Wet sanding question.
Le Mans Master
Joined: Apr 2000
Posts: 5,202
Likes: 10
From: cincinnati ohio
St. Jude Donor '09
And use plenty of water and high quality paper.. 3M for example.
Former Vendor
Joined: Apr 2009
Posts: 766
Likes: 3
From: Charlotte North Carolina 704-394-5150
Depends if it is a basecoat/clearcoat paint job or if it is a single stage. The number of coats of paint is also important and what type of spray gun was used (HVLP or not HVLP). The amount of Clear will determine on what grit you can use due to breaking through the clear and into the basecoat color. IF you sand off too much clearcoat...it will "die-back" or "chalk out" in time because there is not enough of it to fight against the UV's of the sun.
After I get done with one of my paint jobs...which I usually apply three coats of clear with a HVLP gun...I start sanding with 1500 grit. I have gotten past the issues with having heavy orange-peel. And I try to keep as much clear on the car as possible. If I feel that it is going to be an issue...with final clearcoat film thickness.. I will sand the car down and then re-apply clear the next day...while the car is all taped up. This is usually on cars with custom graphics and metalflake....but...sometimes I need to do it to basic colors...because I do not like what I see when clearcoating...or...due to the level of paint quality that the customer is payiing for.
In some cases...I will sand with 2000 grit .....and sometimes even use 3000 and 3500 grit that I have in stock....so the buffing goes faster. But I learned how to buff/polish on lacquer paint and buffing is not an issue with me. I do not burn or damage paint...because I WATCH and see what the paint it "telling" me it needs...and not just "*****-nilly" running a buffer over the paint. It is a process that takes time and patience....to get an outstanding end result. When the sand scratches are removed from the paint/clear first stage of buffing...I am done and then move onto the next step in buffing/polishing.
Using a variable speed buffer is helpful to anyone..I use one...so you can control the speed and not damage the edges...because you having the buffer on HIGH speed all the time....can cause serious damage...if you are doing this for the first time. Much like your car....on the straight aways in Arizona...run it flat out FULL power...but in the mountain roads with hills and turns...you better slow down....and take your time.
Another hint...not knowing if you need it or not...REMEMBER...and don't forget this...ALWAYS KEEP IN MIND THE ROTATION OF YOUR BUFFER!!!!! You will ALWAYS want to try to make sure that the buffer pad is rolling off and egde and not cutting into it. IF the pad is rolling off an edge...you will be less likely to remove paint...as long as the pad stays basically FLAT. So you will be twisting and turning the buffer from time to time to make sure that you keep this in mind.
IF you have panels that are not flush...then make sure that you run the buffer at a slow speed...and carefully go over it a few times and slowly bring up the shine...instead of trying to get it perfect the first pass of the buffer.
"DUB"
After I get done with one of my paint jobs...which I usually apply three coats of clear with a HVLP gun...I start sanding with 1500 grit. I have gotten past the issues with having heavy orange-peel. And I try to keep as much clear on the car as possible. If I feel that it is going to be an issue...with final clearcoat film thickness.. I will sand the car down and then re-apply clear the next day...while the car is all taped up. This is usually on cars with custom graphics and metalflake....but...sometimes I need to do it to basic colors...because I do not like what I see when clearcoating...or...due to the level of paint quality that the customer is payiing for.
In some cases...I will sand with 2000 grit .....and sometimes even use 3000 and 3500 grit that I have in stock....so the buffing goes faster. But I learned how to buff/polish on lacquer paint and buffing is not an issue with me. I do not burn or damage paint...because I WATCH and see what the paint it "telling" me it needs...and not just "*****-nilly" running a buffer over the paint. It is a process that takes time and patience....to get an outstanding end result. When the sand scratches are removed from the paint/clear first stage of buffing...I am done and then move onto the next step in buffing/polishing.
Using a variable speed buffer is helpful to anyone..I use one...so you can control the speed and not damage the edges...because you having the buffer on HIGH speed all the time....can cause serious damage...if you are doing this for the first time. Much like your car....on the straight aways in Arizona...run it flat out FULL power...but in the mountain roads with hills and turns...you better slow down....and take your time.
Another hint...not knowing if you need it or not...REMEMBER...and don't forget this...ALWAYS KEEP IN MIND THE ROTATION OF YOUR BUFFER!!!!! You will ALWAYS want to try to make sure that the buffer pad is rolling off and egde and not cutting into it. IF the pad is rolling off an edge...you will be less likely to remove paint...as long as the pad stays basically FLAT. So you will be twisting and turning the buffer from time to time to make sure that you keep this in mind.
IF you have panels that are not flush...then make sure that you run the buffer at a slow speed...and carefully go over it a few times and slowly bring up the shine...instead of trying to get it perfect the first pass of the buffer.
"DUB"
Safety Car
Joined: Nov 2008
Posts: 3,717
Likes: 551
From: Seattle Washington
Depends if it is a basecoat/clearcoat paint job or if it is a single stage. The number of coats of paint is also important and what type of spray gun was used (HVLP or not HVLP). The amount of Clear will determine on what grit you can use due to breaking through the clear and into the basecoat color. IF you sand off too much clearcoat...it will "die-back" or "chalk out" in time because there is not enough of it to fight against the UV's of the sun.
After I get done with one of my paint jobs...which I usually apply three coats of clear with a HVLP gun...I start sanding with 1500 grit. I have gotten past the issues with having heavy orange-peel. And I try to keep as much clear on the car as possible. If I feel that it is going to be an issue...with final clearcoat film thickness.. I will sand the car down and then re-apply clear the next day...while the car is all taped up. This is usually on cars with custom graphics and metalflake....but...sometimes I need to do it to basic colors...because I do not like what I see when clearcoating...or...due to the level of paint quality that the customer is payiing for.
In some cases...I will sand with 2000 grit .....and sometimes even use 3000 and 3500 grit that I have in stock....so the buffing goes faster. But I learned how to buff/polish on lacquer paint and buffing is not an issue with me. I do not burn or damage paint...because I WATCH and see what the paint it "telling" me it needs...and not just "*****-nilly" running a buffer over the paint. It is a process that takes time and patience....to get an outstanding end result. When the sand scratches are removed from the paint/clear first stage of buffing...I am done and then move onto the next step in buffing/polishing.
Using a variable speed buffer is helpful to anyone..I use one...so you can control the speed and not damage the edges...because you having the buffer on HIGH speed all the time....can cause serious damage...if you are doing this for the first time. Much like your car....on the straight aways in Arizona...run it flat out FULL power...but in the mountain roads with hills and turns...you better slow down....and take your time.
Another hint...not knowing if you need it or not...REMEMBER...and don't forget this...ALWAYS KEEP IN MIND THE ROTATION OF YOUR BUFFER!!!!! You will ALWAYS want to try to make sure that the buffer pad is rolling off and egde and not cutting into it. IF the pad is rolling off an edge...you will be less likely to remove paint...as long as the pad stays basically FLAT. So you will be twisting and turning the buffer from time to time to make sure that you keep this in mind.
IF you have panels that are not flush...then make sure that you run the buffer at a slow speed...and carefully go over it a few times and slowly bring up the shine...instead of trying to get it perfect the first pass of the buffer.
"DUB"
After I get done with one of my paint jobs...which I usually apply three coats of clear with a HVLP gun...I start sanding with 1500 grit. I have gotten past the issues with having heavy orange-peel. And I try to keep as much clear on the car as possible. If I feel that it is going to be an issue...with final clearcoat film thickness.. I will sand the car down and then re-apply clear the next day...while the car is all taped up. This is usually on cars with custom graphics and metalflake....but...sometimes I need to do it to basic colors...because I do not like what I see when clearcoating...or...due to the level of paint quality that the customer is payiing for.
In some cases...I will sand with 2000 grit .....and sometimes even use 3000 and 3500 grit that I have in stock....so the buffing goes faster. But I learned how to buff/polish on lacquer paint and buffing is not an issue with me. I do not burn or damage paint...because I WATCH and see what the paint it "telling" me it needs...and not just "*****-nilly" running a buffer over the paint. It is a process that takes time and patience....to get an outstanding end result. When the sand scratches are removed from the paint/clear first stage of buffing...I am done and then move onto the next step in buffing/polishing.
Using a variable speed buffer is helpful to anyone..I use one...so you can control the speed and not damage the edges...because you having the buffer on HIGH speed all the time....can cause serious damage...if you are doing this for the first time. Much like your car....on the straight aways in Arizona...run it flat out FULL power...but in the mountain roads with hills and turns...you better slow down....and take your time.
Another hint...not knowing if you need it or not...REMEMBER...and don't forget this...ALWAYS KEEP IN MIND THE ROTATION OF YOUR BUFFER!!!!! You will ALWAYS want to try to make sure that the buffer pad is rolling off and egde and not cutting into it. IF the pad is rolling off an edge...you will be less likely to remove paint...as long as the pad stays basically FLAT. So you will be twisting and turning the buffer from time to time to make sure that you keep this in mind.
IF you have panels that are not flush...then make sure that you run the buffer at a slow speed...and carefully go over it a few times and slowly bring up the shine...instead of trying to get it perfect the first pass of the buffer.
"DUB"
Thread Starter
Safety Car
Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 4,282
Likes: 172
From: Lake Wylie, South Carolina
Depends if it is a basecoat/clearcoat paint job or if it is a single stage. The number of coats of paint is also important and what type of spray gun was used (HVLP or not HVLP). The amount of Clear will determine on what grit you can use due to breaking through the clear and into the basecoat color. IF you sand off too much clearcoat...it will "die-back" or "chalk out" in time because there is not enough of it to fight against the UV's of the sun.
After I get done with one of my paint jobs...which I usually apply three coats of clear with a HVLP gun...I start sanding with 1500 grit. I have gotten past the issues with having heavy orange-peel. And I try to keep as much clear on the car as possible. If I feel that it is going to be an issue...with final clearcoat film thickness.. I will sand the car down and then re-apply clear the next day...while the car is all taped up. This is usually on cars with custom graphics and metalflake....but...sometimes I need to do it to basic colors...because I do not like what I see when clearcoating...or...due to the level of paint quality that the customer is payiing for.
In some cases...I will sand with 2000 grit .....and sometimes even use 3000 and 3500 grit that I have in stock....so the buffing goes faster. But I learned how to buff/polish on lacquer paint and buffing is not an issue with me. I do not burn or damage paint...because I WATCH and see what the paint it "telling" me it needs...and not just "*****-nilly" running a buffer over the paint. It is a process that takes time and patience....to get an outstanding end result. When the sand scratches are removed from the paint/clear first stage of buffing...I am done and then move onto the next step in buffing/polishing.
Using a variable speed buffer is helpful to anyone..I use one...so you can control the speed and not damage the edges...because you having the buffer on HIGH speed all the time....can cause serious damage...if you are doing this for the first time. Much like your car....on the straight aways in Arizona...run it flat out FULL power...but in the mountain roads with hills and turns...you better slow down....and take your time.
Another hint...not knowing if you need it or not...REMEMBER...and don't forget this...ALWAYS KEEP IN MIND THE ROTATION OF YOUR BUFFER!!!!! You will ALWAYS want to try to make sure that the buffer pad is rolling off and egde and not cutting into it. IF the pad is rolling off an edge...you will be less likely to remove paint...as long as the pad stays basically FLAT. So you will be twisting and turning the buffer from time to time to make sure that you keep this in mind.
IF you have panels that are not flush...then make sure that you run the buffer at a slow speed...and carefully go over it a few times and slowly bring up the shine...instead of trying to get it perfect the first pass of the buffer.
"DUB"
After I get done with one of my paint jobs...which I usually apply three coats of clear with a HVLP gun...I start sanding with 1500 grit. I have gotten past the issues with having heavy orange-peel. And I try to keep as much clear on the car as possible. If I feel that it is going to be an issue...with final clearcoat film thickness.. I will sand the car down and then re-apply clear the next day...while the car is all taped up. This is usually on cars with custom graphics and metalflake....but...sometimes I need to do it to basic colors...because I do not like what I see when clearcoating...or...due to the level of paint quality that the customer is payiing for.
In some cases...I will sand with 2000 grit .....and sometimes even use 3000 and 3500 grit that I have in stock....so the buffing goes faster. But I learned how to buff/polish on lacquer paint and buffing is not an issue with me. I do not burn or damage paint...because I WATCH and see what the paint it "telling" me it needs...and not just "*****-nilly" running a buffer over the paint. It is a process that takes time and patience....to get an outstanding end result. When the sand scratches are removed from the paint/clear first stage of buffing...I am done and then move onto the next step in buffing/polishing.
Using a variable speed buffer is helpful to anyone..I use one...so you can control the speed and not damage the edges...because you having the buffer on HIGH speed all the time....can cause serious damage...if you are doing this for the first time. Much like your car....on the straight aways in Arizona...run it flat out FULL power...but in the mountain roads with hills and turns...you better slow down....and take your time.
Another hint...not knowing if you need it or not...REMEMBER...and don't forget this...ALWAYS KEEP IN MIND THE ROTATION OF YOUR BUFFER!!!!! You will ALWAYS want to try to make sure that the buffer pad is rolling off and egde and not cutting into it. IF the pad is rolling off an edge...you will be less likely to remove paint...as long as the pad stays basically FLAT. So you will be twisting and turning the buffer from time to time to make sure that you keep this in mind.
IF you have panels that are not flush...then make sure that you run the buffer at a slow speed...and carefully go over it a few times and slowly bring up the shine...instead of trying to get it perfect the first pass of the buffer.
"DUB"
Also,
I hope to be contacting you soon on installing my convertible top. I have the frame stripped and painted. All hoops look good and I had very little rust. Just surface. the tack strips are the hard rubber ones and i pulled the staples out. Should I still order new tack strips?
Thanks
Wade
Burning Brakes
Joined: May 2006
Posts: 857
Likes: 1
From: Morrisonville Illinios
You might want to look at some of the new wet sanders out on the market they feed the water directly to the pad while you sand while using air. They will cut your sanding time way down and you can use lots of fine paper. you will still have to do some by hand edge's but really help out in the flat areas.
Good Luck wro87
Good Luck wro87
Melting Slicks
Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 2,989
Likes: 198
From: Meriden CT
I have wet sanded my Single Stage before but never one of the newer 2 stage Paints with Clear. However I will soon be learning as Paint is in the near future. My question is; dose one Color sand the Paint before applying the Clear? And then of coarse the Clear later?
Former Vendor
Joined: Apr 2009
Posts: 766
Likes: 3
From: Charlotte North Carolina 704-394-5150
I have wet sanded my Single Stage before but never one of the newer 2 stage Paints with Clear. However I will soon be learning as Paint is in the near future. My question is; dose one Color sand the Paint before applying the Clear? And then of coarse the Clear later?
Properly choosing your reducer/thinner for your temperature that you are shooting at, at that time is important. along with practicing so you get the texture the way you want it. You will know that you are comfortable with painting when...you can get into a "ZEN" state of mind and not be nervous. IT IS ALL ABOUT TECHNIQUE!!!! ...and having the proper equipment to make the end result the best possible. So jumping right into painting your car without any information ....can be disasterous.
"DUB"
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Former Vendor
Joined: Apr 2009
Posts: 766
Likes: 3
From: Charlotte North Carolina 704-394-5150
Thanks DUB!!! My car is BC\CC and I am using the Mguiars line of perfet it II polish, swirl remover and gold class. I am having some areas that are staying hazy. Any suggestions on what method or products to use for this? I am doing the vert decklid right now as it is off the carr and I have sanded from 1000,1500 to 2000. I have 4 coats of clear.
Also,
I hope to be contacting you soon on installing my convertible top. I have the frame stripped and painted. All hoops look good and I had very little rust. Just surface. the tack strips are the hard rubber ones and i pulled the staples out. Should I still order new tack strips?
Thanks
Wade
Also,
I hope to be contacting you soon on installing my convertible top. I have the frame stripped and painted. All hoops look good and I had very little rust. Just surface. the tack strips are the hard rubber ones and i pulled the staples out. Should I still order new tack strips?
Thanks
Wade
Do not sweat the tack strips...I will look at them and if I need them...I will order them for you. Are you linkages tight in the top frame...where the rivets hold these linkages together. I am more worried about that than the tack strips. If so...do not worry, I have the rivets and the special staking tool also.
How old is you paint job? When it was painted...from the bare fiberglass to the clear coat. Tell me what was applied on top of the fiberglass and so on.
ALSO...did your clearcoat use a reducer...or was it just clear and hardner?
PM me with this information...so a "WAR of OPINIONS" is not started....unless you want to do so. Supply me with any brand name and part numbers of what was used...and the temperature of when it was shot....if possible. I am not going to "complain" on what you used...it is so I can detect if your problem is one that I have encountered in the past...due to solvent issues....and lack of curing....because to "slow" of a reducer/thinner/hardener was used for the air temperature at the time of spraying. It all makes a difference when trying to get the clear coat "crystal clear" again.
I am here to aid you....not to pass judgement....BUT I will let you know what I think....it can possible be.
"DUB"
Former Vendor
Joined: Apr 2009
Posts: 766
Likes: 3
From: Charlotte North Carolina 704-394-5150
You might want to look at some of the new wet sanders out on the market they feed the water directly to the pad while you sand while using air. They will cut your sanding time way down and you can use lots of fine paper. you will still have to do some by hand edge's but really help out in the flat areas.
Good Luck wro87
Good Luck wro87
I would NOT use these sanders. IF you get a piece of trash in between the pad and the finish. It will do more damage than you can imagine...when trying to get one really slick and "orange-peel" free. YOU have NO sense of "feel" with these sanders...and when doing it by hand...you can quickly detect when a speck of trash has gotten on your sandpaper....even if you are using filtered running water. All it takes is ONE piece of trash to get GROUND into your fresh clearcoat...and you will see what I mean. SPEAKING FROM EXPERIENCE. Borrowed one...tried it...and will NEVER AGAIN use it.
Talk to any EXPERIENCED painter who does SHOW QUALITY paint jobs and they will more than likely agree. Those sanders are not woirth using....regardless of using running water or not...THEY ARE TROUBLE waiting to happen. It works fine at "those places" that offer $199.00 paint specials....because you are getting what your paying for...NOT MUCH!!
"DUB"
Safety Car
Joined: Nov 2008
Posts: 3,717
Likes: 551
From: Seattle Washington
When removeing Swirl Marks i have had my best luck with a Product from the Wax Shop thats called "Safe Cut". When I had my Car in the 1989 Autorama the most often asked Question was what did I use to buff it out. This was with Single stage paint but ever since it has worked well with factory clear coats as well.
Drifting
Joined: Aug 2009
Posts: 1,635
Likes: 8
From: Enid Oklahoma
Start with a 1500, if that isn't getting it done go to 1000 if it still needs more to remove peel go to 800, very light with a block. If you start too course and didn't need it, then your in a tough boat and can sand through the clear. And it also depends on how mu ch clear is on it, if it is too thin, you can get through and into the color real quick, be careful and let the paper do the work. I finish wet sand with 2000-2500 and buff with 3000 3M, then hand buff, nothin like a black car done right, but black shows scratches and swirls so be very picky and don't rush anything.
Burning Brakes
Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 1,139
Likes: 0
From: Salina Kansas
I just did a bumper with base clear and it had some bad orange peel in the sides. I used 1500, then went down the 800, then 1500 and then 2000. Turned out pretty good really. I had 4 coats of clear on it btw.
Race Director
Joined: Feb 1999
Posts: 16,978
Likes: 7
From: In Dreams There Is Truth Ohio
http://cgi.ebay.com/Mirka-MR-5-5-Abr...item414280bec0
http://cgi.ebay.com/Mirka-Abralon-6-...item5189699bf4
Get the above sander and the discs, start with the 1000, and work your way all the way up to 4000 grit...using this system you will get a perfect job and the cost is well worth it..
http://cgi.ebay.com/Mirka-Abralon-6-...item5189699bf4
Get the above sander and the discs, start with the 1000, and work your way all the way up to 4000 grit...using this system you will get a perfect job and the cost is well worth it..
Race Director
Joined: Sep 1999
Posts: 11,361
Likes: 383
From: Plano TX
One thing I have learned about wet sanding/polishing is that after the 2000 grit paper stage, the right compound is critical. If you use one that is too fine it will just about never get that deep gloss. The fine polish puts a shine to the scratches, so to speak. Don't be afraid to use an aggressive compound after 2000 grit, then go medium and fine. I did some small parts (headlight bezels, trim etc) by hand and with the right compounds it goes surprisingly quick.
Race Director
Joined: Feb 1999
Posts: 16,978
Likes: 7
From: In Dreams There Is Truth Ohio
Drifting
Joined: Jul 2004
Posts: 1,556
Likes: 91
From: Skiatook. Oklahoma.
Do you know anything about that sander? No, of course you don't, else you wouldn't have made your post....Sander and sanding pads designed for BC/CC.
Tell you what...you do color sanding your way, and I will use my Mirka sander and pads. Best buy I ever made...when I finish with the 4000 grit, one would think the car is polished.
Tell you what...you do color sanding your way, and I will use my Mirka sander and pads. Best buy I ever made...when I finish with the 4000 grit, one would think the car is polished.
That system works!
