Mine's a few months away...
Smog Victory
Thread Starter
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Joined: Oct 2013
Posts: 557
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From: El Sobrante CA
Smog Victory
This will seem stupid to you 'extra-Californicated' C3 pilots, but to smog-decreed Cali 76-82 C3 owners, maybe slightly entertaining.
I brought my '76 Shark in for a smog cert last week. Shop I go to has - at least until then - treated me fairly. Anyhoo, car fails the smog miserably. Shop owner insists "..idle too high; timing unknown; noxious gas above acceptable..." Estimating the entry level price to be about $200, the shop owner advises me that after the timing can be determined, they'd provide scientific analysis (and another potentially high estimate to fix) the alleged noxious fume issue.
Unconvinced, I refuse their generous offer and come back home where I check the timing myself: -8 degrees BTDC - just like the 'Official Sticker' ordains. I decide to shoot craps and have the car re-tested elsewhere. It passes without issue.
I call up the Shop Keep and in very deliberate terms, express to him that I smell something rotten in Denmark. After making all sorts of excuses, he agrees to refund my fee.
A small, inconsequential victory but it made my day. Merry Christmas! Happy New Year. Keep enjoying your C3s.
I brought my '76 Shark in for a smog cert last week. Shop I go to has - at least until then - treated me fairly. Anyhoo, car fails the smog miserably. Shop owner insists "..idle too high; timing unknown; noxious gas above acceptable..." Estimating the entry level price to be about $200, the shop owner advises me that after the timing can be determined, they'd provide scientific analysis (and another potentially high estimate to fix) the alleged noxious fume issue.
Unconvinced, I refuse their generous offer and come back home where I check the timing myself: -8 degrees BTDC - just like the 'Official Sticker' ordains. I decide to shoot craps and have the car re-tested elsewhere. It passes without issue.
I call up the Shop Keep and in very deliberate terms, express to him that I smell something rotten in Denmark. After making all sorts of excuses, he agrees to refund my fee.
A small, inconsequential victory but it made my day. Merry Christmas! Happy New Year. Keep enjoying your C3s.
Burning Brakes
Joined: May 2014
Posts: 1,094
Likes: 16
From: Los Angeles California
that's good he refunded your money back I was just about to tell you to report it to the bar but if you got your money back no need to go that far I guess but yeah most people see these old cars and automatically assume it wont pass even if everything is connected but it all depends on where you go. Some places will nit pick everything like the clamp is loose FAIL or the hose is old (but not cracked or leaking) FAIL and others will just tell you I'm a pass you but please change this or tighten that. But glad to see a 76 pass on oe equipment. I always tell people to make sure they run there cars for like 30 minutes before getting to the smog shop drive it on freeway and everything smash on it get all those fumes out not just turn it on in the morning and drive around corner to your shop and let it sit till they start smog them cats need to be hot to function correctly.
Team Owner
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 37,637
Likes: 3,118
From: Crossville TN
Money refunded, or not, I would still report this to the State Emissions Board. They look very unfavorably at shops that 'abuse' their authority. If this shop was doing it to you, they are likely doing it to everyone (especially to Corvette owners!). You should have the data reports for both testing locations to document your claim.
Burning Brakes
Joined: May 2013
Posts: 789
Likes: 129
From: Los Banos CA
Just went thru smog with my 79 a few months ago (first time this car saw smog since 2001). There is a BAR website where you can actually lookup all smog tests done to a car, so your 'initial' fail might be listed here, unless they a) did a 'pretest' first, or b) didn't actually test it at all. It doesn't give test result values, just pass/fail, and the dates.
http://www.bar.ca.gov/pubwebquery/Ve...PubTstQry.aspx
http://www.bar.ca.gov/pubwebquery/Ve...PubTstQry.aspx
Thread Starter
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Joined: Oct 2013
Posts: 557
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From: El Sobrante CA
Thread Starter
Pro
Joined: Oct 2013
Posts: 557
Likes: 3
From: El Sobrante CA
Also - thanks to the other posters for mentioning the Cali Smog Dept. I have print outs from both tests. Will probably check it out just for my own edification.
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Le Mans Master
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 6,842
Likes: 285
From: Palmdale CA
On the second try, I put some premium fuel in, then toured the 'motorway' for a 1/2 hour before showing up for the smog. Can't say whether that helped or not, but I'm sure it didn't hurt.
Also - thanks to the other posters for mentioning the Cali Smog Dept. I have print outs from both tests. Will probably check it out just for my own edification.
Also - thanks to the other posters for mentioning the Cali Smog Dept. I have print outs from both tests. Will probably check it out just for my own edification.
Sure enough, I did that and it passed with flying colors. Others mention the catalytic converter(s) and they have to be hot to remove the gases that will fail you, if they're cold. Also, if you have dirty oil in your car, that will cause it to fail too (my little bro, is a service manager at a dealership, but did smog checks for years here in Cali).
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Joined: Oct 2013
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From: El Sobrante CA
Secondly, the failed report was marked: "Idle out of spec; can't determine timing. Correct idle and retest.."
That's what stuck in my craw. They didn't even attempt to check the timing - at least in the way GM describes it - by detaching vacuum hoses, ensuring <>900rpm, etc etc. That's what I did, and timing proved correct.
Even more strange: according to that Cali Bar site, the last test done (prior to the one in 2013 when I purchased the car) was in 1996!! And the test was done on an "L82/210hp" engine. That can't be right; I'm virtually certain the engine is the original L48; it matches the VIN, says 'L48' on the shift console, etc etc.
Oh well. Mistakes happen. So do unwarranted attempts to extract funds from old car guys.
O
Le Mans Master
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 6,842
Likes: 285
From: Palmdale CA
Yep... The highest gas taxes in the nation and the worst streets, highways and roads, I've ever been on. And the 'Cap and Trade Carbon Credit' program? They're giving away 25% of it to low income neighborhoods for "Income Inequality" and "Environmental Justice".
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Joined: Oct 2013
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From: El Sobrante CA
Burning Brakes
Joined: May 2013
Posts: 789
Likes: 129
From: Los Banos CA
Well, I just looked again at both tests; each is more or less the same as the other. And yet the first test was failed at the '25MPH' level,' with essentially the same numbers. Suspicious.
Secondly, the failed report was marked: "Idle out of spec; can't determine timing. Correct idle and retest.."
That's what stuck in my craw. They didn't even attempt to check the timing - at least in the way GM describes it - by detaching vacuum hoses, ensuring <>900rpm, etc etc. That's what I did, and timing proved correct.
Even more strange: according to that Cali Bar site, the last test done (prior to the one in 2013 when I purchased the car) was in 1996!! And the test was done on an "L82/210hp" engine. That can't be right; I'm virtually certain the engine is the original L48; it matches the VIN, says 'L48' on the shift console, etc etc.
Oh well. Mistakes happen. So do unwarranted attempts to extract funds from old car guys.
O
Secondly, the failed report was marked: "Idle out of spec; can't determine timing. Correct idle and retest.."
That's what stuck in my craw. They didn't even attempt to check the timing - at least in the way GM describes it - by detaching vacuum hoses, ensuring <>900rpm, etc etc. That's what I did, and timing proved correct.
Even more strange: according to that Cali Bar site, the last test done (prior to the one in 2013 when I purchased the car) was in 1996!! And the test was done on an "L82/210hp" engine. That can't be right; I'm virtually certain the engine is the original L48; it matches the VIN, says 'L48' on the shift console, etc etc.
Oh well. Mistakes happen. So do unwarranted attempts to extract funds from old car guys.
O
The test is normally done at two different RPM's (unless your car was on the dynamometer, where the rear wheels actually spin) - idle and some higher RPM (2500?). The machine monitors the RPM to make sure it is at the correct level for each test. Your guy could have been purposely fiddling with the RPM during the idle test, knowing that it would show 'failed', and he could then sell you some repairs? Funny that he would mention that the timing was incorrect, when the report obviously states that timing could not be determined....
Probably goes without saying, but I think I'd be looking for a new shop.
Le Mans Master
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 6,842
Likes: 285
From: Palmdale CA
"It was the last week of the month, and Shanique Brown had already spent her $515 in CalWORKs benefits. Other programs would prevent Brown and her 18-month-old son, Armani, from going hungry, but the 22-year-old single mom had no money for a necessity so basic it is often forgotten: diapers."
'For an entire week, Brown stayed at home with her son, constantly asking him if he had to go to the bathroom."
“I cried and cried,” said Brown, now 24.
http://www.sacbee.com/news/politics-...le4499050.html
I cried too! I cried at the #*#$@ money they were taking out of my paycheck to pay for this bullchit. Unfriggin' believable.
Last edited by F22; Dec 16, 2014 at 05:34 PM.
Thread Starter
Pro
Joined: Oct 2013
Posts: 557
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From: El Sobrante CA
One of my prior smogs shows my car having an L82 also....
The test is normally done at two different RPM's (unless your car was on the dynamometer, where the rear wheels actually spin) - idle and some higher RPM (2500?). The machine monitors the RPM to make sure it is at the correct level for each test. Your guy could have been purposely fiddling with the RPM during the idle test, knowing that it would show 'failed', and he could then sell you some repairs? Funny that he would mention that the timing was incorrect, when the report obviously states that timing could not be determined....
Probably goes without saying, but I think I'd be looking for a new shop.
The test is normally done at two different RPM's (unless your car was on the dynamometer, where the rear wheels actually spin) - idle and some higher RPM (2500?). The machine monitors the RPM to make sure it is at the correct level for each test. Your guy could have been purposely fiddling with the RPM during the idle test, knowing that it would show 'failed', and he could then sell you some repairs? Funny that he would mention that the timing was incorrect, when the report obviously states that timing could not be determined....
Probably goes without saying, but I think I'd be looking for a new shop.
I don't claim to know everything - especially when it comes to auto repair. I'm always learning stuff. But when a shop owner knows me, understands that my 'weekend toy' isn't a daily driver - something I got to work on myself and not be reliant on an expensive expert (unless there's no other choice) - then dammit - show me a little consideration; don't patronize me or ASSume you can easily alarm me, turn me upside down like a saltshaker and dump coin into your till.
Irks me to think about it. Time for a beer.
Thread Starter
Pro
Joined: Oct 2013
Posts: 557
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From: El Sobrante CA
“I cried and cried,” said Brown, now 24.
http://www.sacbee.com/news/politics-...le4499050.html
I cried too! I cried at the #*#$@ money they were taking out of my paycheck to pay for this bullchit. Unfriggin' believable.
http://www.sacbee.com/news/politics-...le4499050.html
I cried too! I cried at the #*#$@ money they were taking out of my paycheck to pay for this bullchit. Unfriggin' believable.
)Geez!
