425 HP Completely Unexpected
Thread Starter
Burning Brakes
Joined: Feb 2012
Posts: 759
Likes: 22
From: Slatington PA
425 HP Completely Unexpected
I was shocked at these results.
2002 Z06
58K Miles
Mods:
ARH, Catted X Pipe, B & B Bullets
Vararam
160 Degree Stat
Tune
http://s1300.beta.photobucket.com/us...tml?sort=3&o=0
2002 Z06
58K Miles
Mods:
ARH, Catted X Pipe, B & B Bullets
Vararam
160 Degree Stat
Tune
http://s1300.beta.photobucket.com/us...tml?sort=3&o=0
Last edited by ggroller; Oct 15, 2012 at 09:20 AM. Reason: upload pic
AMP Racing
Joined: Aug 2006
Posts: 10,754
Likes: 589
From: Washington TWP NJ
2023 C5 of the Year Finalist - Modified
2017 C5 of Year Finalist
St. Jude Donor '09-'10-'11-'12
You should be shocked at the results, seeing as though the best most have seen with a similar setup is 390....
Thread Starter
Burning Brakes
Joined: Feb 2012
Posts: 759
Likes: 22
From: Slatington PA
Is it even possible? I mean, could the dyno results be skewed somehow?
I never did a baseline on this car but it felt really strong stock when I bought it at 57K miles. I had a 2004 Z06 that felt weak compared to this 2002.
I never did a baseline on this car but it felt really strong stock when I bought it at 57K miles. I had a 2004 Z06 that felt weak compared to this 2002.
AMP Racing
Joined: Aug 2006
Posts: 10,754
Likes: 589
From: Washington TWP NJ
2023 C5 of the Year Finalist - Modified
2017 C5 of Year Finalist
St. Jude Donor '09-'10-'11-'12
If dyno numbers are really important to you, find another one to compare. Otherwise, take it to the track and make a few passes.
Perhaps the PO installed a cam.
Perhaps the PO installed a cam.
Thread Starter
Burning Brakes
Joined: Feb 2012
Posts: 759
Likes: 22
From: Slatington PA
I wouldn't say dyno numbers are really important to me. It's nice to know what's at the wheels, though.
According to the guy I bought the car from it was all stock. It definitely sounded stock when I bought it.
According to the guy I bought the car from it was all stock. It definitely sounded stock when I bought it.
Drifting
Joined: Nov 2011
Posts: 1,377
Likes: 41
From: Chesterfield (St. Louis) MO
I think the reason for the high numbers (WHP and WTQ) are because of the "DIN" correction factor (they are higher than SAE). Have the dyno operator shoot you a dyno sheet with SAE correction. I have very similar mods as yours, and put down 386/372 SAE (which is actually a tad higher than average).
Last edited by 95rtturbo; Oct 15, 2012 at 02:35 PM.
Team Owner
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 23,480
Likes: 9
From: East Meadow NY
St. Jude Donor '12
I think the reason for the high numbers (WHP and WTQ) are because of the "DIN" correction factor (they are higher than SAE). Have the dyno operator shoot you a dyno sheet with SAE correction. I have very similar mods as yours, and put down 386/372 SAE (which is actually a tad higher than average).
DIN uses different correction factors.
Thread Starter
Burning Brakes
Joined: Feb 2012
Posts: 759
Likes: 22
From: Slatington PA
A ha.
I had no idea what DIN and SAE were. I just googled them and I see what you guys are saying. It looks like the DIN formula for correction is a bit more lenient than SAE.
I'm learning. Thanks for the input.
Garrett
I had no idea what DIN and SAE were. I just googled them and I see what you guys are saying. It looks like the DIN formula for correction is a bit more lenient than SAE.
I'm learning. Thanks for the input.
Garrett
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Instructor
Joined: Mar 2012
Posts: 122
Likes: 0
I don' think the DIN CF will affect it that much. My car put down 360 RWHP SAE on a 97 degree day, and DIN was only 364. Unless Im thinking it through wrong, he'd need to have dyno'd on a 150 degree day for the CF to adjust to something that high, right?
If it were colder, it would correct to less power.
Looking at the sheet again, indeed it was 63 degrees, and the CF was .99 - not a larger multiplier.
I would either take it to the track to see if it backs up the numbers, or look at other items that could have been askew. I'm not too familiar with what could easily be adjusted on a dynojet to inflate numbers to that degree, if they are inflated. That torque figure does indeed look exceptionally high though -
To the dyno operators - what could cause it to be so much higher? Im thinking it must have a cam. Not having it strapped down as tight wouldn't result in that much of a skewed number, would it?
If it were colder, it would correct to less power.
Looking at the sheet again, indeed it was 63 degrees, and the CF was .99 - not a larger multiplier.
I would either take it to the track to see if it backs up the numbers, or look at other items that could have been askew. I'm not too familiar with what could easily be adjusted on a dynojet to inflate numbers to that degree, if they are inflated. That torque figure does indeed look exceptionally high though -
To the dyno operators - what could cause it to be so much higher? Im thinking it must have a cam. Not having it strapped down as tight wouldn't result in that much of a skewed number, would it?
Le Mans Master
Joined: May 2007
Posts: 5,393
Likes: 17
From: Belleville Mich.
This is all speculation, all of us know that a LS/6 Z with those mods equals right at 390 rwhp on a mustang dyno.
The man bought the car used.
He or us have no idea, if any internal work may have been done.
The man bought the car used.
He or us have no idea, if any internal work may have been done.
Drifting
Joined: Oct 2011
Posts: 1,980
Likes: 10
From: Crook County
I laugh evertime I read threads like this because It always boggles me that people dont understand that all dyno's are different and this was obviously one of the most happy generous dyno's I have ever seen... Im just a CAI/Catback C5Z and I make 367/364, On that same dyno my Cam, Full exhaust, tuned 04 GTO makes 425/396... If you took your car with your mods and put it on the dyno I go to you would probably be in the 385 range... My GTO on the dyno you were on would probably read 500 RWHP hahahaha.... Dyno's are nothing more then a mod and tuning tool... Take it to the track and get some real world results man 
Thread Starter
Burning Brakes
Joined: Feb 2012
Posts: 759
Likes: 22
From: Slatington PA
So, other work must have been done to this car before I bought it. As I had stated above in a reply, the car sounded stock when I bought it but it definitely felt much stronger before any of the mods I did comparing it to a 2004 Z I owned previously.
I guess the only way to find out is the take it apart?
I guess the only way to find out is the take it apart?
Team Owner
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 23,480
Likes: 9
From: East Meadow NY
St. Jude Donor '12
So, other work must have been done to this car before I bought it. As I had stated above in a reply, the car sounded stock when I bought it but it definitely felt much stronger before any of the mods I did comparing it to a 2004 Z I owned previously.
I guess the only way to find out is the take it apart?
I guess the only way to find out is the take it apart?
Thread Starter
Burning Brakes
Joined: Feb 2012
Posts: 759
Likes: 22
From: Slatington PA
The car was tuned after the exhaust and CAI were installed.
Former Vendor
Joined: Jul 2010
Posts: 4,504
Likes: 4
From: Waterloo Ontario
I laugh evertime I read threads like this because It always boggles me that people dont understand that all dyno's are different and this was obviously one of the most happy generous dyno's I have ever seen... Im just a CAI/Catback C5Z and I make 367/364, On that same dyno my Cam, Full exhaust, tuned 04 GTO makes 425/396... If you took your car with your mods and put it on the dyno I go to you would probably be in the 385 range... My GTO on the dyno you were on would probably read 500 RWHP hahahaha.... Dyno's are nothing more then a mod and tuning tool... Take it to the track and get some real world results man
I've seen so many people all excited at what there car put down on the dyno only to find out what it really makes on the track is nowhere near it.
Instructor
Joined: Mar 2012
Posts: 122
Likes: 0
If the tuner were worth his salt, he should have been able to judge whether the maf readings were inline with other cars making an honest 425. Now, if his only comparison is to his dyno's 425, then he think they were right.
I havent been messing with LS1 specifically, but tuning in general, and one should be able to get a general idea to the amount of power based on g/s, or at least I'd think.
I havent been messing with LS1 specifically, but tuning in general, and one should be able to get a general idea to the amount of power based on g/s, or at least I'd think.
Safety Car
Joined: Aug 2011
Posts: 4,446
Likes: 408
From: Portland OR
Ok, so what G/S airflow would equate to 425,450, 475 hp?
Mine hits between 360 and 370 g/sec and shows delivered torque of 430-440 ft lps in HPT
Mine hits between 360 and 370 g/sec and shows delivered torque of 430-440 ft lps in HPT
Last edited by RonSSNova; Oct 17, 2012 at 06:24 PM.
Instructor
Joined: Mar 2012
Posts: 122
Likes: 0
If you are hitting 370g/sec, that is anywhere between 370 and 460. Granted, thats a large range, but those are just generic numbers Im throwing out there.
I've seen many say that on a "properly scaled" maf, that it should be close to equal.
I'll see if I can find any specific LS related info about it.
Drifting
Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 1,971
Likes: 7
From: Longwood Florida
Lots of factors with different dynos (mustang dyno, dynotech, etc) hood up, hood down, weather station, straps loose, straps tight, fan on or off the car? These items can make or loose 25-30rwhp.
You should have base lined first before mods and always go to the same dyno and ask for weather station results eash time... only gets worse when you change dyno and or tuners.
Check GMHTP they had a write up on this a few months back.
You should have base lined first before mods and always go to the same dyno and ask for weather station results eash time... only gets worse when you change dyno and or tuners.
Check GMHTP they had a write up on this a few months back.
Drifting
Joined: Apr 2009
Posts: 1,898
Likes: 9
From: Morrisville PA
Always read the correction factor. SAE is the standard in the LS1 world. If you took your car to the track, you would MPH the same as any other c5z with those mods, unless of course there is a baby cam in that thing.