Well after stopping by the builders shop, he told me that I should maybe consider a better flowing head over the Brodix Track 1's I have for my engine goal. So I am now on the waiting list at AFR for a new set of 210cc Race Ready heads. I could have gone with the Competition version which flow a bit better on the intake side, but they were an additional $500 to go from 70% CNC ported to 100% on the intake runners only, the ehaust runners & chambers are 100% CNC ported on bothe versions. So with the $ I saved by going with the Race Readys, I upgraded the Valve Stem Seals from rubber to Teflon, the Chromoly retainers will be the Titanium ones, and the roller cam 1.550" springs are now the Pacaloy springs with .100 longer valve upgrade.
Here's how the new heads (advertised) flow compared to the old.
AFR:
Lift....Intake.....Exhaust
.200....135........112
.300....197........145
.400....245........185
.500....273........205
.550....277........210
.600....282........215
.650....283........218
.700....285........220

My ported Brodix Track1's I flowed before they were pocket ported below the valves:
.200....127........115
.300....182........159
.400....230........185
.500....260........198
.600....260........208
.650....266........210
.700....265........210

Looks like we may be moving froward finally now that dirt season is about over
:D

 

sounds like a wise decision

 

This is just my opinion. I've just been dealing with AFR 210 heads. they said race ready but they were fully CNC'ed intake and exhaust. the minuses were:

They don't have tall lips on the out board valve cover rails.

They have a machined trough parallel to the valve stem centerlines. Which would mean oil always near the valve stem seal and springs - i don't know if this is good or bad.

The drain back holes are not radiused (sp?) So the heads keep oil in them.

The exhaust ports are small when compared to the recommened 1406 FelPro gasket size and not raise .600 like the equivolent Dart Pro 1 heads.

These AFR heads were @ $2200 with 2.08/1.60 nice valves. angle milled to 22 degrees to make 64 cc also angle plugs

If you ask me Dart Pro 1 heads have a better bang for the buck

 

:iagree: :flag

 

:iagree:
But I am partial since I have a set of 215 Pro -1 's,,, picked them up 3 days after ordering them.

 

George I didn't consider the cost of the Dart Pro 1's because my builder is a dealer for them and the best price he gave me for bare heads were around $1700. I'll have just a tad more than that into the AFR's with the upgraded parts that I mentioned, so it was a cost decision for me. My builder is not impressed with the parts that come with assembled heads and usually recommends getting them bare and buying the good parts afterwards. I still have the costs of machining and prepping the new block along with all the other work he'll be doing. He did suggest that I could go with an iron head (I have unported Sportman II's on current engine), but I'm set on having aluminum heads on this engine.

I do know that the AFR chambers are 76cc so I'm not sure if I'll have them milled down or not, we'll have to decide before the pistons or ordered ;) . Right now I don't expect to see the heads before November :( .

 

Mike - Cancel out on the ARF's I got my Dart's through
http://www.martelbros.com They will give the number and you call Dart and tell them what you need. Mine came with factory hand porting and CNC chambers 64 cc

I was looking for .600 flow because my original cam had .620/.644 lift minus the lash. They flow something like 306 cm intake and 230 exhaust.

I would see if they offer 2.10 intakes and 1.60 e I made the mistake of getting 2.08/1.625's. IMO bigger intakes is better!:)

 

George they only show the Pro 1's bare, is this what you got or did you get them assembled ? Also, were your Pro 1's around $2500 like my builder quoted me if assembled :confused: . The AFR's price along with comparing the flow numbers that CHP did on a flow bench ( http://www.chevyhiperformance.com/te...98/index6.html ) are what lead me to choose the AFR.

 

http://www.dartheads.com/csbhpro1cnc.htm

Did you check the price through Martel brothers? If you read the article from chevy high performance and they took off the shelf heads.

My heads have 304 cfm at .600 306 at .700 Exhaust was something like 230 cfm with my optional larger 1.625 valves.

 

You can get a set of Dart's built here, belive me they know what they are doing,, just look around their site.

Mine were $950 built, 215 CC, 7/16 studs, 2.08/1.6. Plus $250 for gasket match to 1206 and short turn radius polish and bowl un-shroud, total cost $1250.

http://www.indyheads.com

 

Mike I could explain it to you all later. But I'm probably going to be selling my brand new AFR 210's I considered pulling my Darts off my 383 and installing my new Hydraulic roller and the smaller AFR 210's. Then installing my Sollid roller and 227 cc Darts on my 427.

But after some serious thought I decided to not even screw with a nice running 383. I'm just going to pull it and put it in a plastic bag on a roller motor stand as a ready spare. I'm thinking that 12 - 18 degree spread port heads are the only way to go. If it only makes 50 less HP than Monty's creation I would still be happy:)

So if your set on AFR's and don't want a three month wait. E-mail me

 

Maybe it's just me, but I would think a set of relatively virgin Brodix track 1's could get a lot of serious port work done for that much money.

The AFR's are a very nice head out of the box and folks make lots of power with them, but they ain't cheap!

BTW, When I ordered my Brodix, it was the same deal. send $$ to vendor and then they had me call Brodix to have them built the way I wanted with respect to valve seals, springs etc. Worked out great.

Could you get an M-2 CNC job done from Brodix on your current heads for less $$?


JIM

 

i dont know what kind of crack your smoking but those pro 1s
flow Flow, Intake: 276cfm @ .600” lift / 28”
Flow, Exhaust: 180cfm @ .600” lift / 28”
and thats right from dart site so the afrs put a whoopin on those heads :cheers:

 

that exhaust is patheticlly weak hell a 190 afr flows 178 at 400 lift :cheers:

 

I'm not sure where you got the CFM charts out on the Dart site. What's the link that gives flows of all their heads? I could see where the out of box smaller valved heads would have less flow. But the larger valves and full porting is the best way to go.

I was able to look at the AFR 227 cc SBC CFM charts the race & competition models. They also exceed 300 cfm. So I'm not sure how you came up with a crack statement.

 

gkull
you posted the link dont you look at what you post go to the link you posted and click on the pro 1 head we are talking about and you will see for your self :cheers:

 

:confused: Gkull is a pretty respected guy here on the forum, I don't see the point your trying to make :confused:

After talking with the builder and showing him the numbers, we're going to stay with the AFR210. He agreed with my decision on these based on my smaller cubic size engine (388) and that it will mainly see street miles. The smaller 210 will help with the intake velocity.

Thanks for all the advice :cheers:

 

Mike. I never have looked at the Dart site in a long time. So I never saw the pull up specs. My point I guess is that the Chevy High Performance article tested out of the box and it was a few years ago now. I imagine that each one of the companies has made minor improvements to the base unit over the years and when you get into optional porting and valve types none of those CHP graphs are correct. All they are good for is a base line. But like most purchasers you also bought the options.

The AFR 210 cc as you ordered them are $1600 with race ready CNC porting 2.08/1.60 valves. I just said, "Ask Martel Bros how much the equivalent Dart Pro1 would be?". You can order the 215 cc Pro1's with 2.08/1.60 and nice swirl polished valves.................... So out goes the Dart site graph and of course CHP's CFMs.

I will say that the Dart sites intended use description is pretty good. My little motor really comes on hard over 6000 rpm. It really swings through 7000 fast and then it's right into the rev limiter.

So your 210's might work out pretty good for 388 ci

 

gkull and any body else who thought i was jumping down there throats i honestly didnt know what they flowed till i went to the site you posted and i was just trying to help the original poster about his afr heads if dart posted those numbers thats what they flow out of the box not to mean they wont flow better with a competant porter to port them out i personally like to buy the best cnced heads i can buy for repeatability a big name head porter will do one port the best he can then try and match them there after i just think the cnc heads you can count on what they are and what they can flow :cheers:

 

CORKVETTE1 - I'm sorry also! when some body does an little flame. I was wondering:(

I originally bought brodix -11 heads out of a Sprint car to put on my 383. all done up. Then when I started looking at them. The big change was I needed custom spread port headers and higher intake. They were done up with 2.15/1.160

I thought I would have street abillity(sp?) problems. Now i wish that i had never sold them. To use my exsisting 1 3/4 hockers with Dart 227's I had to hog out the header flanges to even get close to a match