toms silver 60

283-
flushed radiator, hvy duty stuff-some improvement
head job-couldn't tell
cleaned out block drain holes-success!
350 (lots more heat generated)
steel racing fan-better, still problems in traffic, eats up HP high rpm
straight water-a little better
water wetter- couldn't see any difference whatsoever
vacuum advance distributor-better
full fan shrouds-maybe a little better
Dewitt aluminum radiator-definitely better, but not 100%
17" flex fan per Bad Bill's recommendation-VIOLA!
current-2/3 fan shroud, 17" flex fan, DeWitts radiator, 50/50, vacuum advance distributor.

Aluminum radiators are very susceptible to corrosion, which is why Dewitts demands the 50/50, even though it doesn't cool as well.

NOM61

I have no affiliation with any product. I have used them however, unlike yourself.

1. 100 is not 115.
2. Stock is not modified.
3. C2's were designed for A/C. C1's weren't.

Add 100 hp to your stock engine and come drive from Barstow to Vegas on a nice August afternoon with the A/C on. Lets see how your engine temps do then.

With a pressurized system at 100 degrees, the only thing antifreeze is doing, besides preventing corrosion, is reducing the efficiency of your cooling system.

Reducing surface tension WILL increase the efficiency due to increased contact. That's just basic physics. Distilled water is more efficient than glycol. That's just a basic fact.

And just because it ain't what your pappy used don't make it "snake oil". Not always.
I'm very happy that the factory recommended coolant mix works for you in your factory stock vehicle. Not exactly a surprise. For anyone with "stock" builds, operating inside the deigned parameters its the way to go.

But for those who have strayed outside the box, sometimes you have think outside the box.

DT

Jebbysan

It is not the surface tension that helps heat transfer....it is reducing the boundry layer...

Put your hand in hot water....leave it there for one minute.....then move it around....it will feel hotter moving as the boundry layer is reduced.....

Water Wetter and Royal Purple ICE reduce the boundry layer allowing for augmented heat transfer.....

Personally....the short Chevy pump is a joke.....anything you can do here to improve flow helps.....

And yes 100 is not 110 either But mine stays cool...as I never drive it when it is that freaking hot!

Jebby

MiguelsC2

Just more mumbo jumbo to sell products.Looks like a few here took the bait.

My motor is high compression and solid lifter. If you have more HP? You go to a larger capacity system. NOT SNAKE OIL ("miracles in a bottle")!

NOM61

Surface tension creates the boundary layer.

DT

NOM61

Have a nice day. I'm done playing. Don't really care if your not biting cause I'm not selling.

DT

Jebbysan

Now that I think about it....you are right

I personally don't use the stuff.....distilled water has great transfer properties....

Keeping the system super clean is a bonus as well....

Jebby

tuxnharley

Not sure if we're talking about the same use/application for the additives I mentioned in my original post, but if used properly those additives are not "snake oil" and do serve a useful purpose. They can restore anti freeze to its proper neutral ph and prevent corrosion. Get some ph test strips (remember your high school chemistry class?) and try it on some old anti freeze, then with the additive. Might even make a believer outta ya!

JohnZ

"Water-Wetter", "Purple Ice", and the other "miracles in a bottle" are primarily surfactants, to reduce nucleate boiling (steam bubble formation) at "hot spots" on the surface of cast passages, and are designed to be used with water as the coolant, which is mandated by most road-racing sanctioning organizations.

All commercial anti-freeze coolants already have surfactants in their additive package; if the coolant is reasonably fresh, the "miracles in a bottle" won't add any cooling performance.

0Tom@Dewitt

Guys, JohnZ is in the Corvette Museum "Hall of fame" for his years of contributing to the Corvette Hobby. A honor I probably will never see. So when he speaks...listen, he knows what he is talking about.

MiguelsC2

Thank you gentlemen!

I learned the details from you.

I am assuming they don't allow coolant on race tracks?

JohnZ

No, they don't, because it's extremely difficult and time-consuming to clean up slippery anti-freeze coolant spills; water is much quicker and simpler, and doesn't create slippery residue on the track surface if it rains (road-racers run in the rain).

Frankie the Fink

Wow .... 32 posts (33 counting this one) on anti-freeze...

NOM61

Sir,
I defer to your universally respected expertise.
Could you possibly share your opinion on the a couple questions?

1. With no risk of freezing and an upper temp limit below 230 in a pressurized system, what benefit do I derive from using antifreeze that I do not get from pure distilled water combined with water wetter that includes a non-corrosive additive?
2. Which is more effecient for heat transfer, glycol or distilled water?

Thank you sir.

DT

tuxnharley

Powershift

Not JohnZ, but let me respond.

1. I would like to first see and evaluate the corrosion additive package in the water wetter solution. I KNOW that Prestone yellow/green and Zerex G-05 have years of both lab and on-road experience with their corrosion additives. Zerex still posts this info on-line, although Prestone no longer does this. I personally worked in the chemical industry and made/evaluated Prestone AF in the early days. So the answer is what additives does "water wetter" have and what are their corrosion results for steel, iron, aluminum, brass, lead solder.....and what additives do they have to prevent/minimize water pump impellar cavitation?? If the additives packages are the same and are proven in lab and road tests, then there should be no difference or advantage.

2. Water is superior to glycol for heat transfer in radiator cooling system, but the data I have seen for a 50/50 mix shows very litttle heat transfer deterioration/reduction compared with pure water. If you go to 75/25 glycol/water or pure glycol, then the reduction in heat transfer becomes more pronounced and more significant.

Does this help??

Larry

NOM61

Larry,
Thanks for your response.

I've always struggled with the usefulness of glycol in vintage cars in the desert, assuming enough system pressure to prevent boilover.
My MGA has a notoriously under-capacity cooling system, designed to withstand sweltering British summer temps of 75 degrees F. Years ago I ditched the glycol in favor of distilled water plus Prestone anticorrosive additive and water wetter and have had good results.

I continued this with the 61, and have had zero corrosion related issues. I didn't know until recently that the wetters had corrosion inhibitors premixed. I believe at least one of them (Red Line?) claims the same certification as the major antifreeze products for corrosion resistance.

I'd go back to glycol in a heartbeat if anyone can give me a solid reason that it is better in the desert that is not based simply on preconcieved notions of "snake oil".

Thanks again,

DT

JohnZ

At typical cooling system pressure (15 psig), straight water will boil at 250*F; a 50-50 mix of glycol coolant and water at 15 psig won't boil until 265*F; that's another 15* of boilover protection.

SIXTYTWO

Always run a 50/50 mix of anti freeze and water. ALWAYS regardless of where you live. That's all you need , no snake oil.

tuxnharley

No one in the above or other posts- which I agree with - has addressed my original point about using the anti corrosion additives - which was the op's original question - to restore the ph balance on older but still clean anti freeze in cars that are lightly used with minimal miles per year. Why drain and replace when it is so easy to keep the anti freeze in proper balance?

I believe and have proven for over 20 years of experience that is a legitimate use of those additives and as such they are not "snake oil"! Interesting that no one has commented on that specific question but seem to prefer to just totally reject the additives as being useless.
Again, try the ph test strip evaluation if you don't believe me. Otherwise, the argument is pretty arbitrary.........