intake manifold, not the dry sump tank.
How much of a problem these vapors cause is subject to much debate. On some direct injection cars (particularly some VWs and BMWs the coking on the backs of the valves was extreme. To the point they valves needed to be shell blasted to clean them. That doesn't seem to be the case on the Corvette engines, but I've not seen any high mileage engines opened up and the valves inspected to see.
I sold my C7 Z51 (dry sump) after 7 years/70k miles, swapped intake manifolds multiple times, zero coking issues ever witnessed. While it's been a problem for BMW in the past, it's never been a problem for GM V8s. Even GM's first DI engine (2.4L I4) haven't experienced coking issues and with those engines going in the Terrain & Equinox they get miles piled on them for the past decade+.
Simple answer, no, they are not necessary. They're hardly ever even desirable and often times cause more problems than they solve. The GM engineers put a lot I'd effort into designing an effective crankcase ventilation system for the LT2 dry sump.
Have you ever had a CC? How do you know they create more problems? As for me I had one on my C7 I would take a 3 - 4 week road trip every summer round trips of 5,000 - 7,000 miles when I returned home my outer exhaust tips were not black at all and the CC captured a lot of nasty looking stuff yet the return tube was oil free. The other thing I noticed even though It was a higher mileage C7 the engine idle was smooth, no rough idling. Coherence? I think not.
Have you ever had a CC? How do you know they create more problems?
I sure have; been there done that. After hundreds if not thousands of hours worth of dyno time over 2+ decades of building, modifying, & tuning cars, doing dyno shootouts, back-to-backing various aftermarket components, etc. I've learned a few lessons the hard way along with helping countless others troubleshoot along the way.
Is it necessary, no. Does it prevent some dirty crankcase ventilation from getting into your intake tract, definitely. I ran one on my Camaro SS (LT1 motor) like thousands of others have done on the direct injection platform and its was one of the first things I did on my C8. I am happy with my choice.
Is it necessary, no. Does it prevent some dirty crankcase ventilation from getting into your intake tract, definitely. I ran one on my Camaro SS (LT1 motor) like thousands of others have done on the direct injection platform and its was one of the first things I did on my C8. I am happy with my choice.
Really appreciate all the comments. My question still remains. Does the benefit of this device outweigh the pain in the *** aggravation when attached to a HTC. On the coupe it seems pretty easy to inspect the can and empty as needed. For the HTC it’s a bit of a movie to remove the 19 screws necessary to remove the engine cover just to access the oil catch can. I realize that it might be an ideal device but does the alleged value it provides make it worth it? I have never had a reason to remove the engine cover on my HTC. This would create a reason which I don’t look forward to. So my question still stands. Does the benefit outweigh the costs?
Really appreciate all the comments. My question still remains. Does the benefit of this device outweigh the pain in the *** aggravation when attached to a HTC. On the coupe it seems pretty easy to inspect the can and empty as needed. For the HTC it’s a bit of a movie to remove the 19 screws necessary to remove the engine cover just to access the oil catch can. I realize that it might be an ideal device but does the alleged value it provides make it worth it? I have never had a reason to remove the engine cover on my HTC. This would create a reason which I don’t look forward to. So my question still stands. Does the benefit outweigh the costs?
Only you can answer that question since your the one who will have to remove the engine cover every 3000 - 4000 miles to check/empty the CC.
Is it necessary, no. Does it prevent some dirty crankcase ventilation from getting into your intake tract, definitely. I ran one on my Camaro SS (LT1 motor) like thousands of others have done on the direct injection platform and its was one of the first things I did on my C8. I am happy with my choice.
Have you checked the can in your C8 recently? Curious how full that thing is.
Really appreciate all the comments. My question still remains. Does the benefit of this device outweigh the pain in the *** aggravation when attached to a HTC. On the coupe it seems pretty easy to inspect the can and empty as needed. For the HTC it’s a bit of a movie to remove the 19 screws necessary to remove the engine cover just to access the oil catch can. I realize that it might be an ideal device but does the alleged value it provides make it worth it? I have never had a reason to remove the engine cover on my HTC. This would create a reason which I don’t look forward to. So my question still stands. Does the benefit outweigh the costs?
I’ve installed catch cans on multiple vehicles in the past including a 2015 Silverado with the 5.3L. I removed the CC from the Silverado after a year or so because during the winter months it would fill up with condensation and I would have to empty it every 10-14 days. Not fun in cold weather. You live in Florida so condensation shouldn’t be much of an issue.
Something else to consider is that GM has been known to void powertrain warranties when catch cans are installed. If you have an engine issue, you going to have to uninstall the can before taking it to the dealer or you run the risk of being denied warranty coverage. And as you have said, on the HTC it’s not very convenient to do.
Because of these two issues, I have not installed a CC on my Camaro ZL1 or C8. Just not worth it in my opinion. When the time comes, I just pay for an intake clean-out.
I sure have; been there done that. After hundreds if not thousands of hours worth of dyno time over 2+ decades of building, modifying, & tuning cars, doing dyno shootouts, back-to-backing various aftermarket components, etc. I've learned a few lessons the hard way along with helping countless others troubleshoot along the way.
I love to see all these comments where people say the catch can will have no oil in it.
I see the mightymouse is doing poorly (catching nothing), but my JLT3.0 can catches a decent amount. There isn't an Oiler Elf that sneaks in during the night to fill up my catch can. Pretty sure it is coming from crank case vapors. I can't say for sure that this oil will be detrimental if it had been allowed to go through my intake, but I can say it is being reduced by about 1-2oz every 2k miles.
Looks like a LOT more than nothing to me!
We have many competitor units on hand and on average they test about 30% worse.
That's before we get into our unique pressure control, or the level window, upgrade path, yadda yadda.
I wanted to buy something from Paragon to support them as a 'thank you' for all the dyno shootout videos and figured this is at least one of their product that isn't some cosmetic stick-on thing. I'll take some pictures and get it installed this weekend and see what, if anything, it truly does since I put a fair amount of miles on the car. I figured I might as well test it out for myself since I haven't messed with catch-cans in nearly 15 years. The can is identical to what Corsa and Mishimoto both offer, but Paragon did a much nicer job with the hoses & fittings (and at a lower price). I do prefer Corsa's mount and location, but again, wanted to support Paragon. My guess is the can comes from some Chinese company and everyone just throws their own logo on it and fabs up a unique bracket.
I got home late last night so no pictures of the unboxing, but will add some tonight or this weekend sometime...
The can installs in the "Foul Air" path as seen below:
Originally Posted by AzDave47
See diagram up above where the Foul air (oil soaked) from that valley oil separator is BURNED IN COMBUSTION. An oil catch can would strip that oil out and keep it from being burned in combustion (knocking down the fuel octane).
I understand that GM would not want a high maintenance device like a catch can, which would have to be drained after every track event, to be included on the regular production car. On the street you could drive 5000 miles and maybe pick up 1-2 ounces of oil. You would get 4 ounces in one track day. This is one area where those that need it should just expect to add it and take care of it's regular draining maintenance.
Interesting theories; excited to test it for myself!
Well... I mailed the Paragon catch-can back already this morning. After attempting the install last night, I was left very unimpressed with both the fitment/alignment of the can and bracket, but also the poor fitment of their fittings which were way too tight and ended up actually breaking one of my factory fittings. I've made the necessary repairs already, but regardless, that should not happen. I am now debating just leaving well enough alone and taking the refund (which Paragon has already agreed to, kudos to their near instantaneous customer service last night after business hours) or exchanging for Corsa's can: https://www.paragonperf.com/corsa-c8...catch-can.html
The inlet of the line the catch-can setup replaces was a bit oily, but the other end that connects to the intake manifold was dry with no oily residue or film. Which brings me back to my original comments in this thread... Is the aftermarket looking for solutions for problems that don't exist?
Paragon Performance C8 Corvette Oil Catch Can??
