Rear Bearign Rebuild
Le Mans Master
Joined: Jul 2004
Posts: 6,248
Likes: 4
From: Lancaster PA
Originally Posted by gtr1999
Thanks Doug, I know you can do the job and that "other guy" 
near you will help if you have a problem too.
Turtle- Those Timken seals- are they angled or straight? I haven't used them and would be curious to see what they look like.
Gary
near you will help if you have a problem too.Turtle- Those Timken seals- are they angled or straight? I haven't used them and would be curious to see what they look like.
Gary
Race Director
Joined: Sep 2004
Posts: 11,874
Likes: 263
From: Arlington Va Current ride 04 vert, previous vettes: 69 vert, 77 resto mod
Originally Posted by goinbroke
.... When you take your endplay check you're essentially measuring the length of your bearings, spacer, and shim (call it spindle setup) against the length of the outer races in the bearing housing. .
thanks guys, i think i got it now the dimension we are shooting for is the distance between the outer races in bearing housing.....so all setups will be unique in their exact dimensions due to manufactuing tolerances in the bearing housings .
Thread Starter
Tech Contributor
Joined: Aug 1999
Posts: 15,166
Likes: 3,968
From: Connecticut, USA
Originally Posted by Twin_Turbo
gary, any chance you have the spindle snout dimensions??? doesn't have to be really accurate, it's for a solidworks model
I have a couple of arms here to rebuild, I'll look over the spindles and let you know. I had some old spindles but returned them to the owners once the job was shipped.
Burning Brakes
Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 837
Likes: 3
From: Texas
Bob, yes....actually the outer races plus however much endplay you shoot for....and they will be unique. My shims (drivers side/passenger side) were about .007 different from each other in thickness. It's not really a dimension you're shooting for, but a difference in dimension/length.
It would be pretty cool if Marck could use his solidworks program to show a cutaway drawing of an assembled rear spindle.
It would be pretty cool if Marck could use his solidworks program to show a cutaway drawing of an assembled rear spindle.
Last edited by goinbroke; Dec 27, 2005 at 02:43 PM.
Melting Slicks
Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 3,053
Likes: 4
St. Jude Donor '03,'11
Originally Posted by goinbroke
Just looking at my notes....I had one side that changed plus .018" with new Timken bearings.
If thats the case the spindle either would be locked solid or have a bunch of slop once torqued down. Whenever i put mine back together with the existing shims you actually couldn't feel any play at all but not tight enough not to be able to turn by hand.
Race Director
Joined: Sep 1999
Posts: 11,360
Likes: 382
From: Plano TX
Originally Posted by gtr1999
They will all be different from the old bearings. I've heard some guys say that jut replaced the bearings and reused the same shim and spacer. Either that was total BS or they were Bubba. Everyone I did had at least a .010-.015" difference between the bearings.
Back in '97 when I bought the car it had a bent TA. Since I had it apart to replace the TA I figured I'd put new bearings in it. These were factory bearings as the rotor rivets were still there and had loosened to 0.008. I replaced them with a set of SKF bearings (Swedish quality!) and with the original shim end-play was 0.004. Not perfect but back then I didn't know of the 0.001 goal and was happy to be in spec. I drove it like that until about a year ago when I redid both trailing arms and shimed them to 0.001.
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Burning Brakes
Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 837
Likes: 3
From: Texas
Originally Posted by turtlevette
Its hard to believe that a bearing would have that much tolerance. Are you sure you got the races fully seated?
If thats the case the spindle either would be locked solid or have a bunch of slop once torqued down. Whenever i put mine back together with the existing shims you actually couldn't feel any play at all but not tight enough not to be able to turn by hand.
If thats the case the spindle either would be locked solid or have a bunch of slop once torqued down. Whenever i put mine back together with the existing shims you actually couldn't feel any play at all but not tight enough not to be able to turn by hand.
Last edited by goinbroke; Dec 27, 2005 at 03:31 PM.
Le Mans Master
Joined: Jul 2004
Posts: 6,248
Likes: 4
From: Lancaster PA
Gary , Thanks for the tip on the angled NAPA seal. I just finished the install and I'm very happy with the results. Turns very easy by hand now. I checked my final endplay and had to really push to get .0017". Thanks for the phone call last Friday I was off track on where to measure. I wasn't sure about this project in the beginning but after doing it it seems simple. I hope to run into you next Carlisle so I can thank you in person. DT.
Thread Starter
Tech Contributor
Joined: Aug 1999
Posts: 15,166
Likes: 3,968
From: Connecticut, USA
Originally Posted by zwede
Now be nice Gary. I did this years ago!
Back in '97 when I bought the car it had a bent TA. Since I had it apart to replace the TA I figured I'd put new bearings in it. These were factory bearings as the rotor rivets were still there and had loosened to 0.008. I replaced them with a set of SKF bearings (Swedish quality!) and with the original shim end-play was 0.004. Not perfect but back then I didn't know of the 0.001 goal and was happy to be in spec. I drove it like that until about a year ago when I redid both trailing arms and shimed them to 0.001.
Back in '97 when I bought the car it had a bent TA. Since I had it apart to replace the TA I figured I'd put new bearings in it. These were factory bearings as the rotor rivets were still there and had loosened to 0.008. I replaced them with a set of SKF bearings (Swedish quality!) and with the original shim end-play was 0.004. Not perfect but back then I didn't know of the 0.001 goal and was happy to be in spec. I drove it like that until about a year ago when I redid both trailing arms and shimed them to 0.001.
I should say too these are precision ball bearings with an APEC rating of 7 so they're not the same as the Timken or TRW's. BTW those TRW might have been just a bad set, I haven't used them before? I'll stay with the Timkens as long as I can still get them.Gary
Last edited by gtr1999; Dec 27, 2005 at 08:04 PM.
Instructor
Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 220
Likes: 0
From: Flushing MI
Originally Posted by gtr1999
Here is the "custom tool" I used with my press- any guesses?
Here's another view, I did have to bore out the ID to clear the shoulder on the spindle.
Gary
What is this tool used for ?
Instructor
Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 220
Likes: 0
From: Flushing MI
This might be a stupid question but I can't help asking.
When you torque the spindle down to 100 ftlbs won’t that pull the bearing down?
When you press it on, how do you judge the bearing is fully seated without applying too much force?
When you torque the spindle down to 100 ftlbs won’t that pull the bearing down?
When you press it on, how do you judge the bearing is fully seated without applying too much force?
Thread Starter
Tech Contributor
Joined: Aug 1999
Posts: 15,166
Likes: 3,968
From: Connecticut, USA
There is no stupid question when you want to learn something.
The bearings are press fit to the spindle- unless you slip fit them. I'm not going to go there here, I press fit them.
With the setup tool the bearings will slide on without a problem. Then toruqe to 100 ft/lb to check/set the end play.
Once you get the endplay set then you grease them and install. I press the bearing on while I have a hand on the arm. I can feel when the press is stopped and the bearing is home. I rotate the arm at the same time to be sure there is no binding. When you get the brg's pressed on the nut with take up small amounts to the final set point. I don't like to load the spindle threads pressing the bearing on with the nut. When you hit 100 ft/lbs you may have to go beyond to align the cotter pin hole. I always spin the spindle after reaching the hole alignment to be sure the still is not binding. It should spin smooth,not as fast as it was before because of the new grease,brg's,and tighter end play but NO binding should be felt.
Gary
The bearings are press fit to the spindle- unless you slip fit them. I'm not going to go there here, I press fit them.
With the setup tool the bearings will slide on without a problem. Then toruqe to 100 ft/lb to check/set the end play.
Once you get the endplay set then you grease them and install. I press the bearing on while I have a hand on the arm. I can feel when the press is stopped and the bearing is home. I rotate the arm at the same time to be sure there is no binding. When you get the brg's pressed on the nut with take up small amounts to the final set point. I don't like to load the spindle threads pressing the bearing on with the nut. When you hit 100 ft/lbs you may have to go beyond to align the cotter pin hole. I always spin the spindle after reaching the hole alignment to be sure the still is not binding. It should spin smooth,not as fast as it was before because of the new grease,brg's,and tighter end play but NO binding should be felt.
Gary
Instructor
Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 220
Likes: 0
From: Flushing MI
So close but so far away
I am finally getting around to putting my trailing arms back together. I ordered the bearing shim and spacer kit and decided to measure the spacers prior to using the setup tool. I found that the shims verified by up to .001 when taking multiple readings on each shim. My thought is I this varience could cause different readings between the setup tool and the final assembly when the bearings are on the spindal.
As Received***************After sanding
Min-Max=Diff ************Min-Max=Diff
0.145-0.146=0.001******0.1424 -0.1438=0.0014
0.141-0.142 =0.001*****0.1389-0.1391=0.0002
0.133-0.134=0.001******0.1312-0.1317=0.0005
0.125-0.126= 0.001*****0.1238-0.126=0.0022
0.1225-0.1233=0.0008 ***0.1208-0.122=0.0012
0.1148-0.1158=0.001*****0.1142-0.1148=0.0006
0.107-0.1078=0.0008 ****0.1061-0.1069=0.0008
0.1035-0.1045=0.001*****0.103-0.1035=0.0005
Forgot to write down*****.0948-.0952=0.0004
Since the goal is .001 bearing play I decided to see if I could pull it in a little tighter by sanding them on a flat surface using 400 wet sand paper. On two instances it made it worse.
Two questions I have:
1) Should I be doing this?
2) Do you surface grind them first ?
3) Is the procedure I am using for sanding correct?
OOPs that was three questions
Thanks
Carl
As Received***************After sanding
Min-Max=Diff ************Min-Max=Diff
0.145-0.146=0.001******0.1424 -0.1438=0.0014
0.141-0.142 =0.001*****0.1389-0.1391=0.0002
0.133-0.134=0.001******0.1312-0.1317=0.0005
0.125-0.126= 0.001*****0.1238-0.126=0.0022
0.1225-0.1233=0.0008 ***0.1208-0.122=0.0012
0.1148-0.1158=0.001*****0.1142-0.1148=0.0006
0.107-0.1078=0.0008 ****0.1061-0.1069=0.0008
0.1035-0.1045=0.001*****0.103-0.1035=0.0005
Forgot to write down*****.0948-.0952=0.0004
Since the goal is .001 bearing play I decided to see if I could pull it in a little tighter by sanding them on a flat surface using 400 wet sand paper. On two instances it made it worse.
Two questions I have:
1) Should I be doing this?
2) Do you surface grind them first ?
3) Is the procedure I am using for sanding correct?
OOPs that was three questions
Thanks
Carl
Last edited by ckerch; Jan 15, 2006 at 08:52 AM.
Race Director
Joined: Dec 1999
Posts: 16,945
Likes: 9
Are you saying the earlier style don't have a well and the laters do? Mine don't have them either and they are the roiginal 82 ones since the susp had never been taken apart, everything original was still there: