Well you might consider the setup that our friend Mixer Mike has on his C5. The front plate is spring loaded and folds up at speed.

 

I like this idea, but to be effective, wouldn't the air brake have to be mounted toward the rear? If so wouldn't that make the front plate more of a rear plate? Hmmm, would two rear plates be a viable (and legal) option to the lack of a front plate?

Since in this state the front plate is slightly different than the rear plate (no tabs) wouldn't having both plates in the rear still constitute running a "front" plate? Maybe one could mount the "front" plate backwards in order to meet the further requirement that the front plate must face forward.

I like the airbrake idea though. I presume it would be large enough to allow for advertising vis-a-vis the Las Vegas Taxi "tents" so if it proves to be effective, maybe one could sell advertising space on the device promoting brake shops.... or strip clubs, if you prefer.

 

Although prototypes don't usually resemble the production cars it looks like Corvette is on the move.

http://www.autoguide.com/auto-news/2...-unveiled.html

 

Does this mean the C6R program is over or will they also run along with the DP cars?

 

That would be the idea, lay it flat, but when it pops up, have it forward facing.

But if it was mounted in the front, not only would it act as an air brake, but the downforce could cause the air dam to scrape, further improving stopping power!

But back to the main topic - did anyone notice how similar Jalopniks drawings are to the Carvaggio Super Coupe project?

 

Could this be the signal for a rear mid engine C8? Or better yet, how about a rear mid engine Super Vette to be sold in really low numbers alongside the "regular" Vette, and to take on the Pagani, Gumpert, Moslers of the world? (I still cannot see the Vette switching to RM engine)

 

I haven't seen that! Sounds pretty interesting.

 

Another excellent point. I think it would depend on how the airbrake, front plate holder, strip club advertisement was mounted. My fear, as you may have already surmised, is that if the device was mounted atop the engine cover, a rapid deployment could very well preclude further forward vision on the part of both driver and passenger.

Now your point about enhanced braking performance may very well ameliorate any need for further forward vision, unless any directional corrections might be required during the deceleration phase. I fear this will not be graciously accepted by the potential Corvette buyer. In other words, it will never sell as an option and must be made a standard feature on all Corvettes.

That may become a marketing liability. Consider, in the case of married buyers, the distaff decision maker engaged in the process of acquiring the car you've lusted after since High School may have some reservations about any emergency braking that requires the blatant display of a local strip club advertisement. Despite the necessity of a visible front plate.

That said, the advertisement may very well deter any LEO from recalling that they pulled over for no front plate. That is, if said LEO doesn't run into the rear of your car owing to the superior stopping power of your new C7 Corvette as you pulled to the side of the road.

Oh, god, I need to go find a job and quit hanging around this forum after I've taken my meds. Poodle Girl made me do it...

 

I can't see GM retooling for a mid engine lay out and being able to see a positive return on their investment. I also do no believe GM is in the financial position to be able to build an over the top halo car, that they would surely loose money on every unit sold ( think Porsche 959, even though it was stickered for around a $250k Porsche lost about the same amount on each car sold).

I really hope that is not the C7. I was hoping ( key word) for the c7 to be so incredible that it would make most c6's owners want to upgrade and thus bringing down the price of c6's ( especially those arctic white z's.....)

Just my $.02

 

Take the LFA. It was nothing more than an exercise in what they could do. They lose money on every unit sold and will never get there cost back.

 

But the difference here is that GM is already building this new mid engine car. The engineering will be done. Any extra cost would be turning it into a street car - not cheap, but not nearly as expensive as ground up development. There's little return on the development cost of the race car as it stands, so this would give them some additional ROI.

 

I expect the C6R program to continue as they still have work to do in order to attempt the dominance they had in ALMS GT1.

They changed class for more competition and although they have done much better this year the Rayhal/Letterman BMW's are still a challenge.

A group of us went down to watch the last C5R race at Mazda Raceway/Laguna Seca prior to the C6R and I expect we will see GM continuing when the C7 (C7R) is ready for battle.

 

But in some circumstances, it's okay to lose money on one specific model if it increases sales in other models and creates a future demand for that vehicle.

 

I agree with you as it is a form of advertising/ brand promotion. Though I do not believe the current circumstances are approriate for this style of advertising.

 

Then it's possible that the Corvette may not survive to see a C8.

I've said this in other threads but it bears repeating. The demographic of the new Corvette buyer is aging and disappearing in numbers that aren't being replaced by younger, financially successful owners who aspire to a Corvette. Instead, these younger people lust after the BMW M series, the 911/Cayman/Boxster, GT-R, Audi RS. Living in a Microsoft neighborhood and just a mile from their North campus, I see the high end vehicles being driven and Corvettes are not among them. And when I got mines, I was asked why I didn't replace my BMW, or go the route of the other vehicles I mentioned. I wasn't asked how the Corvette drove and what technologies it had.

The Corvette suffers from an image problem among the younger, financially capable buyers who will be in the market for this kind of car for the next few decades. It is perceived as being owned primarily by the gold chain set who need the wider seats to accommodate their wider selves, who don't use the performance of their car, and who pamper it like a megabuck exotic when owners of these other way more expensive cars are driving them all winter long in all kinds of weather. Whether or not this is true isn't the total point - it is the perception and that perception becomes reality in the eyes of this demographic.

But there is no disputing that the Corvette buyer is aging and moving on to other cars like the CTS-V, and the number of younger buyers plus the younger people who aspire to a Corvette above all others, isn't enough to keep the Corvette market at a point where it is justifiable to keep if money were solely the issue.

I think GM needs to take a page from Nissan's book, and do with the Corvette what Nissan does with the GT-R. Only a few hundred GT-R are sold every month, fewer than the Corvette, yet Nissan pours huge development costs into it and improves it significantly almost yearly. It is filled with the kinds of things that younger, financially capable buyers see as being high tech, and that unfortunately isn't a big OHV V8 driving a conventional automatic transmission. A big OHV V8 may very well be effective, but the young demographic that is financially capable of buying this type of vehicle works primarily in a high tech industry, and has seen the innovation the likes of which Apple produces. The iphone user is not going to want to go back to a Blackberry or a flip-phone, no matter how well they work.

So, I pretty firmly believe that GM needs to work hard to overcome this image problem, and to do that, they're going to have to lose money on the Corvette for some period of time. Otherwise, they should do like Ford and just do away with the Corvette, and let the Camaro be top dog like the Mustang is for Ford. That, however, almost guarantees that GM will never be in true contention for this young, well off demographic, because the Camaro and Mustang have even greater image problems.

Tough times ahead, I believe. Unfortunate there's no simple way to turn it around. I think it remains to be seen whether or not GM has the guts to do what is necessary to make the Corvette's reality be a viable high end sports car.

 

I don't know Wayne, I always saw a lot of Vettes in the parking lots when I was at MS. The car demographics in the NW can also be pretty misleading. I think a lot of people who would never have bought a sports car buy an M3 or a Audi RS because they want that BMW, and they want to have the top of the line. The car guys still respect the Vette! .

Vette sales have been really healthy right up to the crash of the economy, which also overlapped with the 3rd- 4th year dip in sales thats expected. So while sales are low, and with the current economy, I can't see sales returning to previous levels when the C7s are released, I really think the business model for the Vette is pretty sound.

GM keeps the price range for the Vette low, which keeps sales pretty high for a high end two seat sports car. Most of the engineering for the Vettes trickles down directly to other cars, so the Vette isnt that expensive from a design and engineering perspective. And the Vette specific items are usually not done in a real high cost fashion, just basic design that works well.

So GM keeps the Vette in a good sweet spot for sales... not out of reach for 99% of potential buyers like the Viper or Ford GT, or GTR for that matter. They keep the true cost low, and don't spend much money developing stuff that will be 1-2 model specific. Combine this with the halo effect, and I can't imagine the Vette truly loses money like the GTR probably does, or like the GT and Viper definitely did.

I believe if they feel the need to drive the Vette further upmarket to try to appeal to more people, the Vette is probably doomed.

 

M3 and GT-R are 4 seaters. People who want a performance car with 4 seats buy these, the Panamera, Audi, M5, CTS-V too.

The Vette is a 2 seat sports car.

Sorry, apples to oranges. You can't throw another couple in your Vette and impress them with your wealth on Friday night and throw a car seat in on Saturday

Cayman, R8/10 numbers compared to Vette numbers, sure

 

I still think that GM doesn't have the Corvette marketed appropriately and doesn't do enough to continue to advance it, but some of your points are well taken. Maybe where I am is an isolated bubble of the world, but I had these impressions/biases/prejudices before I purchased my Corvette and they've so far been confirmed by those I've come across whom I would think are a prime target for a Corvette.

My nephew is a car/motorcycle enthusiast and works (very long hours) at Microsoft. When we were talking about the Corvette, I asked him how many he's seen on campus and he said "maybe one". I asked how many other kinds of sports cars and he says there are a ton of S2000, RX8, and fewer but many Cayman/Boxster/911, M cars, with the occasional R8/Ferrari/Lambo. That seems to match what I've seen when I've been on campus (have never seen a C6 there).

 

As far as the Vette not surviving to see a C-8, what bears repeating is there will still be a ton of baby boomers (remembering Americana from the 60's) wanting a Vette more than ever.

If you are in your 50's, you definitely remember the golden years of the late 60's and early 70's Vette. The last of the boomers will be wanting a Vette for retirement.

So don't bury us yet. Remember 70 is the new 40!

Maybe you meant C-10's

As far as Vette's on MS campus, there are almost 100 facilities in the Puget Sound portfolio and lots of floors in those parking garages.

I totally agree with you there are so many more choices of quality cars to chose from today and the competition is fearce. It will not be easy for the Vette, thats for sure.

 

It may be a matter of not noticing the Vettes if you're not tuned into them (your nephew that is). I know that each building I parked in usually had at least a couple of Vettes - the Issaquah campus, with a relatively small parking lot, usually had 3-4 Vettes, RTC had 2-3, and similar numbers for other buildingS I visited. We were definitely outnumbered by 911s, Caymans, M3s, etc. But the Corvette love definitely exists! But I notice that German luxury cars (BMW, Audi, Porsche, MB), and Japanese luxury cars (Lexus, Infinity, and Acura) pretty much outnumber all other marques in the MS garages, so I think the results are pretty skewed in our area.

I definitely agree that the Vette image is not as shiny as it once was. Too many years of poorly performing cars, combined with too much high performance competition from companies with better images than Chevy. But I think Chevys image will continue to improve as they continue to produce better cars. And I think the Vette will continue to sell well if the actual performance/value combination stays high. In the end, I didn't buy the Vette because I wanted a Vette (). I bought a Vette because there wasn't a better performing car for the money out there.

Some of the image problems are from the bad cars of the late 70's and very early 80's. If you were a kid growing up in that era, you're just at the point of affording a luxury vehicle now, and that can't help sales. But I think the great cars of the more recent years will leave good impressions on the buyers of the next couple decades.