you are talking about 2 appraisals here, at $300+ a pop, plus time and effort, plus hiring an attorney, court filing fees... you will easilly have 2000$+ just to start off, and it will escalate from there. anyway you are not going to win 2000.. numbers matching means alot more on a 69 that it does a 75 .. a 75 without a original motor may be worth 2000 less.... you will at best break even for a whole lotta hassle.. you gotta be realistic... these guys advising you to sue probably never went thru it all before either...

an appraisal is just an opinion.. prices vary drastically with different pedigree ... so that shop can easilly dispute your appraiser..

why did they have it for months? how often did you followup?... why rebuild 2 engines for your car?.. something sounds fishy.....

just talk to them nicely and settle on a compromise.. there is really not more you can do about it...

 

Is it possible they sent the block to a machine shop and it's still there? It doesn't just disappear - maybe the person you talked to didn't know where it was but someone else there does.

 

This is what I think. They probably sold it. They owe you what they got for it plus damage.

 

If you sue them, and they lose the suit, THEY pay the court costs and your legal fees (if you include them in the suit). THEY LOST YOUR PROPERTY....how can they win the suit? The "smart" thing to do is to file the suit and then have your attorney settle it before it is heard by the court. The shop will want to settle out of court...or they'll be out even more money.

 

I'm going to have to disagree. While it is indisputably true that many (most) appraisals are not worth the paper they are printed on, (PS, Ive never charged as much as $300) and many resources (NADA, etc) are worthless, I would think it would be MUCH easier to prove the "financial harm" in this case as opposed to trying to establish a reasonable value for the car. I dont know anything about your car, and it is true that a '75 is not especially collectible, but it is not hard to establish an original '75 roadster being worth in the neighborhood of $15k+, and even easier to gain agreement from any sort of experts who will say the value lost by removing the number-matching engine is significant. How much? By the cost of a crate motor? Seems to me that engine was 1 of 1... can't go buy it at the Corvette Engine Store. I think you would have a great case, and be able to make an argument for heavy damages.
And as others have said, you include your court costs and expenses in the damages. Besides, I'd rather lose money in court than just say, "oh, I give up, it's too hard. I can't win, anyway. Poor me." Screw that.

You did not say what the shop said after the BS about losing the engine. Did they make an offer? Did they try to track it down? Are they hoping you will shrug your shoulders because all this is too hard and maybe you will go away? Y'know, sometimes an opening letter of intent from your attorney stating that you will be filing a suit for $10k in losses including the lost value of the car, attorney fees, expert witnesses, research, lost wages, etc just might provoke that return call saying, "hey, whatdoya know, we found it!"

 

My opinion - exactly same a 7T1vette - simply as that.

 

I agree,
I'll bet as soon as they find out they're being sued they'll find your old engine ASAP. You have to be pretty stupid to lose an engine.

 

Stand your ground. I would even venture as far as to say someone may have wanted a "Vette engine" and it then became lost(personal thought). I think they might even quickly find the elusive motor as they find out what it may cost not to.

 

OK....here's what's going on to this point. The guy who owns the shop has a friend who has a friend who has a son who is a car nut and has a "Vette (don't know what year). In either case I agree with the fact that a 1975 Corvette engine is about as exciting as watching paint dry..however it is the one and only engine that belongs with the car. The point is as many of you agree is that it seriously decreases the value of my Roadster drastically.
The shop owner is at this moment running around doing his best to find it....he's a great guy. I've already called my insurance company (Hagerty) and they understand how serious this issue is. Thanks to everyone for your comments.....maybe I'll get some sleep this weekend.....sniff....snifff....!!

 

If the shop agrees to purchase and install a decent 350 crate engine in your car for the amount you agreed to for a rebuild of your engine, that might be an acceptable arrangement. If you feel you require additional compensation for the 'original engine' issue, negotiate with them to get the best deal you can.

 

I think there are some people on this forum that just are not looking at the whole picture here. I think the big question here is: What if it was your engine.
I'll bet each and everyone of you would be looking for some attorney to take this. And get as much as you could. I would too. This is theft.
It should be delt with the same as if someone were to break into your house.
You have to look at the long term. How much money will this car loose over the next 5, 10, 15, 20 years. I think thats the real question.

 

Yep I am scared to death of the machine shop "decking" the numbers off mine. I can't imagine losing it all together.

 

Much better. Sounds promising.

Imagine owning an original, numbers matching '75 roadster. Then imagine trading that engine, unrebuilt, for a crate motor even up.

Absolutely crazy. Thats what the above post amounts to. No way, not without hearing from my lawyer.

Just getting mine back from the shop. I was just as nervous.

 

To answer the "What if it were your car" version of the question, if it were my car personally, I wouldn't be looking for compensation - I would be looking for them to buy the car from me at this point. And I wouldn't be making diminished value the big part of the argument either - that's the small part. Now I don't know much about 75's or their values, but I know what I was looking for when I bought my 68 and I know that an identical one, sans matching numbers big block, would be worth least $10k less.

So approaching this as if it were my car we're talking about, I don't want their $10,000. I either want my motor back, or I want them to buy the car from me based on a classic car appraisal as if it still had the original block. You see, I hadn't ever planned on selling this car. I spent a year looking for a specific vehicle, with specific options, and of the utmost importance was an original drive train. Now, because of them, I no longer have that vehicle. Replacing the motor and or trying to buy me off for diminished value is unacceptable. I don't want this car anymore. I don't know how far this would get me, fortunately I've never had to try it, but if I had my way they would be buying the car from me for its appraised value based on having the original motor and then I would take that money and go out and find a different original car that met my criteria.

And off topic, but while we're on the subject of machine shops decking the numbers off, you may as well consider that NOM from that point forward and take the same approach. Everyone thinks "Oh, just get a letter from the shop that swears the numbers were on there and that will be OK" but I'll tell you as a collector, I'd run like hell from that car, and VetteBuyer will probably back me up here. I don't give a crap what some builder says was once there... if it's not there, it's not there, and I'm not going to waste my time with chemical tests or any other crazy crap to see if it was ever there. It's not there NOW, and that's all that matters. So if you find yourself in THAT situation too, consider my approach.

 

Great points there Ron...I guess its kinda the same thing as if someone rammed a F150 up the vettes rear end causing unrepairable damage. It is not and will not ever be the same car again. Someone has to pay to replace it.

 

If you don't know where your engine went (and the shop owner doesn't divulge or know either), you can't claim "theft". All you can do is claim that your property is missing and it was his responsibility; and then can obtain reasonable compensation for your loss. You can try to win the case that he has to replace your car with a similar numbers-matching car....but the judge better be a car guy/gal, or it likely won't wash. Just figure out what you feel is fair monetary compensation (including value lost for the numbers-matching issue) and try to settle it.

{Geez, guys...it's a '77 car, not a '68 or '69.... That difference today is not that much. And you can't win a case on what that value might be in the future.}

 

This is my own opinion. This was of a theft of a 600 pound motor that the owner was smart enough to get the original motor rebuilt to make the car worth much more money. I think bringing in law enforcement to deal with this problem is enough to get the engine re- builder off his *** to find the original motor and rebuild it as agreed upon.To deal with a lawyer would end up costing more than the trouble involved.
I have been dealing with a lawyer since 2003 for a serious back injury and his law firm specializes in work place injuries.
Ya gotta put he fear of God in this guy the get results.
I don't care what anybody says this builder knows where that motor went and if ya don't get law enforcement involved you wont get sh*t.
They are more afraid of the law than the courts.
File a theft report and let him explain that.
Good luck buddy and I truly believe that motor will show up out of thin air and i would insist it be rebuilt for the time and BS you had to go through for a motor you had made an agreement to rebuild.
Name the shop and where it is so he knows your gonna tell the story exactly as it happened. You cannot be sued for slander for telling people with the same interests as you as long as you don't exaggerate or tell any lies.

I bought my first brand new car (1977 Firebird) in 1977 after driving junk for years. For $3,900, it was a leader worth $5,000 if ordered.
We took off on out first drive to the mountains. They say i got bad gas because it would not run at all. For a car that was a week old i told them to fix it or i would drive it through their show room floor with a huge sign letting everybody know they sold a guy making less than $3.00 an hour a lemon and wouldn't fix it.
The squeaky wheel gets the grease because all it was, was a clogged fuel filter. They emptied the tank and refilled it and changed the filter and the car still runs today like a new one because i know the owner.
If ya don't push what weight yo have around you'll get nothing.
With my horrible temper in those days believe me i would have done it.
When ya make $3 bucks an hour with a new car that will not run ya got nothing to loose.
Good luck my friend and don't take no sh*t off anybody because you seriously got ripped off.

 

First thing you should be doing is calling the poice and filing a police report for a stolen engine and you tell them what the value of the actual engine is. They will have to go talk to the shop owner and that may be enough to have it magically reappear. If not any atty would want this to build the case upon.

 

The car is a '75 Roadster.....the last of the ragtops until '86 I think. It is a classic in it's own right. I haven't heard from the shop today. I'll give them 'till Monday before I contact them. You guys/gals who answered my note are really helpful and I have read your notes several times..they made me feel better and I hope this doesn't happen to you...or anyone else. Please keep your fingers crossed for me and will let you know more on Monday. Thanks again!!!

 

You have every right to inform the police that your property is missing from the shop. But you authorized them to take the engine and rebuild it. Be careful about accusing them of "theft" if you don't know what happened to that engine. I just don't think you want to be seen as the "bad guy" here.