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Turnkey crate options?
Thread Starter
Heel & Toe
Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 21
Likes: 0
From: Columbia MD
Turnkey crate options?
Hi all,
After looking at the total situation with my '79 I've come to the conclusion that it's probably best to drop a crate engine in and box up the old engine/components.
After looking around on the forum and web it seems to me that there are really just a handful of engines that seem to be the common crate options for a C3:
Chevy 350 H.O. @ 330hp
ZZ4 @ 355hp
ZZ383 @ 450hp
Blueprint 383 @ 408hp
The frontrunners as far as a basic transmission upgrade looks to be the 200M4 and Keisler Automatic.
I'm just looking to make the car fun to cruise around with, nothing too crazy.
Now for my dumb question:
Which of the engine options/providers above, if any, gives a guy either an exact match to the stock belts/engine components or better yet have configuration options to modernize the belts/components as well (serpentine)?
Are each of them compatible with the two transmission options?
Thanks again!
After looking at the total situation with my '79 I've come to the conclusion that it's probably best to drop a crate engine in and box up the old engine/components.
After looking around on the forum and web it seems to me that there are really just a handful of engines that seem to be the common crate options for a C3:
Chevy 350 H.O. @ 330hp
ZZ4 @ 355hp
ZZ383 @ 450hp
Blueprint 383 @ 408hp
The frontrunners as far as a basic transmission upgrade looks to be the 200M4 and Keisler Automatic.
I'm just looking to make the car fun to cruise around with, nothing too crazy.
Now for my dumb question:
Which of the engine options/providers above, if any, gives a guy either an exact match to the stock belts/engine components or better yet have configuration options to modernize the belts/components as well (serpentine)?
Are each of them compatible with the two transmission options?
Thanks again!
Drifting
Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 1,936
Likes: 1
From: Winston-Salem NC
I have this one in mine - only 200 miles on it. Want a stronger engine. Car is in paint, and hasn't even been broken in yet. I'll let it go for $5500. It has the Endurashine, and I paid $6700 for it. I just want to get my money out of it. Also, I have Steeroids, VB&P Ultimate Suspension pkg, aftermarket air, true duals on my '71 vert. No mods needed on engine aspect. Also running TH400.
http://www.edelbrock.com/automotive_...etec_435.shtml
http://www.edelbrock.com/automotive_...etec_435.shtml
Last edited by eagle275; Jan 6, 2011 at 10:17 PM. Reason: add
Burning Brakes
Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 1,028
Likes: 1
From: SOUTH ELGIN IL
I think you will find the ZZ4 to be very well tempered for the street, both cruising and also if you want to get on it a little. I find it to be a little to well tempered to be honest. I do have the ZZ4 plugged into a TH400 so I'm leeching power, I just don't think I'd gain enough back even if I put a 6 speed behind it.
You can do serpentine on any of those engines if you want to. Summit sells it all, including the serpentine system.
You can do serpentine on any of those engines if you want to. Summit sells it all, including the serpentine system.
Last edited by Dantana; Jan 5, 2011 at 11:57 PM.
Thread Starter
Heel & Toe
Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 21
Likes: 0
From: Columbia MD
Thanks!
Would any of the engine options *require* a new exhaust system? ... Although I imagine a guy would probably want to make changes in that department as well anyway...
Also, is there any one of them that would not be compatible with a rack and pinion steering modification for any reason?
Or are they all equal in these sorts of things and all that really matters is figuring out what you want?
My budget for everything, engine, engine components, install, steering upgrade, new radiator etc is going to be around 8K max for now...
Would any of the engine options *require* a new exhaust system? ... Although I imagine a guy would probably want to make changes in that department as well anyway...
Also, is there any one of them that would not be compatible with a rack and pinion steering modification for any reason?
Or are they all equal in these sorts of things and all that really matters is figuring out what you want?
My budget for everything, engine, engine components, install, steering upgrade, new radiator etc is going to be around 8K max for now...
Le Mans Master
Joined: Sep 2001
Posts: 7,739
Likes: 630
From: Unreconstructed, South Carolina
several here have chosen this & seem pleased:
YearOne crate p/n CT350PC1
< $3000, 355" roller cam, ~400HP
http://www.yearone.com/yodnn/tech/Te...7/Default.aspx
http://www.yearone.com/serverfiles/f...496&cat=Q&trk=
FWIW, Professional Products (vortec) intake p/n 52007 is the shortest I'm aware of.
YearOne crate p/n CT350PC1
< $3000, 355" roller cam, ~400HP
http://www.yearone.com/yodnn/tech/Te...7/Default.aspx
http://www.yearone.com/serverfiles/f...496&cat=Q&trk=
FWIW, Professional Products (vortec) intake p/n 52007 is the shortest I'm aware of.
Instructor
Joined: May 2007
Posts: 130
Likes: 0
From: Houston TX
Why not consider an LS swap. A little more expensive and more work to change over to ECM, electronics, etc...but performance and mileage benefits are superior. Check out Street and Performance, www.hotrodlane.cc, for all details, conversion parts, video instruction.
Lots of choices, how much can you spend$$$, how much work are you in for????
Good luck.
Lots of choices, how much can you spend$$$, how much work are you in for????
Good luck.
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Thread Starter
Heel & Toe
Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 21
Likes: 0
From: Columbia MD
Thanks everyone.
Just looking at the price tags on these engines and considering that I need to get a lot in addition to the base engine it seems to me that the Blueprint 383 and YearOne 350 both look like good options.
...So, if I were to get one of those two what would I *NOT* be getting with them? They're so much cheaper from the prices I'm seeing??? Why?
Just looking at the price tags on these engines and considering that I need to get a lot in addition to the base engine it seems to me that the Blueprint 383 and YearOne 350 both look like good options.
...So, if I were to get one of those two what would I *NOT* be getting with them? They're so much cheaper from the prices I'm seeing??? Why?
Race Director
Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 14,062
Likes: 602
From: Henderson Nv-Rohnert Park/Sonoma C o. ca/born in NY Rockaway Beach.
I did the GM ZZ4 and love it.. came with almost everything.. BUT the only thing I would change is I would have gotten the LT4 hotcam package.. 425hp with the LT4 cam..
Im getting the L4 cam installed this winter.....
Im getting the L4 cam installed this winter.....
Le Mans Master
Joined: Jun 2008
Posts: 5,284
Likes: 235
From: Rockledge FL
Mine has had a Jasper class II 454, 440hp/500 lb-ft running strong for 2 years now.
comes with a 3 year warranty. their class I engines are mass produced rebuilds but the class II's are built well. Total engine with install was 4K.
comes with a 3 year warranty. their class I engines are mass produced rebuilds but the class II's are built well. Total engine with install was 4K.
Drifting
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 1,986
Likes: 21
From: Columbus MN
I have the GM 350 HO Deluxe and really like it. Mine is performing above GM's rating after a bunch of tuning, headers, cold air intake, and electric fan. I plan to hop it up to just over 400 hp with the GM LT4 Hot Cam kit (full roller) and Comp Cams springs. Mine is 10 years old now and doesn't leak a drop of oil.
As ZZ71S explained, the GM crate engines are new front to back and top to bottom vs. built up from refurbished blocks.
Here is a video our son took of a dyno run last spring (RWHP):
As ZZ71S explained, the GM crate engines are new front to back and top to bottom vs. built up from refurbished blocks.
Here is a video our son took of a dyno run last spring (RWHP):
Thread Starter
Heel & Toe
Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 21
Likes: 0
From: Columbia MD
Thanks MN80Vette.
Can you tell me whether the Chevy 350 H.O. or ZZ4 is easier to drop in? Or are they basically identical from that perspective?
Would you mind telling more about your set up? What did you have to adjust around the engine to make things work? ...I think I'll probably end up going with one of those two engines. The next step would be figuring out the configuration of the other components.
I found these two dressed engines online. Would their accessory set up work on a '79? What about the fan/headers?
350 HO:
http://www.crateenginedepot.com/stor...P1427C510.aspx
ZZ4:
http://www.crateenginedepot.com/stor...-P945C510.aspx
Thanks again!
Can you tell me whether the Chevy 350 H.O. or ZZ4 is easier to drop in? Or are they basically identical from that perspective?
Would you mind telling more about your set up? What did you have to adjust around the engine to make things work? ...I think I'll probably end up going with one of those two engines. The next step would be figuring out the configuration of the other components.
I found these two dressed engines online. Would their accessory set up work on a '79? What about the fan/headers?
350 HO:
http://www.crateenginedepot.com/stor...P1427C510.aspx
ZZ4:
http://www.crateenginedepot.com/stor...-P945C510.aspx
Thanks again!
Drifting
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 1,986
Likes: 21
From: Columbus MN
Thanks MN80Vette.
Can you tell me whether the Chevy 350 H.O. or ZZ4 is easier to drop in? Or are they basically identical from that perspective?
Would you mind telling more about your set up? What did you have to adjust around the engine to make things work? ...I think I'll probably end up going with one of those two engines. The next step would be figuring out the configuration of the other components.
I found these two dressed engines online. Would their accessory set up work on a '79? What about the fan/headers?
350 HO:
http://www.crateenginedepot.com/stor...P1427C510.aspx
ZZ4:
http://www.crateenginedepot.com/stor...-P945C510.aspx
Thanks again!
Can you tell me whether the Chevy 350 H.O. or ZZ4 is easier to drop in? Or are they basically identical from that perspective?
Would you mind telling more about your set up? What did you have to adjust around the engine to make things work? ...I think I'll probably end up going with one of those two engines. The next step would be figuring out the configuration of the other components.
I found these two dressed engines online. Would their accessory set up work on a '79? What about the fan/headers?
350 HO:
http://www.crateenginedepot.com/stor...P1427C510.aspx
ZZ4:
http://www.crateenginedepot.com/stor...-P945C510.aspx
Thanks again!
Here is my most recent post about what I've done to my overachieving HO:
GMPP 19210008 install in an 80 model?
I have full-length ceramic coated headers from Summit (formerly with the Dynomax label). I also made a simple modification to my front cross member to convert my exhaust to a true dual setup. Here is the link to one of my posts about that mod:
Question on an 82
In hindsight, I should have used a 2 1/2" univeral H-pipe from Summit or Jeg's instead of letting the muffler shop make one. Oh well.
I transferred my original accessories (minus the AC) to my HO for convenience. Others here have used the GM accessories. Try the Advanced Search function to snoop around.
I have quite a few upgrades on my '80, but the HO and dual exhause has been the best by far. Those Vortec heads on the HO really flow well.
Drifting
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 1,986
Likes: 21
From: Columbus MN
Thanks MN80Vette.
Can you tell me whether the Chevy 350 H.O. or ZZ4 is easier to drop in? Or are they basically identical from that perspective?
Would you mind telling more about your set up? What did you have to adjust around the engine to make things work? ...I think I'll probably end up going with one of those two engines. The next step would be figuring out the configuration of the other components.
I found these two dressed engines online. Would their accessory set up work on a '79? What about the fan/headers?
350 HO:
http://www.crateenginedepot.com/stor...P1427C510.aspx
ZZ4:
http://www.crateenginedepot.com/stor...-P945C510.aspx
Thanks again!
Can you tell me whether the Chevy 350 H.O. or ZZ4 is easier to drop in? Or are they basically identical from that perspective?
Would you mind telling more about your set up? What did you have to adjust around the engine to make things work? ...I think I'll probably end up going with one of those two engines. The next step would be figuring out the configuration of the other components.
I found these two dressed engines online. Would their accessory set up work on a '79? What about the fan/headers?
350 HO:
http://www.crateenginedepot.com/stor...P1427C510.aspx
ZZ4:
http://www.crateenginedepot.com/stor...-P945C510.aspx
Thanks again!
Thread Starter
Heel & Toe
Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 21
Likes: 0
From: Columbia MD
Thanks MN80Vette,
I'll take a look at your two threads. Do you have rack and pinion steering? Could I get something like a Steeroids kit with a ZZ4 setup using a serpentine on new accessories and electric fan?
I'll check back again soon. I've got somebody who's going to help me with my engine swap but we need to have a good plan made in the next week or two!
I'll take a look at your two threads. Do you have rack and pinion steering? Could I get something like a Steeroids kit with a ZZ4 setup using a serpentine on new accessories and electric fan?
I'll check back again soon. I've got somebody who's going to help me with my engine swap but we need to have a good plan made in the next week or two!
Drifting
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 1,986
Likes: 21
From: Columbus MN
Thanks MN80Vette,
I'll take a look at your two threads. Do you have rack and pinion steering? Could I get something like a Steeroids kit with a ZZ4 setup using a serpentine on new accessories and electric fan?
I'll check back again soon. I've got somebody who's going to help me with my engine swap but we need to have a good plan made in the next week or two!
I'll take a look at your two threads. Do you have rack and pinion steering? Could I get something like a Steeroids kit with a ZZ4 setup using a serpentine on new accessories and electric fan?
I'll check back again soon. I've got somebody who's going to help me with my engine swap but we need to have a good plan made in the next week or two!
I don't think these mods affect the engine, but I know for a fact that the Flowtech 31106FLT headers (formerly Dynomax) fit quite well with Steeroids and the clutch Z-bar. Spark plug access is good too.
I can't speak for the serpentine accessories, but I know others can.
Last edited by MN80Vette; Jan 8, 2011 at 01:35 AM.
Thread Starter
Heel & Toe
Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 21
Likes: 0
From: Columbia MD
Excellent. So, my plan is starting to take a little shape:
ZZ4 with some sort of serpentine setup, Steeroids, 200M4 trans, electric fan, possibly a new header... other things to follow later based on the budget.
Will getting the hot cam option give me problems idling with a serpentine setup? ..even if I keep my A/C hooked up? I'll poke around the forum some more on that one...
ZZ4 with some sort of serpentine setup, Steeroids, 200M4 trans, electric fan, possibly a new header... other things to follow later based on the budget.
Will getting the hot cam option give me problems idling with a serpentine setup? ..even if I keep my A/C hooked up? I'll poke around the forum some more on that one...
Racer
Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 315
Likes: 0
From: KY
You should be able to pull your engine and either the HO or the zz4 should drop right back in its place.
Pulling the engine and a little clean up and dropping the new engine back in should take about a weekend.
http://www.sallee-chevrolet.com/Disc...tml?1219368532
There is some good info about GM pp crate engines and modding them here.
Pulling the engine and a little clean up and dropping the new engine back in should take about a weekend.
http://www.sallee-chevrolet.com/Disc...tml?1219368532
There is some good info about GM pp crate engines and modding them here.