general ike

Hello all, here is another originality question from me. I hope I am not boring some of you!!!! So this is a 1971 350/270 4 spd with some mods in the engine bay.
here are some photos:








So I see valve covers, PCV, wire hangers, missing shielding, missing boot to the wiper pod,incorrect air cleaner, missing cover on wiper motor, plastic fuel filter (ouh) temp sensor on the manifold water inlet, wiring for it, missing vacuum line to the canister from the PCV, added MSD and wiring, headers, oddball grounds to nuts by hinge and what else all????

I am am looking for originality and would need to undo all these with the exception of the MSD system I would hide it a little to make it less obvious.


So the next question, this is a March production car but the tranny has a "T" in it for the month which would be December should it not be a "C or "D"? The Vin looks nice on it but the "T" looks odd and is in theory wrong. Thoughts everyone? Again I am looking for originality but I am not sure how to figure that out,, it doesn't match any of my reference material?

As always greatly appreciated!!!! Ike

Tonio

The T means that the tranny was built in December of 1970, which is very appropriate for a March 1971 production car.

Does the serial number stamped into the case match the car’s VIN number? If so, then that’s further and stronger proof that the trans is the original born-with trans for that car. Let us know.

general ike

Hey Anthony thanks for the reply!!!! If the tranny was built in December 1970 for 1971 production. Did they not start with "A" for the first month of production for the model year.

So since the first 1971 came out in December of 1971, would not the first set of trannys for 1971 be A, B, C etc? Or am I confusing this and Jan was A Feb was B etc not matter when the model year began in the year?

Thanks ike

62corvette

Sounds like a good time for you to purchase the NCRS tech manual/judging guide. All that is spelled out in detail.

general ike

I have so many other reference books that often disagree or are not clear, but not the NCRS guide, I keep saying I am going to get it but for some reason I don't!!!! The story is to always buy the book first!! Thanks Ike

Tonio

Here is how Muncie used letters to designate months of production. Notice that they did not use the alphabet in order; they skipped some letters. Why? Who knows!

Muncie Transmission Calendar Date Codes

A = January
B = February
C = March
D = April
E = May
H = June
K = July
M = August
P = September
R = October
S = November
T = December

They didn’t “start” building trannies in December, they (Muncie) built them year round. The tranny you posted happens to have been built in December, it went into the GM production que and was installed in a 1971 Corvette serial number 11757 per the photo you posted.

ThumpingLotus7

Other things I see as NTP in addition to your list

CEC relays, most clamps, water pump, fuel line from pump to carb, missing all spark plug shielding, the harness is unwrapped where it goes behind the wiper motor, missing windsheild washer bottle, lines and pump is 3/4ths gone, missing alternator boot, spark plug wires, distributor cap.

Things that may be NTP but are impossible to tell from the angles:

master cylinder & lid, alternator, carb, shielding inside of distributor

Here are the PNs for many of the harder to find parts for that car


Alternator -- 1100950
Master Cylinder -- 5460346 PG
Water pump -- 3991399 (no bolt on top)
Windshield washer bottle (no marks for fill level), with marks is a service replacement
Coil -- B-R 270
Distributor -- 1112050, vacuum advance 437 15
Carb -- 7041213 DM first three digits day of year, last digit = year
Radiator Cap -- RC26 15# aluminum center rivet (info on tab)
Distributor Cap -- PATENT PENDING R black

general ike

Thanks all great info. I guess I need to be more selective as to where I research. I often use Corvsport web page as a quick search if I am not by my books. It’s got a lot of info but it also has some errors. The tranny info is one of them. The vin number looks fine and matches so I thought it was correct but I could not understand the code.

Thanks for the info on the engine mods. I Now need to figure out what is available and what it will cost to restore.

As always greatly appreciated!!!! Ike

dmaxx3500

if your going to spend big bucks ,get the NCRS books first

and look at the frame,birdcage,susp,diff,trim tag

then after getting every number/date/casting/etc,,

''STEP BACK'' and look at them,then figure out if theres a better car for the same or cheaper money

and if your thinking of flipping it some day

''LOOK FOR RARE'' cars

general ike

Dmaxx I am buying for myself to enjoy. I enjoy cars that are as original as I can possibly afford. One of the issues I see is that the market seems to be in a flux. Hard to value a car these days. Ike

ThumpingLotus7

I agree -- that market especially for base motor coupes (70-72) is ALL over the place. The way I've made decisions in the past about this sort of thing is the following:

1. Can I live with the paint and bodywork as is? (I am NOT a bodyman, and I know the second I start spending on bodywork I'm going to go super upside down)
2. Is the frame solid? (Not does it have surface rust, but is it completely and totally solid. I check the kickups and body mounts extensively. Also the hard lines which run on top of the frame in the rear. Replacing those is a nogo without body off)

Once I get passed through 1 & 2 I begin to do the following:

3. What does an independent source say the car is worth (hagerty, corvette DNA)? How much money am I willing to "loose"?
4. Now I start checking mechancial / chasis / interior. Do stamps match, what parts are wrong etc, keeping a running budget of parts only to purchase. To get to my final offer I add to the independent value the amount of money I am willing to loose then subtract the parts budget. My first offer is typically their ask minus the parts budget and I do my best to explain, defend my parts budget.

Ike -- I'd also strongly suggest getting the NCRS manual, there is a new 6th edition which supplants the 5th edition which came out two years ago. If you're not willing to shell out the full cost for the new one there are plently of heavily discounted 5th editions out there. From my understanding the 6th edition was more of a minor update to the major that was the 5th. I wouldn't bring the manual with me to the inspection, but read it and familiarize yourself with generally what "correct" is. I do use the blackbook on inspections as it has the most important numbers in it. Key parts for me to check are, engine, trans, diff, alternator, carburator, distributor. To me those are the ones where dates can be hard to find, and if you're trying to buy one you'll definately have the crappy bargining position because the seller will know that you're screwed and have no other options but their part.

FWIW I think we are fairly local (I'm in northern westchester) if you ever find yourself up here give me a holler and we can meet. I have two NCRS 71's that I can show you anything you want on.

general ike

TL wisely put and I agree with your philosophy. It makes sense and is very logical. Paint and rust the two killers of these cars for me as well. The problem is figuring what is the baseline. The independent sources are all over the place. I seem to rely more and more on DNA, but the range is too wide to be specific.
I also think that there is a pretty decent gap between selling and asking price. The divide is increasing and less and less cars are selling as the buyer and seller cannot agree on value.

"Key parts for me to check are, engine, trans, diff, alternator, carburetor, distributor. To me those are the ones where dates can be hard to find",

The alternator, carburetor, distributor I can live with, won't be happy but I can and the price would need to reflect that. Its the little things that kill you, seat belts, radios. shielding etc. The things people would change out and just throw out the old part because it had little value and originality was not a concern.

We are close and thank you for the offer. I might take you up on that.

Thanks again all Ike

ThumpingLotus7

Glad to hear I'm not totally insane. Here is the secret about all the little stuff. It's all out there and exists in much larger quantities then you would initially think. It's just that it's not accessible online or through major providers. It's not even in atics and garages. There are many of people who have been buying and hoarding parts from many years who have absolutely no interest in marketing parts but if you find them and tell them that you need something and why they'll always have it. The only thing that's hard about guys like that is dates.

AllC34Me

Ike, I use the NCRS inspection sheets as a guideline to determine what is original and what is not original on a car. I did that for the latest purchase here which is my 1974 convertible. Originality is one thing you are seeking but don't forget condition. I have a very nice original car but some of those original parts are not in nice condition and getting them nice will be costly. Original, yes, nice, no. Previous owners often replace those parts with after market parts which are very nice. Nice, yes, original, no.

You can have both but you pay for that in time, effort, and money.

I agree that the NCRS guide is a great place to start. I use it and the Black Book for a lot of material. Of course, posting here is a good idea too.

Good luck with your search and best of success to you.

David Howard
AllVettes4Me