Notices
Ask Tadge Archived: Corvette's Chief Engineer Tadge Juechter answers questions from the CorvetteForum community.

[ANSWERED] Track Testing/Validation

 
Thread Tools
 
Search this Thread
 
Old May 12, 2017 | 07:05 AM
  #1  
jvp's Avatar
jvp
Thread Starter
Tech Contributor
Supporting Lifetime Gold
25 Year Member
Liked
Loved
Community Favorite
 
Joined: Mar 1999
Posts: 10,445
Likes: 4,403
From: Northern VA
"Ask Tadge" Producer
Default [ANSWERED] Track Testing/Validation

The original question is here.

Clairvoyantwolf asked:
It was mentioned in a previous Ask Tadge response that the Corvette Team had never tested at Willow Springs, and after testing there the "Rough Track Calibration" was created for the Magnetic Selective Ride Control. What tracks does the Corvette Team regularly test at and what unique insights does each venue bring?
Tadge answered:
There are hundreds or tracks in North America and perhaps thousands around the world. We pick tracks based on more variables than most people would imagine. Here are a few:

Availability: Most track owners want to keep the facility as busy as possible so booking can be a challenge. We need to find tracks that have openings when we believe we will have a vehicle ready to test. So we tend to reserve time well ahead based on long term planning. Weather plays a role here too. We don't get a lot of second chances to test based on our tight timelines so the weather outlook based on the time of the year has to be good.

Facility particulars: Quality garage and work spaces are important since much of our work involves on-site data analysis and mechanical and electrical work on the cars themselves. Product security can be important too - We are often testing vehicles that have yet to be announced.

Distance from Michigan. Our "home base" for development work is Milford, Michigan. We test there year 'round, but track work cannot be done in the Winter. Traveling great distances to find warm weather tracks is inefficient (cars sitting on a truck are useless assets) and expensive.

Historical testing data: Once we start visiting a track with some regularity, we accumulate an enormous database of vital statistics. Having those reference data is extremely valuable as we assess new model's performance vs older cars. When you are in the business of continuous improvement, high fidelity historical data is mandatory.

Of course the point of this question is the character of the tracks themselves. Each track will have unique characteristics that challenge the vehicle dynamics in different ways. A car optimized at a single track will likely perform poorly at certain others, so over the years we have developed a portfolio of testing venues that do a good job of helping us develop a well-rounded car that performs quite well at almost every track. Obviously this is not a perfect science as the Willow Springs example shows. We put together a list of our most frequently used tracks and the learning from each. We do occasionally use other facilities, but the vast majority of our testing occurs on those listed here:

Our home track, the Milford Road Course: The MRC has a remarkable density of corners. The car is rarely going straight. Also, almost all the turns have elevation or camber changes mid-corner. It was intentionally designed this way.... We tried to bring the most challenging sections of the most challenging tracks around the world together in our backyard. As a result, we can make very good predictions about how the car will behave on tracks our customers are likely to run. The correlation is especially good between the MRC and VIR (also pretty good with Road Atlanta).

Virginia International Raceway: VIR is our primary outside development track. Some of the unique features here are the high speed S's which have significant elevation change and rapid throttle movements at very high speeds. These S's combined with many lower speed corners make this a very diverse track that helps us develop both suspension, braking and chassis control systems.

Road Atlanta - Road Atlanta provides a couple steady state higher speed corners which allow us to do more thorough aerodynamic tuning. It also has a very long straight to challenge powertrain robustness.

Willow Springs - Willow is now a priority and has the fastest average speed of any western track. Turns 8 and 9 are well over 100mph and are the best opportunity we have to spend time working on aero tuning. It also has a pavement texture that is unique to the west coast that requires unique compromises to suspension calibrations.

Spring Mountain - Spring Mountain offers two main track configurations. The older 2.2 mile is very good for lubrication robustness with two long duration corners in quick succession. These corners are so good for lube system testing that we duplicated them on the MRC. Their East course provides very high brake energy and is used for brake thermal development.

Laguna Seca: The famous Monterey track provides a similar surface as Willow Springs but with much slower cornering speeds. It is challenging to Performance Traction Management (PTM) calibrations and MR tuning. It is the highest brake energy track we have ever used for testing.

Grattan - As well as being close to the proving grounds, Grattan provides a well-controlled jump where we can calibrate ABS and MR behavior with the car fully in the air. We duplicated this jump at the MRC as well.

Nurburgring - We use the Nurburgring since it has more road input (bumps, crests, dips, jumps, camber changes, etc.) and more high speed corners than any other track in the world. Obviously it's length is unique but even if it were shorter it would provide tuning opportunities that can't be found on any other racetrack in the world.

One might also wonder why we don't use the recently opened National Corvette Museum Motorsports park. Corvette Racing has already tested there with good results so we may add it to the menu someday. In the meantime, it has been received very well and is quite busy already!
Old May 12, 2017 | 09:23 AM
  #2  
Speednet's Avatar
Speednet
Melting Slicks
20 Year Member
 
Joined: Apr 2001
Posts: 2,108
Likes: 755
From: Bridgewater NJ
Default

Awesome response, great information!
Old May 12, 2017 | 07:11 PM
  #3  
plasboy's Avatar
plasboy
Drifting
10 Year Member
Liked
Loved
Top Answer: 1
 
Joined: Sep 2011
Posts: 1,418
Likes: 229
From: Licking MO
Default

Thanks for the detailed response.
Old May 12, 2017 | 07:33 PM
  #4  
Bwright's Avatar
Bwright
Melting Slicks
Supporting Lifetime Gold
25 Year Member
Liked
Loved
Community Favorite
 
Joined: Apr 1999
Posts: 2,559
Likes: 159
From: Queens NY
Default

Simply superb answer. Unique in the automotive universe that one can get such a detailed answer effectively straight from the horse's mouth if you will. Just...damn.
Old May 12, 2017 | 10:07 PM
  #5  
Gary '09 C6's Avatar
Gary '09 C6
Race Director
Supporting Lifetime Gold
15 Year Member
Liked
Loved
Community Favorite
 
Joined: Aug 2010
Posts: 12,641
Likes: 463
From: Houston TX
Default

...lotta' information there !
Old May 15, 2017 | 11:48 AM
  #6  
vader86's Avatar
vader86
Team Owner
20 Year Member
Liked
Loved
Community Favorite
 
Joined: Sep 2001
Posts: 62,125
Likes: 1,727
From: Athens AL
C7 of the Year - Unmodified Finalist 2021
C4 of Year Finalist (performance mods) 2019
Default

Good information there, now if you see them testing at one track or another you can guess just what they were working on that day.
Old May 15, 2017 | 01:26 PM
  #7  
Nate@VanBortelChevy's Avatar
Nate@VanBortelChevy
Platinum Supporting Dealership
 
Joined: Jul 2014
Posts: 722
Likes: 336
From: Rochester New York
Default

Cool! Would love to see tested performed at my home track, Watkins Glen International!
Old May 19, 2017 | 10:35 AM
  #8  
Apocolipse's Avatar
Apocolipse
Le Mans Master
10 Year Member
Liked
Loved
Top Answer: 5
 
Joined: Aug 2013
Posts: 5,969
Likes: 1,409
Default

Should add Mosport to that list in Canada...it has killed more engines than any other due to oil starvation from the long high-g left hander.
Corvette Stories

The Best of Corvette for Corvette Enthusiasts

story-0

150 hp to 1,250 hp: Every Corvette Generation Compared by the Specs That Matter

 Joe Kucinski
story-1

8 Coolest Corvette Pace Cars (and Replicas) of All Time

 Verdad Gallardo
story-2

Top 10 Corvette Engines RANKED by Peak Torque (70+ Years of Muscle!)

 Joe Kucinski
story-3

Corvette ZR1X Will Be Pacing the Indy 500, And Could Probably Race, Too!

 Verdad Gallardo
story-4

Top 10 Corvettes Coming to Mecum Indy 2026!

 Brett Foote
story-5

Top 10 C9 Corvette MUST-HAVES to Fix These C8 Generation Flaws!

 Michael S. Palmer
story-6

10 Revolutionary 'Corvette Firsts' Most People Don't Know

 Joe Kucinski
story-7

5 Reasons to Upgrade to an LS6-Powered Corvette; 5 Reasons to Stay LT2

 Michael S. Palmer
story-8

2027 Corvette vs The World: Every C8 vs Its Closest Competitor

 Joe Kucinski
story-9

10 Most Common Corvette Problems of the Last 20 Years!

 Joe Kucinski
Old May 22, 2017 | 07:37 PM
  #9  
descartesfool's Avatar
descartesfool
Burning Brakes
10 Year Member
Liked
Loved
Community Favorite
 
Joined: Dec 2013
Posts: 1,051
Likes: 302
Default

All that testing on track makes one wonder how they could possibly sell so many Corvettes that overheat on track. How can that be possible? Did they not see the overheating while testing on al those tracks that owners who drive their cars fast on track would have to put up with?
Old May 23, 2017 | 01:36 PM
  #10  
skank's Avatar
skank
Melting Slicks
15 Year Member
Liked
Loved
Community Favorite
 
Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 2,883
Likes: 1,254
From: Carmel CA
Default

This Ask Tadge Forum is just incredible. No other Sports car manufacturer does this that I know of.
Old May 25, 2017 | 09:36 AM
  #11  
keagan's Avatar
keagan
Melting Slicks
20 Year Member
Liked
Loved
Community Favorite
 
Joined: Jul 2004
Posts: 3,384
Likes: 993
Default

Thank you Tadge for this great insight on how team Corvette does their track validation. Awesome response!
Old May 27, 2017 | 08:18 PM
  #12  
2cnd Chance's Avatar
2cnd Chance
Melting Slicks
10 Year Member
Liked
Loved
Top Answer: 1
 
Joined: Jul 2013
Posts: 2,722
Likes: 1,033
Default Awesome Stuff!!

Thank you.
Old May 30, 2017 | 11:15 AM
  #13  
BaylorCorvette's Avatar
BaylorCorvette
Burning Brakes
10 Year Member
All Eyes On Me
Liked
Loved
 
Joined: Aug 2011
Posts: 764
Likes: 258
From: League City Texas
Default

Originally Posted by descartesfool
All that testing on track makes one wonder how they could possibly sell so many Corvettes that overheat on track. How can that be possible? Did they not see the overheating while testing on al those tracks that owners who drive their cars fast on track would have to put up with?
Those were my exact thoughts as I was reading through this.
Old Jun 5, 2017 | 03:06 PM
  #14  
truth.b's Avatar
truth.b
Drifting
10 Year Member
Liked
Loved
Community Favorite
 
Joined: Mar 2012
Posts: 1,308
Likes: 123
From: Raleigh North Carolina
Default

Originally Posted by descartesfool
All that testing on track makes one wonder how they could possibly sell so many Corvettes that overheat on track. How can that be possible? Did they not see the overheating while testing on al those tracks that owners who drive their cars fast on track would have to put up with?

Originally Posted by BaylorCorvette
Those were my exact thoughts as I was reading through this.
I'm still curious as to why "all" Z06's don't go into limp mode. From an engineering test perspective it makes me wonder if there is some corner-case style scenario causing the issue or if there is an unique difference in the manufacturing process from car to car.
Old Jun 5, 2017 | 03:09 PM
  #15  
Apocolipse's Avatar
Apocolipse
Le Mans Master
10 Year Member
Liked
Loved
Top Answer: 5
 
Joined: Aug 2013
Posts: 5,969
Likes: 1,409
Default

Driving style.

Get notified of new replies

To [ANSWERED] Track Testing/Validation

 




All times are GMT -4. The time now is 10:55 PM.

story-0
150 hp to 1,250 hp: Every Corvette Generation Compared by the Specs That Matter

Slideshow: From C1 to C8 we compare every Corvette generation by the numbers.

By Joe Kucinski | 2026-05-12 16:54:12


VIEW MORE
story-1
8 Coolest Corvette Pace Cars (and Replicas) of All Time

Slideshow: Some Corvette pace cars became collectible legends, while others perfectly captured the look and attitude of their era.

By Verdad Gallardo | 2026-05-11 09:50:51


VIEW MORE
story-2
Top 10 Corvette Engines RANKED by Peak Torque (70+ Years of Muscle!)

Slideshow: Ranking the top 10 Corvette engines by torque output.

By Joe Kucinski | 2026-05-05 11:58:09


VIEW MORE
story-3
Corvette ZR1X Will Be Pacing the Indy 500, And Could Probably Race, Too!

Slideshow: A Corvette pace car nearly matching IndyCar speeds sounds exaggerated, until you look at the numbers.

By Verdad Gallardo | 2026-05-04 20:03:36


VIEW MORE
story-4
Top 10 Corvettes Coming to Mecum Indy 2026!

Among a rather large group of them.

By Brett Foote | 2026-05-04 13:56:44


VIEW MORE
story-5
Top 10 C9 Corvette MUST-HAVES to Fix These C8 Generation Flaws!

Slideshow: the top 10 things Corvette owners want in the C9 Corvette

By Michael S. Palmer | 2026-04-30 12:41:15


VIEW MORE
story-6
10 Revolutionary 'Corvette Firsts' Most People Don't Know

Slideshow: 10 Important Corvette 'firsts' that every fan should know.

By Joe Kucinski | 2026-04-29 17:02:16


VIEW MORE
story-7
5 Reasons to Upgrade to an LS6-Powered Corvette; 5 Reasons to Stay LT2

Slideshow: Should you buy a 2020-2026 Corvette or wait for 2027?

By Michael S. Palmer | 2026-04-22 10:08:58


VIEW MORE
story-8
2027 Corvette vs The World: Every C8 vs Its Closest Competitor

Slideshow: 2027 Corvette lineup vs the world.

By Joe Kucinski | 2026-04-24 16:12:42


VIEW MORE
story-9
10 Most Common Corvette Problems of the Last 20 Years!

Slideshow: 10 major Corvette problems from the last 20 years.

By Joe Kucinski | 2026-04-14 16:37:05


VIEW MORE