Get shaft rockers that aren't made in China and they stay set. T&D or Jesel. I have checked mine 5-6 times over the last 3 years and I never made a lash adjustment. It's getting to a point where I feel I am wasting my time but they have to be checked. I adjusted them a few times when it was new but now they keep there lash. Solid billet cam helps too. Sure they are expensive, but they certainly are worth it in IMHO

 

If I was running a small block, I would go HYD roller and shaft rockers for sure. Good light weight valve train parts and good high end Morel HYD roller lifters will go 7200+ all day long... And no worry of crazy spring pressure or insufficient oil splash killing lifters...no adjustments and quiet valve train.

My buddy's 420" sb has this setup with the good Morel HYD roller lifters and Jessel shaft mount rockers.. He shifts it at 7000 and it traps at 7200....he does nothing but change the oil. That pump gas 420" made 641hp on an engine Dyno and runs 136mph at 3100lbs. Can't argue with that.

On a BBC, HYD rollers are a lot more limited due to valve train weight, push rod angles etc etc. You can build a 6500rpm HYD roller BBC but you better have the best of everything in the valve train. If you need to spin it higher then that to make peak power, you better go solid roller.

I would love to have a high revving, big power (800+HP) BBC, but for how I use my car, I don't think I could keep up with the lifter maintenance....(not lash settings but the rebuilds/replacements). Seems like a time bomb for a car that gets ran in the city a lot.(idling in traffic etc).

 

As mentioned, SBC's do much better than BBC's, but idling has absolutely nothing to do with needle type solid roller lifter failures. These lifters fail due to metal fatigue failure, which is determined by the severity of the loading they see and the number of cycles they see. And the loading at idle is nothing compared to the loading at high rpm.

The familiar old Physics equation F=MA comes into play here. F is for force, M is for mass, and A is for acceleration. Force is the loading seen by the lifters. Mass is the mass of the valve train. And acceleration is the acceleration of the valve train. Since the mass does not change, and the acceleration is highest at the highest rpm, it is quite easy to see that the highest acceleration generates the highest loading force on the lifters. As acceleration increases, so does the force. For example, if you double the acceleration, the force must also double in order to achieve that doubled acceleration.

By the way, now that everyone understands that needle type solid roller lifters, primarily in BBC's, are not long term components, where is Chris Straub who always wants everyone to believe that the needle type solid roller lifters never fail?

 

I seem to put about 5000-7000 miles per year on mine...so annual rebuilds have become the norm. I have several sets of lifters and the main ones have been Comps (which cost a LOT less) with pressurized oiling. I just keep some rebuilt and ready to drop in when I need to. You can get them rebuilt for a lot less than new and they last just as long as new ones.

The real limited travel stuff is mainly for class rule racing. Might as well put a solid in it because they aren't going to be any quieter.

Small blocks and LS stuff will go 7000+ easily with good parts and a HR. Again, most HR cams aren't too radical on ramp rates so that helps RPM..plus short pushrods, weight etc.

We did a 555 that was happy to 6500-6800 with a Crane HR cam that had .720" lift with 1.8 rockers. Made 760-770 HP with a 4150 carb and will bump 800 with a Dominator.

I'd love to not mess with them and be able to run years..but I sure like to rev 7500+ RPM too!!

I think they will get HR stuff to keep revving higher as time goes on even in big blocks.

Until then..solid rollers are a maintenance item. How much depends on which parts you use and how hard and how much you run it.


JIM

 

I have been following a forum with a lot of prominent engine builders. This subject was almost beat to death. I researched as much threads as I could find and in my opinion a couple of things stick out in those threads and they are :
- lifter bores not trued
- no revkit
- big port heads with a different valve spacing from stock
- to much lift or to much spring pressure than needed.
- to much clearance in the lifter bores due to wear.
- low quality roller lifters.

When you look upon the factory rollers, it's clear that they went for a very long time.

If you look upon the way a conventional rocker operates, meaning that each time the lifter is on the base circle the rocker goes down on the stud due to the valve lash, when the lifter starts to go up the ramp it slams the rocker into the locking nut sending a shock wave true the valve train. If the lifter is allowed to, even very little c,ome of the cam for a small instant, it sends a shock wave through the valve train as well. These shock loads kill lifters

Due to the wider valve spacing employed on the heads of today, the pushrods mostly sit angled, either to the front or the rear of the engine, causing the lifter to take up whatever clearance there is and causing it to load the lifter needles on one side imo.

Not sure, but on my application I'm going to use a shaft rocker to correct the pushrod geometry.

As for detecting a failing rocker, all the threads point to one thing : regularly checking the valve lash. If the valve lash doesn't stay put, something is going.

My non-expert opinion.

 

I have always run solid rollers in my street engines. The cam I have in my 69 is .651 lift on mildish lobes. Previous owner of the cam got 9,000 and 15,000 miles out of two sets of Comp old school rollers on it. I have a set of the new Isky EZ roles on it now. The engine only has a few hundred miles on it so I can not comment on the Isky's in this application. In my race engine I also have the Isky's with a much more aggresive cam (.850 lift) that has seen just a tic under 8700 rpms. Bout 135 runs on the lifters, no problems yet.

To add to what Jim said, I think another area to keep an eye on is valve spring pressure. If the springs lose their "spring" and you rpm the engine it will beat the heck out of a set of solid rollers.

I am waiting for someone to run a hydraulic roller with some titanium valves. Light valves would make up for a lot of the rpms lost when running a squishy cam. I think that would be a good project for Jim, he could probably talk Del West or someone else out of a set of $1500.00 valves.

 

One more comment; if I see any rocker more than .010 loose the lifter comes out and get inspected. Most of the time when one is that bad there is something wrong. Even as little as .006 loose gets a pretty close look. Excessive lash and unusual noises in a solid roller valve train need immediate attention.

 

I wonder how much of a power loss there is in an engine of 500 cubes or more when its shut down at 6300 and one that makes power to 7500 it has to be a lot. NOS could cheaply be used on either engine.

I know i spend $75.00 a month after taxes for the boob tube or $900.00 a yr. My more addicted relatives spend more then $1200.00 a yr just to watch the boob tube.

I think the argumant i don't want to spend $500/$550 for new lifters or far less for a rebuild is plain silly.

 

i always run a rev kit on all roller cams to keep the roller in contact with the cam lobe so it is always turning and not being hammered by the cam lobe. this is why hyd roller run forever as they never loose contact with the cam lobe

 

This is the proven way to run a roller camshaft....The most I read is how high the lift and no rev kits...could be not too many know what they do...or even exist...but that being said they also increase valve train monkey motion with all that junk inside the intake valley holding those heavy lifters against the cam...a catch 22 if you want racing parts

 

Let's look at this from an other side : my muncie had needle bearings around its secondary shaft as well. We all know what kind of abuse these are put through.

However there are 2 things that set these apart from the roller lifters :
1. they constantly turn in oil
2. they are in constant contact and turning.

The lifters can be held in constant contact with the cam by way of a revkit.
The oil splashing could be a problem especially when idling. It's not uncommon to set idle high when running a roller, say 1000 rpm. Additionally the more expensive rollers have pressurized oil feed. Although I got non-pressurized lifters with my engine. I intend to change them out after a couple of thousand miles on them.