I'm looking at a 1968 Corvette that does not have the original engine or transmission in it (currently has a 350/4-speed).

Is there any way to find out what the original engine/transmission combination was? The seller has a decent tank sticker, but I'm not sure there is any way to verify that his tank sticker goes with the VIN of the car he is selling.

Any ideas?

Thanks.

 

The tank sticker should tell you what options it was built with.
Are you looking to restore this vehicle to the original configuration?

 

Besides the build sheet, the quickest way to see if it was a 4-speed or auto is the trans support crossmember. If it's welded to the side frame rails, it's originally a 4-speed. If it's bolted to the side rails, it was an auto. It's a lot of work to convert an auto to a 4-speed.
Glenn

 

you have to have faith that the tank sticker originally came with that specific car.. don't necessarily trust the current owner, he may not know either. there are fake ones out there that only the best of the best can tell it is fake.

ditto on the crossmember. also know the stats.. only 5000 or so of the 28000 68 corvettes were automatic. so the statistical likelyhood is that it is a 4 speed originally.

it could have been converted to a bolt on by a previous owner, it might have been raced and converted to a bolt on to make tranny and clutch swap outs easier...

all sorts of scenarios...

 

Thanks for the responses guys. I would like to return it to original configuration in time. The tank sticker states L71, 4-speed, and it does have a welded crossmember.

I was told by an NCRS member I phoned to look at a few other items to determine if it was a big block car (tach redline area, rear diff half shafts and rear sway bar to name a few), understanding that these could possibly have been swapped out over its life.

I'll keep my fingers crossed that I can ID more identifying items.

Thanks again.

TJ

 

I'd love to hear of another big block saved. If it now has a 350, I tend to think if it were originally a big block, the big block parts would still be there. It wasn't uncommon to replace a big block with a small block years ago when these cars weren't worth much either way. I doubt someone would go through the trouble of faking a big block, then stick a small block in it.

A few other items to look for may be a larger radiator and radiator support, think it was 27 1/2 inches wide for the big block. Caps on the diff rather than U bolts, half shaft U joints. Heavier front springs. I going by what's different on a 70, not entirely sure the 68 is the same.

I hope you realize restoring it to a big block won't matter to the collectors. Once the original block is gone the collectors won't be interested. I personally wouldn't let that stop me, just keep it in mind when you consider how much it may be worth, how much you have into it.

Best of luck...

 

You can consider that reliable. The L71 and 4 speed were options and neither would have been on the tank sticker unless they were to be installed on the car. I would think M21 would be part of the option code for the 4 speed.

Post a pic of your tank sticker.

 

If that tank sticker is 'complete' [not torn or missing pieces] and is not faded and stained badly, it probably is a reproduction and you can't have any faith in what it says. Check the physical components that are different between BB's and SB's along with the tach redline to make judgement on what was in the car originally.

If you want a BB and the car is presently a SB setup, look for another car. Since the one you are looking at does not have the original powertrain, it is of no greater value to use as a 'canvas' for building what you want than any other car. Find one with the correct configuration, then build it to replicate what you want.

 

The tank sticker is not totally complete, the upper left corner is a bit jagged. It is a bit faded, but you can still read the options. Even though I am not an expert, I would say it looked original to me.

When I get the car and any documentation the current owner can find, I will get a pic of the tank sticker posted.

Thanks.

TJ

 

Love to hear these 427/435 sad stories...they all begin to sound the same. How can one of the most powerful and desirable vettes be so abused and mistreated? Here it is, 2011 and these things are still coming out of the woodwork. Barn finds, replaced engines, missing engines, no documentation, faked documentation, etc. Must have something to do with charging more money for the story....

I agree with 7T1vette. If you want a BB car, find one that already has a BB in it...original or not, whatever your budget can afford. You will be way ahead of the game.

 

a 68 L71 is pretty rare, and one with a readable tank sticker would be exceptional. and one without the original engine means it hasn't been counterfeited yet, even though a L71 is probable the most highly counterfeited option. you have to decide if that L71 option, without an actual L71 engine in it, is worth the extra money above and beyond a small block NOM car.

the counterfeiters will probably jump on this car and pay above what a novice ( that has no intention of counterfeiting this car) would, or should pay.

if an expert could declare that the tank sheet is 'the real deal', then this car would be double the price if a correct casted and dated block with a correct stamp were installed.

understand that the word 'correct' is nebulous..

 

Building a fake 'original' car engine in order to get big buck$ for it by selling is as "original" is fraud. Now, if you want to build an L71 'replica car'....correct block stamp and all...for yourself, and planning on letting any future buyer know that it is a "replica", more power to you. Have at it.

 

...and the "true story" will surely end with the next buyer after that.

 

A worker on the assembly line held the order bundle (7 pages with carbons) by the upper left corner, pulled off the tractor feeds, took out the carbons, and managed to tear off the upper left corner in the process. A lot of the stickers have the left upper corners missing.



Be glad yours doesn't look like this one.



Post a pic of your tank sticker.

 

Though it's been done many times over...

So far as being a replica car, if an 'expert' can validate the tank sheet, I personally won't call it a replica. IMO it is then a restoration. Not the original block but evidence it was built this way, not an upgrade or replica.

To address the issue of intentional fraud the owner could leave the stamp pad blank. The NCRS takes only a small deduction. So far as what a future seller does with the car, it's out of the current owners control anyway. Any future owner can misrepresent the car, even upgrade it and market as a rare vehicle. If originality is important to a buyer and they're willing to pay big $$, it is the buyer's responsibility to have everything examined by experts. I say this of ANY Corvette which is bringing in big $$.

The other option, just inserting a replacement big block would work for me as well, assuming all the other parts are already there, just an engine change and maybe a few small parts. Could make a nice weekend driver for somebody. Whether it would be cheaper to buy another which already has the big block isn't clear. Much depends on price and condition. The motor alone doesn't cost that much.

Depends on whether the tank sheet is authentic and what the buyer wants out of this car.

If the tank sticker is found to be authentic, I'd vote for restoration, find a correct block, etc, and restore it. 'Correct' needn't be nebulous, the NCRS does a good job of defining a standard for what is 'correct'.

 

Interestingly, NCRS has no problem with a non-original engine block being stamped with the 'original' codes for that car. They don't validate it, they don't encourage it, they don't discourage it. Basically, they just don't care. And if it looks like it could be original, no points are deducted. Personally, I think that approach sends the wrong message and actually encourages folks to build "intentionally fraudulant" vehicles. But, that's just my opinion....

 

I didn't say the NCRS has no issues with restamping a block, they may or may not, I don't know. Going from memory, a conversation with a former NCRS official, I recall the NCRS accepting a 'correct' block, casting number and date code as being the bulk of the points for the engine. If somebody were to stamp a new (false) number on there, I'm not sure what the NCRS has to say about that. I know they try hard to detect this, study of broach marks, etc. It seems if someone wants to have the car judged by NCRS, a non original block, they had best let the judges know it's a replacement, not original, or at least leave the pad blank. A blank pad isn't a big deduction. Obviously this won't fly if the car is being judged as a survivor.

To be honest, I don't see much value added by an 'orignal' block if the car has been extensively restored. To me a 'correct' block is the same. Not to say many buyers feel the same way, just my opinion. A survivor is another matter, by definition it MUST be original.

It may be the NCRS doesn't worry as much about the 'originality' of all parts for non survivors as the collectors do. I don't know, I'm not a member though I'm considering it. I believe the NCRS is interested in restoration, not necessarily interested in what influences market value. I have heard of owners being tossed out if a car is found to be a fake so I think they do care to some degree if it's configured as it was originally built which suggests they definitely do not condone fraud.