Running Vortec heads-ping more?
Thread Starter
Racer
Joined: Feb 2009
Posts: 343
Likes: 0
From: San Diego CA
Running Vortec heads-ping more?
on a Gen 1 block. I hear it's a bolt-on with no issues other than a different intake. Will my headers work too?
With my setup I'm just short of 10:1 using cast iron heads with (I think) 72cc chambers. How much will the smaller chambers in the Vortecs raise my compression ratio and will it have more of a tendency to ping?
Right now it pings a slight bit when good & hot or with the AC on. Most driving can be done without it pinging but it does happen now & again. I don't want to go with another cast iron head with smaller chambers, if its going to ping more than it does now.
With my setup I'm just short of 10:1 using cast iron heads with (I think) 72cc chambers. How much will the smaller chambers in the Vortecs raise my compression ratio and will it have more of a tendency to ping?
Right now it pings a slight bit when good & hot or with the AC on. Most driving can be done without it pinging but it does happen now & again. I don't want to go with another cast iron head with smaller chambers, if its going to ping more than it does now.
Race Director
Joined: Jan 2000
Posts: 12,399
Likes: 247
From: San Jose CA
The odds are not in your favor. The Vortecs are a 58cc head (I believe) and that'll bump compression quite a bit.
They probably are designed better and are less likely to detonate at the same CR than a stock head, but I'd avoid it.
IMO, you'd be better off saving your cash a little longer and getting an aluminum head in the 68cc range. You'd have better cooling, better heads, and a lighter engine.
They probably are designed better and are less likely to detonate at the same CR than a stock head, but I'd avoid it.
IMO, you'd be better off saving your cash a little longer and getting an aluminum head in the 68cc range. You'd have better cooling, better heads, and a lighter engine.
Thread Starter
Racer
Joined: Feb 2009
Posts: 343
Likes: 0
From: San Diego CA
The odds are not in your favor. The Vortecs are a 58cc head (I believe) and that'll bump compression quite a bit.
They probably are designed better and are less likely to detonate at the same CR than a stock head, but I'd avoid it.
IMO, you'd be better off saving your cash a little longer and getting an aluminum head in the 68cc range. You'd have better cooling, better heads, and a lighter engine.
They probably are designed better and are less likely to detonate at the same CR than a stock head, but I'd avoid it.
IMO, you'd be better off saving your cash a little longer and getting an aluminum head in the 68cc range. You'd have better cooling, better heads, and a lighter engine.
My cam is mild but I just pulled the Crane spec sheet out and iit shows .454/480 lift at 1.5 so you need to add a bit more to that for 1.6 rockers too.
So by the time I got different springs on the vortecs (and oh, you need to machine the pushrod hole too if using 1.6) and paid for machine work I would be into them as much as if I bought aluminum heads. And I'd still have the propensity for ping ....
So that leads me to the aluminum head Q: Best bang for the buck? I can get Edlebrock heads right here locally for $599 each complete. No shipping no nada just cash & carry. I'll need a new intake too because the Performer intake that's been used on the stroker was milled to match the mill they took off the heads. And it was also port matched to those iron heads.
Maybe a Performer kit with heads & intake? Sans camshaft?
Drifting
Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 1,883
Likes: 124
From: Lubbock TX
Vortecs are 62cc's (advertised as 64). If you ping with 72's, you'll rattle with 64's. I've run 'em with flat tops at 10.1:1 on computer controlled engines, but I don't know that I'd push it with no knock detectors, etc., and you'll probably be close to 11:1 with Vortecs. If you're running dome pistons, they probably won't work with the Vortec heart-shaped chambers, either.
Thread Starter
Racer
Joined: Feb 2009
Posts: 343
Likes: 0
From: San Diego CA
Vortecs are 62cc's (advertised as 64). If you ping with 72's, you'll rattle with 64's. I've run 'em with flat tops at 10.1:1 on computer controlled engines, but I don't know that I'd push it with no knock detectors, etc., and you'll probably be close to 11:1 with Vortecs. If you're running dome pistons, they probably won't work with the Vortec heart-shaped chambers, either.
Since I'm convinced my bottom end is OK then I'm going to choose heads wisely and try to recover the power missing from the original setup. I wanted to get a minimum of 300+HP at the wheels when I built the motor and fell a bit shy of that using these heads.
As others said since one spring broke, no reason to trust the rest of them. I need to yank off that other head and never look back.
Who sells a matched combo of aluminum heads & intake? Besides Edelbrock?
Race Director
Joined: May 2005
Posts: 10,674
Likes: 122
From: Millington Illinois
St. Jude Donor '08-'09
I think the best bang for the buck is the edlebrocks if you can get them for $599. That is a great price. Good possibility you can reuse your intake too. Bet the port match is real close to the edlebrocks and there is a thicker intake gasket available.
Thread Starter
Racer
Joined: Feb 2009
Posts: 343
Likes: 0
From: San Diego CA
Thanks Mako that's good news. How to tell if the thicker gasket is needed? Set the heads on the motor & then set the intake on it without a gasket//check for gaps?
Race Director
Joined: May 2005
Posts: 10,674
Likes: 122
From: Millington Illinois
St. Jude Donor '08-'09
If it is each there are better options. Brodix IK 180 comes to mind. AFR 180 streets will definetly get you 400 FWHP with your setup.but they are a little more money. You get what you pay for with heads. Whatever you do stick with a name brand head. Don't go for the $600 assembled chinese e-bay heads.
http://www.jegs.com/i/Brodix/158/1021004/10002/-1
Last edited by 63mako; Mar 20, 2009 at 02:08 PM.
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Thread Starter
Racer
Joined: Feb 2009
Posts: 343
Likes: 0
From: San Diego CA
Yes, Check with a feeler guage after bolting the heads down. There are a variety of thickness intake gaskets available. Is the 599 price each or for a pair? If it is for a pair, assembled buy them today or they will be gone tomorrow. If it is each there are better options. Brodix IK 180 comes to mind. AFR 180 streets will definetly get you 400 FWHP with your setup.but they are a little more money. You get what you pay for with heads. Whatever you do stick with a name brand head. Don't go for the $600 assembled chinese e-bay heads.
If it is each there are better options. Brodix IK 180 comes to mind. AFR 180 streets will definetly get you 400 FWHP with your setup.but they are a little more money. You get what you pay for with heads. Whatever you do stick with a name brand head. Don't go for the $600 assembled chinese e-bay heads. No way I'm buying no-name stuff.the price quoted at 599.00 was EACH for complete heads, angle plug or straight. Don't know which I want.
I've done work on angle plug engines before but I dont' remember if the plugs were easier to remove with headers or not. If I can make them easier to remove & also get the bennies of the angle plug then that's what I need to do. Assuming my old headers will work.
Race Director
Joined: May 2005
Posts: 10,674
Likes: 122
From: Millington Illinois
St. Jude Donor '08-'09
Yea I was just looking at choices - they are a dime a dozen No way I'm buying no-name stuff.
the price quoted at 599.00 was EACH for complete heads, angle plug or straight. Don't know which I want.
I've done work on angle plug engines before but I dont' remember if the plugs were easier to remove with headers or not. If I can make them easier to remove & also get the bennies of the angle plug then that's what I need to do. Assuming my old headers will work.
No way I'm buying no-name stuff.the price quoted at 599.00 was EACH for complete heads, angle plug or straight. Don't know which I want.
I've done work on angle plug engines before but I dont' remember if the plugs were easier to remove with headers or not. If I can make them easier to remove & also get the bennies of the angle plug then that's what I need to do. Assuming my old headers will work.
