Rob P

I am putting the T1 springs and swaybars on my car and will need to redo the alignment. I don't want a stock setup. What is a good street/track alignment set up?

Thanks.

tigerdrvr

If you search this forum, you'll find lots of information on alignment for track, autocross and street use.
Only problem is, not one alignment setting is going to work in all areas. I went fairly conservative on my alignment (-1.5f/-.6r camber, zero front toe, minimal rear toe in) and am still wasting the insides of my front tires...and nowhere near optimal for the autocross course, due to the compromise!
If you're willing to put up with the T1 springs (and end link rattling/noise), I guess you might as well set the car up for its intended use (track or autocross settings) and just plan on flipping the tires on the rims and buying more tires.
What is the car's intended use?

Cisitalia

I highly recommend that you get the Hardbar fixed camber kit that nominally gives you -1.8 degrees in the front and -1.4 degrees in the rear. I lowered my car on the stock bolts and ended up about -2.0/-1.5. My inside street tires don't wear excessively and the Hoosier track tires love the more negative camber. I have front neutral toe and I think about 1/8" or 1/16" total toe in the rear. The kit is under $200 and you never need to set the camber again. Also no risk on it changing as with the stock eccentric cams. I am very happy with this setup.

dmtnt

Just installed mine this past weekend.

AU N EGL

A combination is not easy to do. The hardbar eccentrics at -1.8 would be a good set up.

did you also put on the T1 A-arms and T1 shocks?

tigerdrvr

The hardbar kit is a great idea...if I wasn't running SS in SCCA Solo II, I would go for it, for sure.
I'm curious how some of you guys are getting even tire wear with more negative camber than I'm running in front. I'm getting excessive inside wear, even with zero toe. Maybe I just drive my car too easy on the street or do more freeway miles?

Cobra4B

Last time I had mine done it was -1.3 f camber per side w/ neutral toe and -1.0 r (as close as possible w/ factory adjusters) and 1/16 toe in per side. The difference in handling was startling... my specs were all over and not even close to stock... it was crazy.

John Shiels

I have never had a rattle from the T-1 links they are set to zero preload

Timz06

I ran for a while with 1.5 neg and didn't really wear my tires on the inside. I don't think I'd go past that if you are going to drive on the street much.

AU N EGL

I agree with John on the end links. To even the ware out just do more corners and go faster j/k

I have a full T1 now and love it. The T1 eccentrics have a little more agressive negiative camber, and are great on corners.

Dont drive it much on the street anymore.

Too many cops pulling "different Looking" and if your exhaust has any tone to it they are all over you too. cars over here in Raleigh these days.

0C5stein

I'm not sure that you realize that you are not supposed to install this kit and assume that both sides of the car will have the same Camber and caster settings. There are very few, if any cars & none that I have seen with this or GM's fixed camber kit that netted the same camber and caster measurement on both sides of the car.

Sure they will not allow the camber setting to change like the stock eccentrics will, but they require you to use "old school alignment shims" on the upper control arm to get both sides to match for camber and caster.

Most street driven C5s on non-runflat tires get -3/4 camber, +7caster, 1/8 toe in on the front and zero toe for the rear. In my experience, and I align 8 to 12 C5s each month, for a street driven C5 or Z06, any more than -1.5 camber for the average driver will cause the inner shoulders to wear out prematurely. By the same token, an aggressively driven , sticky tired car will want close to -2.5 camber in the front and -1.5 in the rear for AutoX and most likely somewhere in between for HPDEs. With the T1 springs and bars, your car will not lean as much as a stock sprung car so you probably will not need as much neg camber for the same speed.

Your real question(s) is (are) "what is the best alignment settings for the street?" and "What is the best setup for the track?" and then "where in between do I want to be?"

The bottom line is that for every driver, there is a "Preferred" setup for the street and a "Preferred" setup for the track and those setups are as unique as each driver. Then there is the compromise of where in between are you willing to live with.

My C5 is driven 90% on the track, so I dial in my best track settings and live with it for the few times I drive on the street. Most guys drive on the track 2 to 4 times each year so on there car I would set the car up for the street and let them live with outside shoulder wear when they go to the track. Now some of my customers have me align their cars for the street, and when they are planning a track day, they bring the car in, I set it up for the track based on the information that I have saved for them, and after the track event, they come back and I reset their car to street specs. While that sounds a bit expensive, for the guys that only track a few times each year and do drive their car alot on the street, we can maximize their tire life which usually ends up saving them money.

tcmc5

If you don't want to use camber plates you can get lots of camber by adding spacers behind the front upper A arm brackets. I've got -2.40 this way and plenty of caster to boot. Not a good street setting but my Hoosiers love it. Unlike with the camber plates, though, it must be checked. You should be able to get -1.50fr -1.0 rear just using the stock setup and that worked fairly well on my car without excessive wear. The tires can always be flipped to wear more evenly.

tigerdrvr

I drove a C5 with the T1 kit a couple of weeks ago. "Rattle" wasn't the right word and, for all I know, the heim joints could have had excessive wear and no maintenence, but they made noticeable noise and you could feel the rod ends "working".
Only point I was making is if you're hard core enough to use that set up on the street, you're probably not using the car as a daily driver and might as well dial in a real track alignment and put up with the tire wear and trips to your local tire guy to have the tires flipped on the rim and rebalanced, given a small amount of street mileage

Mikelly

I've got a Z06 suspension under my car (99 C5 Coupe) and I'm running 1.5 deg. Neg Front camber/ 1.0 degree Neg rear camber with zero front toe and minimal rear toe in on the rear. Im' running over 7 degrees positive caster. The car was much more stable at this last track event in Feb. than it was back in Spetember. Car is lowered about an inch.

I'm seeing no negative wear on the tires and I drive my car 62 miles each way at least once or twice per week!
Mike

Cisitalia

C5stein,

I do realize a fixed camber kit will not guarantee exact values. I quoted the average of the L/R values for simplicity. Note that I used the words "nominally" and "about." To me it is obvious, you get what you have. That may not be obvious to others, so thank you for the comment.

Believe me I am saving more money on track tires than on street tires. My street tires have 11k miles on them, with many more miles left. There is some extra inside wear, but not excessive. Easy price to pay for better performance at the track and extended track tire wear.

I am completely content with my compromise setup.

Rob P

Thanks for all the advice.

I will be driving my car on the street daily and will be tracking the car maybe 10 times per year. I do drive aggressively so I do want settings somewhere in between.

It seems like the -1.5 up front with 0 toe and -1 in the rear with close to 0 toe is up my alley.

I am still looking for a set of T1 swaybars so once I find them and install them, I will take my car in for the alignment. The springs are not on the car yet either.

tigerdrvr

^that seems to be the accepted compromise street/track set up. Although, I would toe in the rear a bit, like 1/8" each side.

FlamerF1

the toe is what will eat up the tires more than the camber. 1/8 each side is great if you own a tire store. it is great for foward bite but street tires will suffer.

tigerdrvr

Agreed, toe settings can eat up tires. But, I wouldn't want to drive a car with -1.0 rear camber and no toe...it just won't drive off turns very well. And, if you're going to go hardcore and put up with the T1 suspension on the street, why not set the alignment in a way that you get the benefits?

0C5stein

Toe in on the rear is okay for some people, but I prefer Zero rear total toe up to 1/8 toe out. It forces you to get on the power sooner and I find I have much faster lap tiemes and corner exit speeds with a touch of toe out. One big caviot, toe out is absolutly aweful if you trail brake into corners or decide to lift while in a corner. You see, stock bushings will give under braking and acceleration so under braking the rears actually will toe out, assisting in the car initiating the turn (for some too much) and when you are under power and the rears try to toe in, the rears run more true rather than toeing in really hard under power. This setup is not for trail brakers or inexperianced drivers.

I usually run 1/16" toe in on the front witch give about zero toe once the car is rolling.

7 to 8 degrees positive caster is really great as it adds negative camber to the outside front wheel in a turn while giving positive camber gain to the inside wheel (which is just what you want). Only problem is that if you are not running a power steering cooler (ala Z06 or Z51) then you stand a good chance of burning up your power steering at the track durring the summer.