Starter shimming
Thread Starter
Melting Slicks
Joined: Mar 2004
Posts: 3,472
Likes: 18
From: Lake Ozark, MO
Starter shimming
Now that the mini starter is working..it is sticking in the flywheel and not releasing (engine is not wired to run yet so I don't know if the engine will kick the bendix back out..assuming it won't). How do you shim the starter to get release? Do I shim the whole thing or just shim the corner closest to the block/bendix?
Instructor
Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 194
Likes: 0
From: Appleton Wi.
The instructions that came with my high torque starter say to shim it so a 5/32 drill bit will fit between the high point on a tooth of the starter, to the low point on the flywheel(or the base circle of flywheel). That is while the gear is engaged. Havn't had any problems in 3 years.
TJ
TJ
Safety Car
Joined: May 2001
Posts: 3,758
Likes: 3
From: Surrey
on the stock starter motor there's a small hole that you can stick a small screwdriver (or something similar) through to push ther gear over to the flywheel. Then use a drill bit to gauge the clearance.
Team Owner
Joined: Jul 2004
Posts: 40,404
Likes: 791
From: Redondo Beach, California
My engine is on an engine stand. With the mini starter installed and the flywheel on the engine, I can use my fingers to pull the starter drive gear forward until it is meshed inside the flywheel ring gear. (In other words I can manually duplicate the function of the starter solenoid.) Once the starter drive gear is fully extended into the ring gear, you can see there's enough room (at least on mine) to insert a small dowel to gauge for clearance.
I have a ZZ4 with the 153 tooth flywheel and the ministarter is the one listed in the GM Performance Parts catalog for the starter.
I have a ZZ4 with the 153 tooth flywheel and the ministarter is the one listed in the GM Performance Parts catalog for the starter.
Racer
Joined: Sep 2004
Posts: 424
Likes: 2
Originally Posted by Hvymtlc5
How do you get that 5/32 measurement? The bendix is retracted until energized? Right now it sticks in the flywheel and will not retract until I loosen the starter bolts.
Burning Brakes
Joined: Jun 2000
Posts: 892
Likes: 0
From: GA
Starter shims $8.00
Screwing it up twice and buying a new starter $69.95
Finally getting on the forum to ask advice.... PRICELESS
Some of the best advice for our Corvettes is Free, for all the other times when I am too stupid to ask for help... there is MASTERCARD.
I just experienced this personally. Seems simple but in reality... IT IS Confusing as hell. Don't forget to install the starter bracket... or the starter will ****. TRUST ME... I found out the hard way....
Screwing it up twice and buying a new starter $69.95
Finally getting on the forum to ask advice.... PRICELESS
Some of the best advice for our Corvettes is Free, for all the other times when I am too stupid to ask for help... there is MASTERCARD.
I just experienced this personally. Seems simple but in reality... IT IS Confusing as hell. Don't forget to install the starter bracket... or the starter will ****. TRUST ME... I found out the hard way....
Thread Starter
Melting Slicks
Joined: Mar 2004
Posts: 3,472
Likes: 18
From: Lake Ozark, MO
Good info, but my question is still open. If the starter is staying engaged in the flywheel...how should it be shimmed to stop that?
Do I shim across the whole starter (bought a shim kit). Do I shim only the side closest to the bendix drive, or is my thinking off and I need to do the other side. Once I get to that point, I can fine tune for gap space in the teeth as mentioned above.
Do I shim across the whole starter (bought a shim kit). Do I shim only the side closest to the bendix drive, or is my thinking off and I need to do the other side. Once I get to that point, I can fine tune for gap space in the teeth as mentioned above.
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Melting Slicks
Joined: Jan 2004
Posts: 2,672
Likes: 1
From: New Cumberland PA
I believe the starter gear not releasing is normal when checking the clearance. It should retract when the engine starts asuming it was clearanced properly.
Here are some instructions, http://www.jegs.com/instructions/555...1-04-20-40.pdf .
Not many of us have wire gauges. Perhaps a paper clip would work but you'll have to measure its diameter to be sure.
Here are some instructions, http://www.jegs.com/instructions/555...1-04-20-40.pdf .
Not many of us have wire gauges. Perhaps a paper clip would work but you'll have to measure its diameter to be sure.
Burning Brakes
Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 936
Likes: 0
From: Tulsa OK
Originally Posted by Mr.Gearhead
I just experienced this personally. Seems simple but in reality... IT IS Confusing as hell. Don't forget to install the starter bracket... or the starter will ****. TRUST ME... I found out the hard way....
I just got a new mini-starter, but haven't put it in yet. I don't remember any brackets on my stock starter when I replaced it the last three times or so. It just bolted up flush (except for the shims).
Burning Brakes
Joined: Jun 2000
Posts: 892
Likes: 0
From: GA
The bracket is attached to the "back" of the starter. It then bolts to the engine block to ensure the starter doesn't **** sideways during starting. I just had this issues and the guys here on the forum helped me out. I ordered the bracket and my trouble should be gone. Without the bracket, it seemed as if the starter or the flywheel teeth were chewed up from the grinding sound during start up. It was just that the starter cocked sideways away from the flywheel and was just barely touching when engaged.
As for the starter disengaging... I can tell you if the high torque starter is not shimmed properly... IT WILL NOT DISENGAGE. I had this same exact issue also. During motor break in... I installed the H/T starter incorrectly and I didn't want to stop cam break in so I just let it go... My H/T starter teeth got chewed up real bad. This is why I went with the delco starter instead. I don't want sound over dramatic about a simple starter install... but it is really important it is installed correctly or the same will happen I am sure. I am by no means an expert on this (in the know b/c of this forum) but this is just my recent experience. Good luck...
As for the starter disengaging... I can tell you if the high torque starter is not shimmed properly... IT WILL NOT DISENGAGE. I had this same exact issue also. During motor break in... I installed the H/T starter incorrectly and I didn't want to stop cam break in so I just let it go... My H/T starter teeth got chewed up real bad. This is why I went with the delco starter instead. I don't want sound over dramatic about a simple starter install... but it is really important it is installed correctly or the same will happen I am sure. I am by no means an expert on this (in the know b/c of this forum) but this is just my recent experience. Good luck...
Safety Car
Joined: May 2001
Posts: 3,758
Likes: 3
From: Surrey
Instead of wire gauges you can use a drill bit of the correct size (1/8" for stock starter, though I've also seen 5/32" as the stated clearance).
That starter bracket is very important. While searching for the clearance to use I found a picture of a block that had a part sheared off due to the starter bracket not being fitted
That starter bracket is very important. While searching for the clearance to use I found a picture of a block that had a part sheared off due to the starter bracket not being fitted
Team Owner
Joined: Jul 2004
Posts: 40,404
Likes: 791
From: Redondo Beach, California
Originally Posted by Xakk
What is this bracket of which you speak?
I just got a new mini-starter, but haven't put it in yet. I don't remember any brackets on my stock starter when I replaced it the last three times or so. It just bolted up flush (except for the shims).
I just got a new mini-starter, but haven't put it in yet. I don't remember any brackets on my stock starter when I replaced it the last three times or so. It just bolted up flush (except for the shims).
I'm using a GMPP 12 3/4 153 tooth flywheel, P/N 14088646, and the GMPP ministarter, P/N 12361146, and it appears that the fit is perfect; i.e. no need for a shim.
Burning Brakes
Joined: Jun 2000
Posts: 892
Likes: 0
From: GA
When I bolted my mini H/T starter, I used one small shim. However, judging by the teeth all chewed up... I should have used a larger shim. I don't know where the bracket would bolt to on this starter. Maybe one could be made? Has anyone with a mini H/T had similar issues with starter moving out of place? I would think if the stock starter can move sideways without the bracket... the mini would eventually do the same... maybe? 
