Choosing a solid roller cam
Le Mans Master
Joined: Apr 2006
Posts: 5,403
Likes: 95
You have a set of $1400.00 billet rods. The 63 impala had a new set of Mcquay Norris rods to keep that 4000 pounds rolling. Don't know what grade steel was maybe 1053, rod bolts 3/8 made of silly putty compaired to billet rod stuff.
Last edited by Little Mouse; Mar 31, 2008 at 05:22 PM.
Thread Starter
Team Owner
Joined: Apr 2002
Posts: 62,198
Likes: 1
From: All humans are vermin in the eyes of Guru VA
Cruise-In IV Veteran
Cruise-In V Veteran
I got them used for what some cheap scat forgings cost.
I figure being a 740g peice of billet steel, they will probably take everything I can throw at them, even after being "seasoned."
Speed pros dont make a flat top for 6" rods, if I go hyper I am left with KB pistons. They have an iffy reputation.
The KB Piston weighs 439g.
I figure being a 740g peice of billet steel, they will probably take everything I can throw at them, even after being "seasoned."
Speed pros dont make a flat top for 6" rods, if I go hyper I am left with KB pistons. They have an iffy reputation.
The KB Piston weighs 439g.
Last edited by Guru_4_hire; Mar 31, 2008 at 05:35 PM.
Le Mans Master
Joined: Apr 2006
Posts: 5,403
Likes: 95
Last thing in the world I would want is a single plane for an autocross car.
Last edited by Little Mouse; Mar 31, 2008 at 05:55 PM.
Le Mans Master
Joined: Apr 2006
Posts: 5,403
Likes: 95
AFR 195 use a fel pro 1205, Victor JR I have was ment for Phase one/two chevy bowtie heads, I have fel PR0 1205 gaskets lying around beleive they barely would work on this manifold. I would have to look at them again.
1205 will fit it barely, 1204 would be a better fit.
1205 will fit it barely, 1204 would be a better fit.
Last edited by Little Mouse; Mar 31, 2008 at 11:26 PM.
Thread Starter
Team Owner
Joined: Apr 2002
Posts: 62,198
Likes: 1
From: All humans are vermin in the eyes of Guru VA
Cruise-In IV Veteran
Cruise-In V Veteran
Here is what AFR says on which heads:
Here is the info I gave them:
Hello Jacob,
For what you are looking for, the 195's are going to be the best
choice.
They might not be as strong down low as the 180's, but it won't be more
than 15 ft./lbs., and the disparity will be gone by 2500 RPM. From
there on, the 195's, with your cam and intake combo, will pull very
strongly up into the 7000 RPM range. To even further extend the gap
between the two, you can choose our Competition Port option that will
crispen throttle response, return slightly better mileage, give
slightly
higher peak numbers, and a stronger curve due to a bump in airflow of
10-15 cfm throughout the range. This should also give you back some of
the low end lost to the 180's.
Feel free to contact us again by phone or by e-mail with any further
questions, or to place your order.
Thank you for inquiring about AFR,
Steven Dater
AFR Technical Dept.
For what you are looking for, the 195's are going to be the best
choice.
They might not be as strong down low as the 180's, but it won't be more
than 15 ft./lbs., and the disparity will be gone by 2500 RPM. From
there on, the 195's, with your cam and intake combo, will pull very
strongly up into the 7000 RPM range. To even further extend the gap
between the two, you can choose our Competition Port option that will
crispen throttle response, return slightly better mileage, give
slightly
higher peak numbers, and a stronger curve due to a bump in airflow of
10-15 cfm throughout the range. This should also give you back some of
the low end lost to the 180's.
Feel free to contact us again by phone or by e-mail with any further
questions, or to place your order.
Thank you for inquiring about AFR,
Steven Dater
AFR Technical Dept.
Interests:.....Chevy Small Block
Purpose:.....Street/ Strip, Road Race
Current Heads:.....Pro-topline Torkers
Engine Details:
Displacement:.....355ci
Bore:.....4.03
Stroke:.....3.48
Pistons:.....Flat
Pistons CC:.....--
Compression:.....10+
Combustion Chamber Volume:.....--
RPM Range:.....4000 - 7000
Maximum RPM:.....7000
Induction:.....Carburetor(s)
Number of Carburetors:.....1
Carburetor CFM:.....650 or 750 I have both
Manifold Brand:.....Weiand
Manifold Type:.....Single Plane
Manifold Model:.....--
Power Adders?.....No
Camshaft Type:.....Roller - Mechanical
Intake Lift:......564
Intake Duration:.....236 @ .050 / 274 (adv)
Exhaust Lift:......564
Exhaust Duration:.....236 @ .050 / 274 (adv)
Digital Ignition Box?.....no
Ignition Manufacturer:.....--
Exhaust:.....Long Tube Headers
Exhaust Pipe Diameter:.....1.75
Muffler Type:.....Street
Fuel Type:.....Pump Gas
Make:.....Chevy
Model:.....Corvette
Year:.....1973
Weight:.....Less than 3300
Transmission Type:.....Manual
Gears:.....4
Transmission:.....M21 (I want to install an M22W)
Rear End Gear Ratio:.....3.55 (planning on moving to a 3.73) Rear Tire
Size:.....26.2 Comments:.....I am personally leaning towards the AFR
180
Competition package, though others think the AFR 195 Competition
package
would be better. My primary concern is drivability in places other
than
the track yet still make good power in the 4500-6800 RPM range for
racing purposes.
I have been working DD2k and your advertised flow numbers and the
speced
cam and compression make similiar power between both the 195cc heads
and
the 180cc heads.
Purpose:.....Street/ Strip, Road Race
Current Heads:.....Pro-topline Torkers
Engine Details:
Displacement:.....355ci
Bore:.....4.03
Stroke:.....3.48
Pistons:.....Flat
Pistons CC:.....--
Compression:.....10+
Combustion Chamber Volume:.....--
RPM Range:.....4000 - 7000
Maximum RPM:.....7000
Induction:.....Carburetor(s)
Number of Carburetors:.....1
Carburetor CFM:.....650 or 750 I have both
Manifold Brand:.....Weiand
Manifold Type:.....Single Plane
Manifold Model:.....--
Power Adders?.....No
Camshaft Type:.....Roller - Mechanical
Intake Lift:......564
Intake Duration:.....236 @ .050 / 274 (adv)
Exhaust Lift:......564
Exhaust Duration:.....236 @ .050 / 274 (adv)
Digital Ignition Box?.....no
Ignition Manufacturer:.....--
Exhaust:.....Long Tube Headers
Exhaust Pipe Diameter:.....1.75
Muffler Type:.....Street
Fuel Type:.....Pump Gas
Make:.....Chevy
Model:.....Corvette
Year:.....1973
Weight:.....Less than 3300
Transmission Type:.....Manual
Gears:.....4
Transmission:.....M21 (I want to install an M22W)
Rear End Gear Ratio:.....3.55 (planning on moving to a 3.73) Rear Tire
Size:.....26.2 Comments:.....I am personally leaning towards the AFR
180
Competition package, though others think the AFR 195 Competition
package
would be better. My primary concern is drivability in places other
than
the track yet still make good power in the 4500-6800 RPM range for
racing purposes.
I have been working DD2k and your advertised flow numbers and the
speced
cam and compression make similiar power between both the 195cc heads
and
the 180cc heads.
Corvette Stories
The Best of Corvette for Corvette Enthusiasts
2027 Corvette vs The World: Every Model vs Closest Competitor
Joe Kucinski
10 Most Common Corvette Problems of the Last 20 Years!
Joe Kucinski
5 MOST and 5 LEAST Popular Corvette Model Years in History!
Joe Kucinski
2027 Corvette Buyer's Guide: Everything You Need to Know!
Joe Kucinski
10 Things C8 Corvette Owners Hate (But Won't Tell You)
Joe Kucinski
10 Best Corvettes Coming to Barrett-Jackson Palm Beach 2026!
Brett Foote
Every Corvette Grand Sport Explained! (C2, C4, C6, C7, & C8)
Joe Kucinski
Grand Sport & Grand Sport X Launch Alongside All-New 535hp LS6 V8!
Michael S. Palmer
5 Reasons Bad Drivers Crash & 5 Ways to Avoid a Costly Mistake!
Joe Kucinski
Le Mans Master
Joined: Apr 2006
Posts: 5,403
Likes: 95
195 heads I don't believe would be to big if at all very little, with the
195s you would be prepared for a bigger engine if you choose to do
so in the future.
Le Mans Master
Joined: Apr 2006
Posts: 5,403
Likes: 95
If you had say 3.08/3.36 gears auto trans with only three gears to multyply
torque, 350 you would want a cam that took off in power at low revs say 2000 at that low revs a smaller runner 170/180 would be the ticket. 195 runner would be weak that low down in revs on a 350 and the cam that could take off at 2000 would never rev high enough to get any benefit out of the larger runners, 195 runner on this combo would not work cost power down low never do any better up top.Take the same engine put a cam in it that only runs well at 4000 rpm on up is flakey on torque down low no matter what you do then what good are the smaller runners to you, smaller runner is no help to you at higher revs in the same way the bigger runners are no help without enough cam to use the bigger runner, your not camming it to do its best work down at low revs, may as well have the bigger runner to match the higher power band. After you spend close to $1500.00 for afr 180 runner what happens if you get bored with the power of the 355 or your now tired of the higher rpm power band to get any power out of the 355, do you spend even more money for bigger heads to let the 396 or 406 you now want to let it breath right.
torque, 350 you would want a cam that took off in power at low revs say 2000 at that low revs a smaller runner 170/180 would be the ticket. 195 runner would be weak that low down in revs on a 350 and the cam that could take off at 2000 would never rev high enough to get any benefit out of the larger runners, 195 runner on this combo would not work cost power down low never do any better up top.Take the same engine put a cam in it that only runs well at 4000 rpm on up is flakey on torque down low no matter what you do then what good are the smaller runners to you, smaller runner is no help to you at higher revs in the same way the bigger runners are no help without enough cam to use the bigger runner, your not camming it to do its best work down at low revs, may as well have the bigger runner to match the higher power band. After you spend close to $1500.00 for afr 180 runner what happens if you get bored with the power of the 355 or your now tired of the higher rpm power band to get any power out of the 355, do you spend even more money for bigger heads to let the 396 or 406 you now want to let it breath right.
Last edited by Little Mouse; Apr 8, 2008 at 03:22 AM.
Thread Starter
Team Owner
Joined: Apr 2002
Posts: 62,198
Likes: 1
From: All humans are vermin in the eyes of Guru VA
Cruise-In IV Veteran
Cruise-In V Veteran
I was asking about the 282 solid cam.
But I agree. Here is the engineering challenge:
3.73 tom's differential (tallest point of entry for the 12-bolt conversion) and an M22 transmission.
This is a durable driveline that no small block should be able to break on me.
Now the 355 requirement was the ability to rev safely and consistantly all day and twice on tuesday, and be able to live reliabily in the 5300-6800 rpm range. In everyway we should be considering this a modern incarnation of an LT1.
The redline has to be 7200rpm, to reach 150mph on some hoosier road race or autocross 255/50-16 tires (26.2)
So even if I wanted to move to a 383 or larger I still need the 7200rpm potential
I am trying to think about the car as a whole device and not an engine project only.
But I agree. Here is the engineering challenge:
3.73 tom's differential (tallest point of entry for the 12-bolt conversion) and an M22 transmission.
This is a durable driveline that no small block should be able to break on me.
Now the 355 requirement was the ability to rev safely and consistantly all day and twice on tuesday, and be able to live reliabily in the 5300-6800 rpm range. In everyway we should be considering this a modern incarnation of an LT1.
The redline has to be 7200rpm, to reach 150mph on some hoosier road race or autocross 255/50-16 tires (26.2)
So even if I wanted to move to a 383 or larger I still need the 7200rpm potential
I am trying to think about the car as a whole device and not an engine project only.
Team Owner
Joined: Apr 1999
Posts: 21,953
Likes: 1,443
From: Reno Nevada
2024 C3 of the Year Finalist- Modified
I was asking about the 282 solid cam.
But I agree. Here is the engineering challenge:
3.73 tom's differential (tallest point of entry for the 12-bolt conversion) and an M22 transmission.
This is a durable driveline that no small block should be able to break on me.
Now the 355 requirement was the ability to rev safely and consistantly all day and twice on tuesday, and be able to live reliabily in the 5300-6800 rpm range. In everyway we should be considering this a modern incarnation of an LT1.
The redline has to be 7200rpm, to reach 150mph on some hoosier road race or autocross 255/50-16 tires (26.2)
So even if I wanted to move to a 383 or larger I still need the 7200rpm potential
I am trying to think about the car as a whole device and not an engine project only.
But I agree. Here is the engineering challenge:
3.73 tom's differential (tallest point of entry for the 12-bolt conversion) and an M22 transmission.
This is a durable driveline that no small block should be able to break on me.
Now the 355 requirement was the ability to rev safely and consistantly all day and twice on tuesday, and be able to live reliabily in the 5300-6800 rpm range. In everyway we should be considering this a modern incarnation of an LT1.
The redline has to be 7200rpm, to reach 150mph on some hoosier road race or autocross 255/50-16 tires (26.2)
So even if I wanted to move to a 383 or larger I still need the 7200rpm potential
I am trying to think about the car as a whole device and not an engine project only.
You do understand that motors built the exactly the same and just juggle the CI displacement make roughly the same HP?
TQ though is directly related to ci. So the 396 ci small block will just whip a 350 ci motor.
I have built 7200 rpm motors out of both H-flat and S-flat cams. The diference in money spent on a SR cam could buy a 396 6 inch rod rotating kit and Crane 238/248 solid cam
Le Mans Master
Joined: Apr 2006
Posts: 5,403
Likes: 95
quality bottom ends rarely fail below 7500 rpm. I have had no problem with 3.75, 3.875, 4.00 stroker motors.
You do understand that motors built the exactly the same and just juggle the CI displacement make roughly the same HP?
TQ though is directly related to ci. So the 396 ci small block will just whip a 350 ci motor.
I have built 7200 rpm motors out of both H-flat and S-flat cams. The diference in money spent on a SR cam could buy a 396 6 inch rod rotating kit and Crane 238/248 solid cam
You do understand that motors built the exactly the same and just juggle the CI displacement make roughly the same HP?
TQ though is directly related to ci. So the 396 ci small block will just whip a 350 ci motor.
I have built 7200 rpm motors out of both H-flat and S-flat cams. The diference in money spent on a SR cam could buy a 396 6 inch rod rotating kit and Crane 238/248 solid cam
a flat tappit cam then a 355 with solid roller, flat tappit is just a solid chunk of metal as long as the oils good in it. no such think as roller failure or costs to rebuild lifters.
Thread Starter
Team Owner
Joined: Apr 2002
Posts: 62,198
Likes: 1
From: All humans are vermin in the eyes of Guru VA
Cruise-In IV Veteran
Cruise-In V Veteran
Well...... HP isnt the ultimate goal.
The reason I like the roller, is that there are less oil challenges and I only see them getting less flat tappet friendly in the future.
I still havent bought a crank or pistons, so I guess I could still get a good forged crank and some pistons.
God knows that hyper pistons are a hellalot easier to find for a 383 with a 6" rod than a 350 with a 6" rod.
The reason I like the roller, is that there are less oil challenges and I only see them getting less flat tappet friendly in the future.
I still havent bought a crank or pistons, so I guess I could still get a good forged crank and some pistons.
God knows that hyper pistons are a hellalot easier to find for a 383 with a 6" rod than a 350 with a 6" rod.
Race Director
Joined: May 2005
Posts: 10,674
Likes: 121
From: Millington Illinois
St. Jude Donor '08-'09
Well...... HP isnt the ultimate goal.
The reason I like the roller, is that there are less oil challenges and I only see them getting less flat tappet friendly in the future.
I still havent bought a crank or pistons, so I guess I could still get a good forged crank and some pistons.
God knows that hyper pistons are a hellalot easier to find for a 383 with a 6" rod than a 350 with a 6" rod.
The reason I like the roller, is that there are less oil challenges and I only see them getting less flat tappet friendly in the future.
I still havent bought a crank or pistons, so I guess I could still get a good forged crank and some pistons.
God knows that hyper pistons are a hellalot easier to find for a 383 with a 6" rod than a 350 with a 6" rod.
Team Owner
Joined: Apr 1999
Posts: 21,953
Likes: 1,443
From: Reno Nevada
2024 C3 of the Year Finalist- Modified
I installed KB hyper pistons when they were the "HOT RAGE" Superior wall clearance.......................... As my motor got hotter with 3.480 stroke 10.7 c/r and 7200 rpm shift points is when it all came crashing down. It sounded like rod knock
I was so pissed that I called the local KB They said that I exceeded the feet per minute
Le Mans Master
Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 5,727
Likes: 38
From: Fremont CA
Friends DON'T let friends use Indian produced Speed Pro pistons. All the Sealed Power piston line is now produced in India, do you really want to go there? SRP, KB forged, Probe, Mahle, and many others are USA made an FAR BETTER designs than Speed Pro products. For a cam you may want to talk with Bullet cams about some of the Ultra Dyne lobe patterns they now own, they are quite good performers and great on parts wear. I have run a U-D 276/284 in my 355 cu/in motor with very good results (0.050 is 243/251 0.582 lift on 110 lobe seperation.) The U-D is a VERY STRONG runner from 2200 to 7400 RPM with some small port 230CFM heads on the motor.