GM sb crate engines?
Thread Starter
Instructor
Joined: Apr 2006
Posts: 174
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From: Wallaceburg Ontario
GM sb crate engines?
I was just lookin' around on the GMPP site at small block crate engines (considering one for my '79 insteads of the 454). Any input on which of the following is the best "bang for the buck"?
- 350 HO (330 hp)
- ZZ4 (355 hp)
- Fast Burn 385 (385 hp)
- ZZ 383 (425 hp)
Can I use an MSD distributor on these engines? Will they all fit the '79 without modification (I'm a little worried about crossmember clearance with the oil pan and air cleaner to hood clearance)? On a similar note, one of the site's technical notes made NO sense to me at all; it said the ZZ 383's numbers were acheived with 1.75" primary and 4" collector headers. The 1.75" primaries makes sense to me, but 4" collectors? Isn't that a bit excessive (I was thinking 2.5" collectors)?
- 350 HO (330 hp)
- ZZ4 (355 hp)
- Fast Burn 385 (385 hp)
- ZZ 383 (425 hp)
Can I use an MSD distributor on these engines? Will they all fit the '79 without modification (I'm a little worried about crossmember clearance with the oil pan and air cleaner to hood clearance)? On a similar note, one of the site's technical notes made NO sense to me at all; it said the ZZ 383's numbers were acheived with 1.75" primary and 4" collector headers. The 1.75" primaries makes sense to me, but 4" collectors? Isn't that a bit excessive (I was thinking 2.5" collectors)?
Last edited by Chilli; Jun 9, 2006 at 04:26 PM.
Le Mans Master
Joined: Sep 2001
Posts: 7,739
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From: Unreconstructed, South Carolina
Don't forget HT383 (about 340 hp but with tons of TQ ... TQ is what sets you back in the seat, not hp). HT383 does not require premium, it likes 87.
Yes you can use MSD dist ... but if your stock 79 HEI dist is in good shape it will work just as well.
Most headers' collectors are 3.5" -4" ... those dump into cone reducers that fit to exhaust pipes.
Yes you can use MSD dist ... but if your stock 79 HEI dist is in good shape it will work just as well.
Most headers' collectors are 3.5" -4" ... those dump into cone reducers that fit to exhaust pipes.
Thread Starter
Instructor
Joined: Apr 2006
Posts: 174
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From: Wallaceburg Ontario
Originally Posted by jackson
Don't forget HT383 (about 340 hp but with tons of TQ ... TQ is what sets you back in the seat, not hp). HT383 does not require premium, it likes 87.
Le Mans Master
Joined: Sep 2001
Posts: 7,739
Likes: 630
From: Unreconstructed, South Carolina
Originally Posted by Chilli
Oops, I totally overlooked that one! It would be really nice to have that kind of power that can run on 87, especially with the current gas prices. Is that engine a tall deck? The website mentions the word "truck" in it. Thanks for the input!
Drifting
Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 1,881
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From: staten island ny
On the cheaper side I bought a gmpp 290hp 350 long block for about 1700 delivered. 100 hp over stock, 3 yr 50000 mile warranty, regular gas and new engine reliability. Didnt have th big bucks for one of the other engines :{
ESU
ESU
Le Mans Master
Joined: Apr 2004
Posts: 7,106
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From: Newark DE
Originally Posted by Little Mouse
I would go for the ZZ383, 425hp
me too 
that's the motor I have my eye on when the budget allows for it.
HP and TQ to rival a lot of BB motors but the weight of a SB.
makes an easy swap!
one thing to watch out for that i noticed on the ZZ383 (and perhaps on some of the others but I didn't notice) is that to get the 425HP rating they use a single plane intake and for street use a dual plane would be better so you might want to consider swapping out to a dual plane intake.
Also, I believe most of the crate motors come with a long water pump and for corvettes you need the corvette Short water pump so figure on swapping that out also.
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Brett Foote
Instructor
Joined: Mar 2001
Posts: 229
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From: west point ga usa
Go with the 350 HO and add the Hotcam kit. 407 hp and 410 tq. I have one in my z28 and my bro-in-law put one in a RX7. I think it was 3200.00 delivered. They don't advertise it much because it would take away from ZZ4, 383HT and the other sb's they sell. Got it from Scoggins-Dickey in Texas. That is bang for your buck.
Drifting
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 1,944
Likes: 22
From: Yooperville MI
Buy the long block version and reuse some of your current engine parts to save money. The 350HO has good potential if you like to tinker a little instead of just dropping in a turn key engine.
Car Craft did a build up of a long block version and achieved 433lbft of torque at 4400 rpm. Final numbers were 420 hp/368 lb ft at 6000rpm with stock HEI and only the following additional parts and machine work.
Edelbrock Air Gap
Holley 4779 750 carb
1 5/8" Hedman headers
Comp XR280R Cam
1.6 rockers
Comp Cams valve springs and push rods
Machining the valve spring pockets to accept the larger springs.
They also tested a milder GMPP cam (which would be better if you have an automatic) with 401hp/375lb ft at 5600 rpm. And fitting the Air Gap under a stock hood will be a challenge, but this shows the potential of the 350HO.
I've been very happy with my long block, and will eventually do a build up like Car Craft.
Car Craft did a build up of a long block version and achieved 433lbft of torque at 4400 rpm. Final numbers were 420 hp/368 lb ft at 6000rpm with stock HEI and only the following additional parts and machine work.
Edelbrock Air Gap
Holley 4779 750 carb
1 5/8" Hedman headers
Comp XR280R Cam
1.6 rockers
Comp Cams valve springs and push rods
Machining the valve spring pockets to accept the larger springs.
They also tested a milder GMPP cam (which would be better if you have an automatic) with 401hp/375lb ft at 5600 rpm. And fitting the Air Gap under a stock hood will be a challenge, but this shows the potential of the 350HO.
I've been very happy with my long block, and will eventually do a build up like Car Craft.
Racer
Joined: Sep 2004
Posts: 482
Likes: 1
From: Brandon Manitoba
One other factor with the ZZ383 is the timing chain cover is too thick to install with the corvette short water pump. It is a very expensive billet cover that will become a nice ashtray on your coffee table.
Burning Brakes
Joined: Sep 2004
Posts: 1,167
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From: Ft.Worth Texas
No it's not It'll fit by just modifying one of the bolts or replacing it with a button head screw. Can't remember which I did but it fits just fine and seals better than the old style too.
It'll fit by just modifying one of the bolts or replacing it with a button head screw. Can't remember which I did but it fits just fine and seals better than the old style too.
Le Mans Master
Joined: Sep 2001
Posts: 7,739
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From: Unreconstructed, South Carolina
Originally Posted by David Ey
No it's not It'll fit by just modifying one of the bolts or replacing it with a button head screw. Can't remember which I did but it fits just fine and seals better than the old style too.
It'll fit by just modifying one of the bolts or replacing it with a button head screw. Can't remember which I did but it fits just fine and seals better than the old style too. All the GMPP SBC crates I've seen that shipped from GMPP over that last few years came with a timing cover made of a black composite material ... and it is thicker than stamped steel ... and its edges are squared off rather than radiused like stamping ... and it has rather tall hex capscrews ... and they do not tend to fit short or vette pumps without some minor mods to tc bolts and/or light grinding to backside of pump. That composite tc is just like what you find on a production pickup truck vortec 350 ... except the production motors' tc have a flange for a crank trigger ... where the GMPP sbc crates do not. BTW ... those same GMPP sbc crates have a single row roller timing chain ... that works & lasts well.
Melting Slicks
Joined: Dec 1999
Posts: 2,116
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From: Mid West
Cruise-In III Veteran
I originally went with the middle of the road with these engines .... a ZZ4. Not a bad price and except for the waterpump as mentioned earlier, it bolts directly in. Did the swap in one day and was back on the road, which was very important since it was my daily driver back then. The composite cover can be used with a Corvette water pump, but clearancing is necessary. Also, the ZZ4 comes with a new distributer and spark plugs even.
