if you just change rings you are OK on the balance
Ring side clearance to tight
Thread Starter
Melting Slicks
Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 2,158
Likes: 9
From: N.E. WA
Ring side clearance to tight
I was assembling my rings on my pistons and the side clearance is supposed to be .0015-.003. The thinnest feeler gauge I have at the moment is .002 and it is not even close to going in. On one piston, the top ring even drags a bit. I have never run across this, so what do I do now? I am using SRP pistons and Total Seal rings. Should I call SRP or Total Seal for info?
Thread Starter
Melting Slicks
Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 2,158
Likes: 9
From: N.E. WA
Re: Ring side clearance to tight (Matt Gruber)
I talked with a tech at Total Seal and he said that the specs for the rings I have should fall with .0617-.0622. Measuring with my micrometer, they are all over .062, but I don't know exactly how acurate my mic is. I will get with SRP and see what the specs are for the pistons. They measure about .0635-.064. If you do the math, you can see that they are on the tight side. This sucks. I already put the rods on and the reciprocating assy has been balanced.
I talked with the Je rep and he said that the ring groove should be about .0639-.0642. I think that's about right. The rings look just a tad thick to me.
[Modified by ANTI VENOM, 5:10 PM 6/22/2004]
I talked with the Je rep and he said that the ring groove should be about .0639-.0642. I think that's about right. The rings look just a tad thick to me.
[Modified by ANTI VENOM, 5:10 PM 6/22/2004]
Le Mans Master
Joined: Mar 1999
Posts: 6,744
Likes: 1
From: delmont pa
Cruise-In I Veteran
Cruise-In II Veteran
Re: Ring side clearance to tight (ANTI VENOM)
make a holding fixture for the rings and lap the side of the rings down on a glass plate with fine valve lappin compound. any time you use premium pistons with close tolerance ring grooves you must do this. 
[Modified by clem zahrobsky, 12:49 PM 6/24/2004]
[Modified by clem zahrobsky, 12:49 PM 6/24/2004]
Thread Starter
Melting Slicks
Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 2,158
Likes: 9
From: N.E. WA
Re: Ring side clearance to tight (clem zahrobsky)
Clem, a friend of mine made mention of that very same practice. I wasn't sure if the rings had some "coating" on them that would be taken off and effectively ruining the ring. I would still like to get back with JE to see if my ring clearance needs to be a little wider due to the fact that this engine will have a turbo on it.
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Thread Starter
Melting Slicks
Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 2,158
Likes: 9
From: N.E. WA
Re: Ring side clearance to tight (clem zahrobsky)
If anyone is following this at all, here is what I know.
After several hundred dollars worth of measuring equipment later, the rings are still too tight in the groove. (go figure) The piston groove is to blame (mostly), and JE says that they are not setup to put the piston back in the cnc machine and widen the groove with any accuracy. Total seal says, take the rods back off the pistons, send them the pistons and the rings. Then they will machine the pistons to accept the rings at a tune of $12.50 per piston plus shipping both ways. All this to gain about .001 of side clearance. I'm not sure why these things happen to me. I try my best and get egg on my face regardless of how much money I spend or research I do. Just venting, I'll live!!!!!!!!
After several hundred dollars worth of measuring equipment later, the rings are still too tight in the groove. (go figure) The piston groove is to blame (mostly), and JE says that they are not setup to put the piston back in the cnc machine and widen the groove with any accuracy. Total seal says, take the rods back off the pistons, send them the pistons and the rings. Then they will machine the pistons to accept the rings at a tune of $12.50 per piston plus shipping both ways. All this to gain about .001 of side clearance. I'm not sure why these things happen to me. I try my best and get egg on my face regardless of how much money I spend or research I do. Just venting, I'll live!!!!!!!!
Thread Starter
Melting Slicks
Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 2,158
Likes: 9
From: N.E. WA
Re: Ring side clearance to tight (Matt Gruber)
Hey Clem, I have seen ring groove "cleaners". Do they take off any material? I would hate to take off .001 from the ring alone. Call me ****, but this engine will be making in the neighborhood of 7-800 hp and that is more than any engine "I" have ever built. Anyway, can you be alittle more specific on the ring "lapping"? If I turn my ring sideways and look at the outer edge, I can see layers to the ring. If I take off some material, it will thin this outer material. Do you know anything about that?
Le Mans Master
Joined: Mar 1999
Posts: 6,744
Likes: 1
From: delmont pa
Cruise-In I Veteran
Cruise-In II Veteran
Re: Ring side clearance to tight (ANTI VENOM)
lapping a .001 from the side of the ring will cause no problem,you can even do both sides .0005 each. you need to make a round metal plate 1/2" thick with a area machined out the same diameter as the cylinder bore and to a depth of 1/2 the ring thickness. make sure you have a relief in the corner so the ring sets flat. you snap the ring into the machined out recess and lap on a glass plate with some #400 to #600 valve lapping compound. make sure you clean the ring well when done
Race Director
Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 14,996
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From: central FL, near the beach.
Re: Ring side clearance to tight (clem zahrobsky)
clem
there has to be a dozen ways.
i would rubber glue the ring to a piece of glass with a suction cup on the other side. might not work, but it sounds easier.
there has to be a dozen ways.
i would rubber glue the ring to a piece of glass with a suction cup on the other side. might not work, but it sounds easier.
