I'm getting up the guts to tie into rebuilding the rear bearings, brakes, & trailing arms. I took a class at Bloomington two years ago and think that it is well within my ability. My problem is "What tools do I absolutely need, and do you know of anywhere that I can rent rather than buying them". I already know that I need the setup tool to get proper shim setup but I'm not sure I need all the other stuff. Please, help me out. Thanks.

 

I just did mine and have another set to do off my 69 soit's still fresh in the head :lol: I used a 20 ton press from Harbor Freight cost about $220 and you can use it for a lot of other things too. In addition to the setup tool you'll need the outer bearing puller and the spindle knocker. I used the knocker as a press extension so that I wouldn't damage the threads of the spindle. The tools I didn't use were the bearing/spindle press or the bearing installer. I used a piece of 1.5" electrical EMT to press on the inner bearing. I made up a plate you hold the bearing housing while set the end play. I think I still have thepicture on file I'll email it to you if I find it. I used Mobil1 red grease. Check your seals, I got a bad one from a vette supplier but NAPA stocks them too.
you can do it as long as you don't rush and ask questions. I got a lot of help from the "Rear Bearing MAN"-Tom454 :lol: :lol:
Good luck,
Gary

 

Thanks, most of what you said is what I thought. But I wasn't sure if I needed the bearing puller. I know that I've just broke the race of old bearing using a chisel. They seemed to break easily and since I'll be putting new ones on I thought that might work and maybe save the cost of the puller. Do you have any ideas on that method? Thanks for your input.

 

I haven't tried that method but others have cut the race with a die grinder almost through and cracked them off. Harbor frieght sells a large bearing separator I used to pull the pinion bearing off with in the differential maybe you could grind itdown to fit the outer bearing and use it? The puller I mentioned is about $120, harbor freight sells the lg one for $10-$20.
Gary

 

Gary... AKA... "The Internationally Renowned Differential Expert" (see... I told you it would happen...)
Didn't think I was listening, did ya?

bfrance-

A press allows you to do the job with "finesse" instead of pounding the poop out of everything.
To remnove the spindles, the spindle knocker sometimes works, and sometimes doesn't. Depends on the current relationship between the spindle & the bearing inner races. If somebody used a punch & chisel on them and chewed up the machined surfaces, then the knocker may not work... then you will need a press. Also, if the bearing inner race has seized on the spindle due to overheating, the knocker most likely will not work.

Removing the outer bearing from the spindle can be done with a hammer & chisel... but this is typically why some spindles are chewed up. Any damage to the machined surface can also make it very difficult to install the new bearings/races. No rocket science here.... just common sense. If you feel confident you can do the maneuver without damaging the spindle, then why not? Otherwise, you will need the split bearing remover and either a press, or the original Kent-Moore tool made for the purpose.

It is common practice to throw a shop rag over a standard ball-bearing axle bearing and to "explode" it with a 20 ton press... done my fair share of these. Then the retention ring is chiseled & split, and the inner race is removed with a puller. I have never tried this method with the tapered roller bearings on a Corvette spindle... too much screwing around. I just use the tool that was designed for the task.

Installation is a different story- and there are some very strong opinions on the topic. I get flamed every time I write about it.
In my opinion... it is not a good thing to use the new bearing seats & rollers to "pull" the bearings onto the spindle. There is a tool that is sold to do the job this way, but personally, I would never use it. I feel it risks doing damage to the new bearings. Kinda "bubba", given the amount of work this task is to do over again. The "pull" method allows you to fully seat the outer seal ahead of time, which is a plus, but not necessary. The seal can be pressed into its bore after the spindle & bearings are fully assembled. That is how I have been doing them for over 25 years.

Again, in my opinion, the outer bearing could be either pressed on or smacked on with a hammer & length of pipe (which I also use now & again) by putting pressure on the inner race... no damage will occur this way. But- the inner bearing should not be "pulled" on using the outer bearing & race for the opposing force. I press the inner bearing on.

The bearing seats in the spindle support can be knocked out using a punch.
They should be installed using the correct diameter seat driver... but as long as you do not damage the seat, anything appropriate will suffice.
If a socket is used, it may very well contact the seat on the edge where the bearing roller rides... this is called "damage".

Don't forget to install the outer seal BEFORE you install the outer bearing.

Okay... flame suit is on... I hope my friends remember me in my time of need. :)

 

Thanks for the input. Now I just need to crack open the wallet and order some tools. Thanks again.

 

[QUOTE]Gary... AKA... "The Internationally Renowned Differential Expert" (see... I told you it would happen...)
Didn't think I was listening, did ya?


Man, what did I do to deserve this abuse :D :lol: :lol: :lol: :cheers:

Bfrance, If you're only going to do one car maybe it would be better to just sendthem to Bair's,Van Steel's,etc it will probably save you some money and time. If you're like me and have to do it yourself go for it! I have driven the cars for many years now so I don't care if they sit up on jacks for a couple of years while I rebuild them,make tools,etc. If you want to drive it soon let the shop do it for you.
I'm going to check for your email address and send a picture of the fixture I made on th eadvice of "THE REAR BEARING MAN" Tom454 :lol:

Good Luck,
Gary

 

TOM,
I'M only kidding, you know. You really helped me out when I needed advice.
Thanks again,
Gary :cheers:

 

Gary... hey... what good are friends if you can't abuse them now & then?

I've recently figured out that someone goes from an "acquaintence" to a "friend" when they can say:

SHUT UP TOM!"

...and I enjoy it!

 

Could one of you guys send me a pic of this fixture that you're talking about? I have some homemade tools that I used for this job on my 81' but would like to get something that makes the job a little easier.

 

The fixture is just a jig that holds the spindle support & spindle in a vertical position while checking & setting end-play. Mine is made out of wood and I have used it for 20+ years. Garys is made a lot more professionally than mine & out of metal... consider it the "updated" version. The basic premise is this: when checking the endplay, if you really want to do the job well, you want to limit the play to somewhere between .001 & .002, preferably closer to .001. I have played around with these things for a long time, and the GM allowance for .001 to .008 is not acceptable. At .003, unwanted camber change begins to be felt in the wheel and "MTBF" takes a nose dive.

The problem with checking endplay on the car/horizontally is that you cannot get a good, accurate, reproduceable reading. There is enough surface variance on the spindle to cause the reading to fluctuate up to .0015- .002. The jig holds the assembly steady so that you can keep the dial gage from wandering and giving you false readings. It also reduces the tendency to interpret horizontal (radial) movement of the spindle & tapered rolling bearing as endplay.

The fixture/jig is also designed to aid in applying a consistent pressure while taking the reading. If you use gravity to locate the spindle and take a reading, you will get one number. If you apply a 1000 lb force, you will get another reading... so- the pressure must be applied consistently from reading-to-reading in order to get meaningful adjustment data.

Gary & I have both analysed this (and tested extensively) and the jig is the solution. His picture is prettier than mine, so I'll let him do the honors. Mine is cheap & easy to make- piece of 2x6 and some threaded rod & nuts. If you want to build the cheap version- let me know & I'll snap a few images.

Tom

 

I still have the picture on my work computer so I'll check it when I get in today.

The credit for this belongs to Tom, I just made use of lunch time, scrap metal, and the machines I'm lucky to access to. I used Aluminum only because that's all I had in that size, I would have preferred steel. I installed a steel plate for the mag base but still "C" clamped to the base. When using an indicator on anything you must be sure it doesn't move on you, just a slight hand pressure can throw off your readings.

The question I ran up against is just how much pressure is correct. The book just says to grap the rotor and push/pull while using an indicator. I think if you line up 10 people you'll get 10 different readings,so I played around with applying pressure to the bearings to see what happens. I used the original bearings, btw for testing the fixture. The original bearings were good I changed only them because I have everything apart. I installed a push tool against the setup tool and found.010" varience when applying pressure before completely loading the bearings. I ended up using hand applied pressure to check the endplay and used a surface grinder to fine tune the spacer for about .0015"-.0018" end play. When done the rotor should spin nice and smooth with no dragging.

I had a problem with the SS brake hdwr and SS shoes- I had to face off the star wheel and drill another hole in the shoes for them to fit and compress within the rotor hub. I as not impressed with the quality of those pieces. I also had to fit the new dust shields because the holes were drilled off center? Hum, did American mfg forget how to drill/punch holes center to center or maybe these weren't made here in the good old USA?
Maybe it was just a 1-off problem that I got? :rolleyes:

So,did I explain it correctly,Master Tom :jester :cheers:
Gary


[Modified by gtr1999, 7:13 AM 3/26/2002]

 

Dalannex
Picture on the way,let me know if you get it.
Gary

 

Gary,
Where did you get your parking brake hardware from. When I took the class at Bloomington, they claimed that Bair's was the best fit and finish.

By the way, I am going to do the work myself, just because this car is one of my hobbies. I figured it out that it's a wash (pricewise) whether I do the work and buy the tools or send it out. I know my wife has spent a lot more on her education that I will on educating myself on the fine points of Corvette repair. And she doesn't use her's as much as I do mine. I have a friend that has a machine shop and am going to talk to him today to see if I can come in on a saturday to assemble the bearings. That will save me a lot of the expense. Keep your finger crossed, I'll let you know what happens. Thanks for the input.

 

Tom & GTR-
Since I'm in the middle of bearing rebld myself, I'd be interested in photos of both your jigs. Could you please either post 'em here or email me?! Thanx -Rod :chevy

 

Bruce,
let me know if I can help. Glad to hear you're going to do the job yourself. That's how I feel too, not to take away from any of the shops out there that do the work.Once you do it you'll know it something you can always handle.

The SS kit and shoes I bought are made by a well know USA company and distributed by many vette vendors. I might just have got an oddball set? Let me know how you do with your setup. I don't recall who made the shields or which vendor I purchased from, but I would think they came from only a few sources. The center to center holes were off enough that I had to file them oversize and the large hole for the pivot bolt was off too. Once I fixed it you can't tell.

I have a brother-in-law who is having his 63 SWC done now, he lives in Cedarburg WI, is that near you? I was in WI only once to see a Packers game nice area from what I saw.
Gary

 

Picture on the way. If you can post it for me on the forum it may help others.
Thanks,
Gary

 

I used an old spindle for a jig. Just turn the spindle shaft down a bit (sand paper), to allow a free fit of the races. You have a ready made base (flange), and a nut at the top to tighten the assembly to get an accurate measurement. This worked very well.
On final assembly in the car, the measurement was exactly the same as the jig.
Barry

 

Barry...

A turned down spindle is the same thing as the "bearing shim selector tool". That is not a "jig", or fixture,
And is not what Gary and I are referring to.

We are referring to a holding fixture which holds the spindle support in a vertical position so that an accurate dial gage reading can be obtained.
I started doing these rear bearings over 25 years ago and found that there was a 50/50 chance of getting a truly accurate reading when the spindle support & spindle is mounted horizontally on the car... the radial bearing movement and the surface irregularities of the spindle face are the culprits. I think you will get a better idea of what we are talking about when someone posts the pics of the fixture.

When I first started telling Gary about the problem, he wasn't sure what I was talking about either. Then he did the same test I did and saw for himself.

I'm sure he will back me up on this. His dial gage also showed that surface irregularies can skew the results. Add "pressure" to the equation, and it becomes nearly impossible to generate a 100% reproduceable test. And finally, when taking a reading "on the car" (horizontally), the tapered roller bearing will sit low in the saddle until you push on it... then it will rise into place.... and this causes the dial gage to skim across the uneven surface of the spindle.... not very much, but enough to screw up the reading.

That's why I use the fixture to set up bearings for my customers.

Hope this helps.

One final note: if your dial gage is only accurate to .001 (most of them are), then you would never know all of this is even happening.

Tom

 

That's a good idea. I've had this spindle laying around for years.