I went through quite an ordeal with drums when I got my 62 going a few years ago. I could not get a round drum, either new or used, turned on either of two local lathes. So I ended up putting discs on it front and back.


I hope you have better luck with it than I did.

 

Absolutely !!!!
You can bench bleed it and you can bleed it on the car.

 

I don't know the maximum stroke on a single cylinder master cylinder, but 3" of stroke at the pedal seems to be possible the spool in the master cylinder is bottoming out and that is the reason you are getting a hard pedal. Did you try readjusting the pads. If the shoes are not properly installed on the anchor pin and hanging out on the backing plate, you could adjust to drag, but then when you hit the pedal, the shoes move around. I would check all four again.
2-1/2" pedal stoke after the shoes drag is not correct. Could be a combination of air and mis-adjustment.
Just a though.

 

I will open a bleeder and check the stroke. With the bleeder open the pedal should go to the floor. If I get the same 3" travel I will know it is bottoming out.
I have had the drums off several times the brakes are assembled correctly and all are resting on the anchor pin. When adjusting the brakes I get all 4 just dragging the hit the brakes to center the shoes then go back and continue adjusting.

 

You know what you are doing, so I'm out of simple ideas. I occasionally have to remind myself how dumb I am when I do something simple wrong, but my wife doesn't let me forget.
Raybestos had a good web site with tech info on it that may help. You may have to disassemble the master cylinder and verify the spool is assembled correctly as some of this 'new' stuff from emerging countries is pretty much junk.
Ron

 

You could be right about the master not being good. On another forum, somebody suggested that every new master needs to be rebuilt..

 

Are you sure the piston diameters are correct at all four corners and at the master cylinder?

Live well,

SJW

 

As a last resort I will pull them and measure. They are supposed to be 1.125 is this correct?

 

Diameters need to be correct at wheel cylinders and master cylinder. Jim Lockwood can advise.

Live well,

SJW

 

R66
With the bleeder open the pedal will go to the floor.

 

The diameter of your wheel cylinders isn't what's causing your low pedal. I'll circle back to this.

Your adjustment technique, with all due respect to the shop manual, may be contributing to your low pedal. I've never had a satisfactory pedal height after backing off the adjusters. My technique is to adjust for a light drag, just enough that you can hear it and maybe feel it slightly.

However, it's also possible your low pedal is due to the shoes not being centered within the drum. For the front brakes try this:
- adjust the shoes for a very noticeable drag.
- loosen the nut on the anchor pin.
- shift the anchor pin up and down while feeling for a reduction in brake drag
- if you find a position for the pin which reduces the drag, snug the nut and re-adjust the shoes for a noticeable drag.
- rinse and repeat until you can not reduce the drag any further by shifting the anchor pin. Torque the nut on the anchor pin to spec.
- adjust the shoes for a light drag as I described above

As odd as it may seem, I've had to adjust the anchor pin as a result of installing new drums and new shoes.

Back to the front wheel cylinders, the stock cylinder diameter for 1959 is 1.125, which is what you have. After you've driven the car, you may find the brake pedal effort is more than you like. That effort can be reduced by converting to a 1.1875 wheel cylinder, as used from 1960 through 1962. If you want to swap out the wheel cylinders, good used '60 - '62 cylinders can sometimes be found on EPay. You can also "roll your own", so to speak. See postings #3 and #9 in this CF thread:

roll your own larger C1 wheel cylinders

To SJW, thanks for the vote of confidence. If the OP tries my suggestions, his results will reveal if that confidence was justified.

 

I know you said you adjusted the shoes tight then backed them off... When you readjust them do you crank them tight again, then back off??

 

I would say that it's justified, regardless of his results. Your reply raises a possibility that would have never occurred to me. It's a poor day if we don't learn something new. Thanks for allowing me to audit your class today, Professor Lockwood.

Live well,

SJW

 

Jim Lockwood
Thank you for that information I would not have thought of that.
Fist I am going to disconnect the master and plug it to make sure the master is ok, if that checks out I will follow your procedure.
I sure do appreciate all of the help on this.

 

What I did was adjust all the brakes till they drag then step on the pedal to center the shoes then adjust till they lock then back off.

 

IMHO, that'd be a waste of time. You've said that you get a hard pedal. That pretty much exonerates the master cylinder.

 

In all of my years of doing drum brakes, I ALWAYS!!! test fit the shoes to the drums. I put six chalk marks across the shoes, side to side, evenly spaced top to bottom. Place the shoe in the drum and clamp it with your hands and slide it up and out. Are all of the marks hitting? If just the very middle the drum could be too large or the shoe is incorrectly arced. We used to arc brake shoes, (yes I am that old), to fit the drum. Now days I find most of the shoes are junk! They rock corner to corner, or just hit in the middle, even with properly sized drums. If only hitting in the middle they will flex some when pressure is applied and you have low pedal. I went through two sets on the rear of my sixty before I was happy, and that was with new drums. Don't tell anybody, but I have taken them to the horizontal belt sander and carefully arced them a little, which is tricky , but can be done, (with a respirator).

The other thing that is very important to make drum brakes operate as designed, is drum diameters being very close. I always machine the drums to be the same, especially side to side. I have chucked up new drums and one would be out of round and I would machine it round, and although the other was round I would cut it to match the corrected drum, say plus .015" This helps avoid pulling to one side.

Drum size, and shoe fit, are a very important starting point. Then move on to the other guess work.

Just my thoughts. Good luck.

 

benrep
I am that old too, in my younger days I ran the machine shop in an auto parts store.
I have turned drums and rotors even flywheels, and yes I arced shoes.
Thanks for reminding me how important that is.

 

Since was sitting for 40 years we don’t know if this issue is with the new parts installed or 40 year old problem. Check that you have correct functioning pedal arrangement and geometry.
Chip

 

Chip
I drove this car 40 years ago, the brakes were fine.
I replaced everything because of deterioration.
The brake fluid turned to sludge and all of the lines were plugged.