verifying stamping??
Thread Starter
Pro
Joined: Sep 2007
Posts: 735
Likes: 1
From: Harleysville PA
verifying stamping??
i'm just getting started putting a 69 BB back together that I purchased as a "numbers matching" car but I would like to have an expert opinion before putting it back together to verify that no restamping occured in the past
Any advice on a where to find such a person??
Any advice on a where to find such a person??
Thread Starter
Pro
Joined: Sep 2007
Posts: 735
Likes: 1
From: Harleysville PA
Instructor
Joined: Apr 2006
Posts: 243
Likes: 0
From: Canton MI
I'm certainly no expert, first off. But the fact that you are even asking and going to the trouble of posting this makes me think you're suspicious...is that right? For some reason, at first glance, those numbers really don't look like they're 40 years old. Something just doesn't look right.
Like I said, I'm certainly no expert...hopefully others with more experience will chime in.
Good luck and either way, you'll have a valuable and enjoyable car soon enough!
Like I said, I'm certainly no expert...hopefully others with more experience will chime in.
Good luck and either way, you'll have a valuable and enjoyable car soon enough!
Burning Brakes
Joined: Sep 2005
Posts: 755
Likes: 1
From: Hobart Tasmania
There is a technical guide put out by the NCRS that examines engine numbers. They have unique stampings and defects in the original markings which can not be forged. I used this guide and also found engine numbers from similar cars of my year. Fortunately my engine is original albeit rebuilt.
Race Director
Joined: Jul 2001
Posts: 15,892
Likes: 42
It's virtually impossible to tell a good restamp from an original stamp using pictures. The fact that your pad is partially painted and the pictures are way over exposed does not help.
Keep in mind that the surface finish of the pad is far more difficult to counterfeit than the stamped numbers.
Keep in mind that the surface finish of the pad is far more difficult to counterfeit than the stamped numbers.
Le Mans Master
Joined: Mar 2004
Posts: 7,472
Likes: 1,494
From: Little Rock AR
Looks like a decent restamp to me - no expert here.
The broach marks look wrong to me from here. If you can feel them easily with a fingernail they are even more suspect. Those look like they were probably done with a belt sander or possibly a file.
JMHO
-Mark.
The broach marks look wrong to me from here. If you can feel them easily with a fingernail they are even more suspect. Those look like they were probably done with a belt sander or possibly a file.
JMHO
-Mark.
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Melting Slicks
Joined: Apr 1999
Posts: 2,675
Likes: 13
From: Sudbury MA
Al Grenning on the NCRS Technical Discussion Board at www.ncrs.org is the expert on engine stampings.
He can answer your question
Post it there, or e-mail him clear pictures of your engine stamping.
Kurt
He can answer your question
Post it there, or e-mail him clear pictures of your engine stamping.
Kurt
Last edited by ksbunting; Nov 3, 2007 at 11:03 PM.
Team Owner
Joined: Jul 1999
Posts: 26,545
Likes: 46
From: Huntersville NC
It is hard to tell from the pics. From the engine # you are supposed to have a 69 L68 (400 hp) with manual trans. The engine date is November 8, 1968. The vin is < 10,000, an early car obviously, but I can't make out the 6th digit or the last digit. I can read 19S70?05C, but that last "C" is likely a zero. These numbers should match your vin, so you should know exactly what these numbers are supposed to be. I will tell you that according to the Black Book, the last car produced in October 1968 was vin #6272, so if your engine was made November 8, it seems to me it should have gone into a car with vin > 6272, so hopefully that ? is an 8 or 9 ! The trim tag should also indicate a similar build date, in November or December 68. So, if all the numbers are consistent, then you have to figure out if they are original or stamped on there after the fact, which is the tricky part.
The trim tag should also indicate a similar build date, in November or December 68. So, if all the numbers are consistent, then you have to figure out if they are original or stamped on there after the fact, which is the tricky part.
Team Owner
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 31,218
Likes: 4,305
From: Westminster Maryland
Judging a pad by using a photo is the same as judging a paint job by using a photo. Your eyes just don't get enough information to make more than a guess. Seem to be some pretty distinct broach marks in the first photo but not in the second... this is because????.
Regards,
Alan
Regards,
Alan
Thread Starter
Pro
Joined: Sep 2007
Posts: 735
Likes: 1
From: Harleysville PA
I'm certainly no expert, first off. But the fact that you are even asking and going to the trouble of posting this makes me think you're suspicious...is that right? For some reason, at first glance, those numbers really don't look like they're 40 years old. Something just doesn't look right.
Like I said, I'm certainly no expert...hopefully others with more experience will chime in.
Good luck and either way, you'll have a valuable and enjoyable car soon enough!
Like I said, I'm certainly no expert...hopefully others with more experience will chime in.
Good luck and either way, you'll have a valuable and enjoyable car soon enough!
no really, the car is in pieces and i want to get someone to verify (or at least an expert opinion) that the block and trans are not restamped. its harder to verify after the car is back together and may influence how much i pour into the restoration. today i found the frame stamp and verified that it matches the VIN, then proceeded to paint over it
it will be a great car. thanks
Thread Starter
Pro
Joined: Sep 2007
Posts: 735
Likes: 1
From: Harleysville PA
It is hard to tell from the pics. From the engine # you are supposed to have a 69 L68 (400 hp) with manual trans. The engine date is November 8, 1968. The vin is < 10,000, an early car obviously, but I can't make out the 6th digit or the last digit. I can read 19S70?05C, but that last "C" is likely a zero. These numbers should match your vin, so you should know exactly what these numbers are supposed to be. I will tell you that according to the Black Book, the last car produced in October 1968 was vin #6272, so if your engine was made November 8, it seems to me it should have gone into a car with vin > 6272, so hopefully that ? is an 8 or 9 ! The trim tag should also indicate a similar build date, in November or December 68. So, if all the numbers are consistent, then you have to figure out if they are original or stamped on there after the fact, which is the tricky part.
The trim tag should also indicate a similar build date, in November or December 68. So, if all the numbers are consistent, then you have to figure out if they are original or stamped on there after the fact, which is the tricky part.
Thread Starter
Pro
Joined: Sep 2007
Posts: 735
Likes: 1
From: Harleysville PA
Judging a pad by using a photo is the same as judging a paint job by using a photo. Your eyes just don't get enough information to make more than a guess. Seem to be some pretty distinct broach marks in the first photo but not in the second... this is because????.
Regards,
Alan
Regards,
Alan
Race Director
Joined: Jul 2001
Posts: 15,892
Likes: 42
You've got the right idea by having someone knowledgeable look at your pad. Do him and yourself a favour- remove all traces of paint using a NON ABRASIVE method. Try paint thinner or naval jelly. Do not use steel wool or a scraper!
Note that the pad was not painted when it left the factory.
