I just found out today that AFR doesn't make 210 cc Eliminator heads that are straight plug heads that apparently are required for the Hooker header/sidepipes that I got. They do in 195, but I don't want to go that small with the 427 I'm building.

Anyone know if the 227 Eliminator heads are being made with straight plug options? Problem is with these I need the high dollar shaft mount rockers for much street driving.

Any suggestions on other heads I could get that flow well? Thinking about looking into Brodix...

I'm trying to build a 427 sbc dart motor, hydraulic roller cam, 10.5:1 or so compression etc. Want 600 hp and good low end torque (but not too much low end torque). Have a 5 speed TKO trany.

 

Talk to this guy....


http://forums.corvetteforum.com/member.php?u=60471

Also read the sticky thread above re: AFR heads

 

How do you know the Hookers won't fit angle plug heads ?

 

The Hooker information on these headers says they won't work on the angle plug heads..not sure if they can be clearanced a little or not? Anyone know?

 

Asked Edzred72 about this tonight. He is building a 406 with AFR 210 Eliminators. This is the text of the E-mail: With my heads on a bench, I bolted up both headers and found absolutly
NO
issues what-so-ever. The only plug that might be a pain was #2, cause
it
runs under the pipe, but still has enough clearance to avoid denting or
melting wires. The rest have enough room even for straight plug
boots!!!!
Well...almost. I have run Moroso Blue max angle boot wires on
Protopline
angle heads & headers. That combo was tight for some of the plugs...but
the
Moroso never melted. They are one of the highest heat rated wires. My
hookers had to be dented on two cylinders with my stock 350 straight
heads
though.....

 

Thanks Kevin,

That is exactly what I needed to know. Basically, if it is possible to make them work, even with a little effort, I was wanting to try, rather than go with the 195 heads. For all I knew, the plugs couldn't even go in with the headers on.

 

I have the hooker super comp ceramic side pipes. I have run them with both stright stock heads and Pro Comp angle plug and RHS angle plug. I actually prefer the angles to the straight plugs. Makes it much easier to change plugs. The only thing I did was get wire heat boots and connect them together so it pulls them in between the header pipes for maximum clearance from the header tubes. I used 90 degree plug wires.

 

Don't always believe what you read, I had them on my 406ci with Vic Jr. heads with angled plugs and they cleared no problems. The primary pipes seem to go straight out from the head and then curve down. Much more room with these headers than any other I have used. No matter what make I always had to ding the headers, but the Hooker sidepipe headers where the first ones I had on that cleared fine

 

Thanks for the info guys, looks like I'm sticking with the AFR 210's afterall!
dw

 

If you are getting the new Eliminators sure would be nice to put a head on a flow bench and see what it flows, wouldn't cost more than few bucks, just get one pair ( intake and exhaust ) flowed

 

I'm running AFR 210s with Hooker side mount headers. I found that the drivers side was a perfect fit with no clearance problems. The passenger side needed some "massaging" in-order to work.

 

I am running a 406 with cantfield alum heads and hooker headers/sidepipes. I had NO issues with the angle plug heads.Go for it.

Marc.

 

FYI:
Brodix just added a 210 head to their IK line ... known as Wild Thing KC IK 210. It has STRAIGHT plugs.

 

My AFR 210 angle plug heads would not clear my Hooker Super comp 1 3/4 headers. Every other angle plug head i have owned cleared without a problem.

I modded my pipes and ran the AFRs on my first 427 Mowtown small block with AFR 210's flat milled to 64 cc to get my compression up. the cam was a solid roller 242/248 110 lc .620/.620 with 1.65 rockers.

I was also looking for the magical 600 hp 427. AFR said that my combo would do it. It was a nice running motor. It just was way too mellow compared to my previous 383 solid roller equiped with Dart 227 CC heads. So I removed the AFR's with the pipe clearance problem and installed my Dart 227cc.

I woke up the top end some what out to my 7000 red line. I also only had @ 10.5 compression because on my 20 cc dished pistons. I determined that compression and the cam was holding it back from really making power. My new motor got a .030 over bore and a 248/250 SR cam. I upped the compression to 11.8 and changed from a Team G intake to the Motown single plane

 

Thanks for the additional info, yeah I'm getting the 210s and I'll clearance/modify as needed on plug #4 it looks like.

Hey Gkull, do you know what the dart 227 heads flowed at .600? These AFR 210s are supposed to be 295 cfm at .600, so I was thinking that with a 585 lift cam (1.6 rockers, so 610ish lift) I should be around 600 hp potentially, but maybe I need a bit more cam? I think these new Eliminator heads flow about what old AFR 220s flowed at .600, but maybe I'm remembering wrong. What do u think?

 

Before I would ever buy AFR heads I would ask the question. Have these new 210 heads addressed the problem of very poor oil return of the old 210 heads?

210's are not big heads. They are what I would call the minimum for 383 class motors. The head CC is only a part of the individual cylinder intake track. You have to add up the whole intake manifold runner and head to get a true picture. I have been looking at some 272 cc heads that really flow.

The general rule is 1 hp potential for every 2 CFM of intake air flow.

The Dart sight lists the 227CC heads as 309 cfm. Mine are 306 at .600 inch. That is why I have always tried to lift my valves over .600 for the longest period of time possible. My new cam is actaully .685/.715 lift

I do not have have fuel injection for several reasons. The big one is the cost of real quality sequential injection. Like F.A.S.T. electronics are over $3500 blah blah blah and you end up with $5000 -$8000 for something that you can really dial in. The other thing is every year I wait the quality goes up. I really researched FI and found a couple of sites that had all formulas about injector sizes required.

IMO - The Smart person would just build a 8.7 compression 427 small block and install a whipple charger on it. That way your not stressing everything with a monster roller cam or doing high rpm. I bet that you could install a whipple for not much more than FI.

 

I think its probably too late to go the Supercharger route although I did think about that. I was thinking about the AFR 227 eliminator heads but they require $1k shaft rockers, they flow 309 cfm at .600. I might be able to change my order still to get those, although, it will cost me an extra $700 (exchange out the comp cams rollers and stud girdle).

I put the engine info on the injector link if you want to check it out and maybe we can continue this thread there? I VERY much appreciate your input as I don't know much about this setup I'm trying to do.

 

I would look at the Dart 230cc heads. I know a guy that just striped his down bare and has nothing to put them on. I can check the chamber size and everything for you if you want. I am pretty sure they are 64cc chambers. I looked at them myself but figured they were too much for my 383 .563 lift cam. I would loose 24 tq at the bottom only to gain 12 hp at the top 500 more rpm out.

 

I'm pretty much committed on the AFRs at this point, my only chance is trying to change my order from 210s to 227s possibly, not even sure I can do that though. I am curious what people think about this upgrade though?

 

If your building a 427 definitely put the 227's in it. I was thinking about the 210 AFR's on my 383. I mean you will have great bottom end response with the 210's but there will come a point later in the power band I think the 210's are going to hold your 427 sbc back. That's just my thoughts.