Just curious....Can the Edelbrock E-Street heads be used with a L-82 stock carb, stock cam, Edlbrock 2101 intake and true dual exhaust? If so, what do you think the HP gain would be?

 

To me the vortec setup if you have to buy new parts not going with used stuff just does not pay off by the time you buy heads, intake, rocker arms, valve covers it takes to run them.

Brodix IK180 out flows the vortec head, at $1025.95 in cost it under sells edelbrock easly, runs with all stock type parts.

You want to talk experience working with aluminum brodix made its first aluminum head 1969 for the 426 hemi, has made aluminum heads for small chevy since 1971.

Now brodix does not have a big advertising bill to pay for like edelbrock another reason there cost on the head is better.

BRO-1021004, 64cc chamber, hydraulic flat tappit springs good for
520 lift. www.summitracing.com

 

If the observation is that more $ spent on heads = better performance, I completely agree, as I posted above.

 

Well theres always the temptation to get rid of the iron factory intake
manifold anyway so the brodix rout ends up higher for sure.

But the brodix is a very good head for less money then edelbrock.

I agree if your L/82 camsaft is in good shape changing it will not be a big power booster for you, what will really make you happy is all the better breathing in the heads, added compression.

 

So, my stock set-up with Brodix IK180 heads will work great?

 

That depends on your definition of great.
There will be nothing but good that comes from the head change, but the word 'great' might need to be reserved for replacing the everything invoved with getting air into and out of the engine. (heads, cam, intake and exhaust manifolds)

 

You have got rid of the very restrictive 79 exhaust, you have a reasonbly good camshaft, the heads will raise compression help the
224 .050 int duration L/82 cam the factory compression ratio has always been to low for that much duration, the heads will flow
air a lot better, factory L/82 heads only flow 180 cfm pretty pitifull in comparison to modern heads.

As an example the old 327/350 HP cam had 222 .050 intake duration
but they had a factory rating ( always a little low ) of 11.0 to support the cam good fuel to run the compression, fast forward to the late 70s no fuel to go with the compression they really needed for hot camshafts.

You can run the factory manifold if your tight on cash, change to a
little better one later on.

Make sure when you change heads not to go very thick on the head gaskets if your block is stock never had any cutting done on the deck.

With your flat top L/82 pistons your a better canidate for a 64cc aluminum head, You might be alright with the iron vortec heads
smaller modern chambers but you could be on the edge.

Good airflow in the heads is always a big advantage if your bucks up most likely the air flow resarch head would give the best total airflow but there more around $1400.00 without looking up the cost.
the brodix has a little better airflow then the vortec it can come down to what you can afford within reason. but good airflow in your heads is always a big advantage, everything kind of revolves around how good the heads are, with good heads everything else you do to the engine just keeps making things sweeter and sweeter.

 

Either of the suggested 64cc non-Vortec heads are a good choice if you can make the budget. Remember that for those heads you still need to invest in head bolts (aluminum heads require bolts with washers, ARP recommended), rockers and a gasket set. Just don't short yourself on budget - getting something twice as good 1/2 way done doesn't really help

I did some DD work this morning just for fun. Note that DD is a useful tool - but results aren't perfect by any means.

I have an L-82 baseline model that makes 262HP@5000 RPM and 346TQ@3500 RPM at the flywheel. I use a correction factor of 80%HP/75%TQ (DD is torque-optimistic) for drivetrain and accessory losses, which gives 209HP@5000 and 259TQ@3500 - reasonably close to published specs.

So let's make some changes in the model and see what we get. All of these are in flywheel numbers, so apply the above 80%HP/75%TQ correction for reality at the rear wheels.

BASELINE: 262HP@5000, 346TQ@3500

Intake: 287HP@5000, 352TQ@3500

...add headers:

Headers: 319HP@5000, 379TQ@3500

Now let's do a head comparo based on the above updated baseline; flow numbers are from published tests where available.

Vortec: 340HP@5000, 389TQ@3500
E-Street: 352HP@5000, 392TQ@3500
IK180: 369@5000, 394TQ@4000 (<--new peak)

And, just for fun:
AFR 195 Street: 400HP@6000, 400TQ@4000

This exercise tells us a couple of things, but mostly heads = HP when properly matched with all the components as DRIVESHAFT noted. Interestingly, going with a modern cam profile at about the same lift showed a slightly better torque curve, but typically less peak power. As the cams got more radical, the better heads started to shine...but I don't think your goal is big HP numbers but just a stronger driver.

OK, that's my hour today

 

Couple yrs ago at the ragazine stand there was a test comparing
the factory iron manifold to a performer edelbrock on a reasonable street type engine, the performer made 9 hp more of course the aluminum would save some weight.

If you do decide to change manifolds do not care about your hoods function ( will do without the factory air cleaner ) the rpm manifold would be more help to you.

 

heres what i did to my 79 L-48 to help it with power. comp cams 268 high energy cam with matching valve springs, edelbrock performer egr intake, stock one was cast iron, and roller tipped rockers, not full roller. power really wasnt very noticable until i added headers (hooker competition) with true duals and and dual cats with dynomax super turbos. the exhaust really made the engine rev much easier and pull harder through the entire power band. im not so sure how good the stock L-82 cam is. it has good lift, but its an older designed cam that isnt as efficient as the newer cam profiles. i think one of the smaller extreme energy cams like the 262 would be a good choice with its longer exhaust duration to help the stock cylinder heads flow the exhaust better. i only went with 268 high energy cam because it was the largest emissions legal cam i could find.

 

Kind of surprised no one has mentioned the World S/R Torquers. when I was doing head research for my 81 build up, they performed pretty well in the iron category..........and fairly cheap IIRC.

Your budget dictates iron heads AND if you want to stay "visually" stock iron is also your answer.

Just re-read your post.
1. Long tube headers OR
2. check out the 3.55 or 3.70 rear ends in the "Parts for sale" area

 

The Torquers don't perform all that well out of the box. They're basically a "Stock Replacement" (S/R) for the "camel hump" 462 castings with a few subtle tweaks for improved flow. They're really intended for racers that must run a "stock" head for classing, but recognizing by the sanctioning bodies that these factory castings are simply no longer readily available.

They do have extra casting thickness in a few areas like the short radius of the intake runners where a bit of time with a grinder makes a HUGE difference - and this is typically allowed by class rules.

It's not a bad head, especially for this application, but there are better for about the same price as they're not constrained by the "stock" requirements.

 

That's why i offered it up

 

So many good ways to skin a cat; that why this is such a cool forum!

 

BINGO

Vortecs are close to unbeatable (for the $$$) in the iron category UNLESS you dont want to pony up for the intake, valve covers, pushrods, etc. Also, if you want max hp/$$$ they cant hang with alum heads without ALOT of machining but then they are still penalized by the 1/2 pt of compression they give up for being iron (plus xtra weight)
PLUS its hard to stay "visually" stock with all those top end changes (intake, valve covers, etc)

 

Another problem with the vortec truck head that never gets discused, pressed in studs, .480 lift limit . lets say you wipe a lobe on your flat tappit cam or you just want more power you have vortec heads installed decide you want a hydraulic roller, high performance hydraulic rollers require more open spring pressure then a pressed in stud can safely handle not to mention the lift problem.

Sure you could throw in a a very low lift very low duration pickup cam very mild springs just like the factory did but its not going to be a performance engine when done. So now your only option to do it right is pull the heads back off spend money for machining for screw in studs , cut the valve guide down, cost of the studs, plus the springs.

You buy any other aftermaket head they have screw in studs you can make a simple spring change with heads on the car if you like.

If you buy a bowtie vortec head with screw in studs the cost on them is just as high as better aluminum heads.

 

Add 1.6 roller rockers to that. The AFR springs will handle that. Might get you another 15 hp with the increased lift and duration with this combination. That and the 30 HP from the heads will cost you about 600 extra $ though. That power is probably noticable throughout the working RPM range.

 

Folks, let's make sure we're comparing apples and apples. There's a huge gap between budget, bolt-on heads in a reasonable lift range (.450 or so) for a nice street engine making around 1 HP/CID and big dollar heads targeted at 1.2HP/CID and above.

Trying to turn the former into the latter is an exercise in frustration and bank account depletion. Bottom line is that you should buy the best heads you can afford and match the head to the cam...and the cam to your usage.

FWIW, there are plenty of ways to upgrade the stock Vortecs to .550+ lift relatively inexpensively. It doesn't turn them into AFR heads, but flow is still very respectable for a budget head. SDPC supplies some kits, and there's a CompCams beehive spring/retainer kit as well.

http://www.sdpc2000.com/categories/e...dHeadKits.aspx

http://www.carcraft.com/techarticles...ade/index.html

 

How much cost to install screw in studs? the cost to patch up a new head to make it work with a roller makes the head not worth it. Now if someone is sure they won't change there mind never wants the option of a roller the vortec is ok, the pressed in studs really throws a monkey wrench in them.

The upgraded vortec, Screw in studs like the head should have had from the get go, heads are over $1100.00.

A better head the brodix180 $1025.95 you can buy one with roller springs $1107.95

You end up with a better breathing lighter head for less money.

I may sound like an infomercial for brodix I'm not, but nobody is going to sell me a head for anything with 1950s - 1960s pressed in studs thats my only beef with the standard truck heads.

With screw in studs installed go for it.

 

How many pressed studs have you pulled in your builds? I've built over 150 SBCs, and I have yet to pull a stud in an engine making < 1.2 HP/CID and turning < 6000 RPM to get there. How many pulled studs are you reading about for all the Vortec heads that are being installed?

The only pressed studs I see pulling out are in factory heads that have been hot tanked; this is pretty common and once a head has been in the tank, it needs screw-in studs. Not to say that someone can't install a crazy cam and turn an engine to 6700 RPM and pull studs...but they'd be breaking the screw in ones

I may sound like an infomercial for the Vortecs, but I'm not either I agree the Brodix's are a great head at a great price - and I agree with you to some extent as I noted that putting significant $ into the Vortecs may not be the best investment. But at $800/set with a roller-capable spring from SDPC or about the same if you do it yourself at home with the CompCams beehives, it's still a great price on a good head.

'nuff said - as noted, lots of good ways to skin the same cat I just wanted to offer perspective on the pressed stud concern from my experince.