Harry, I haven't had alot of time to spend on it, but the Q-jet is still on the shelf. The Edelbrock intake will take either one. Don't know how much I will be doing to it this season yet, but i will play with the Quick Fuel for a while. Yeh, I'm not sure why we ended up with a double pumper, mech sec carb. It may have been as much my fault as anyone. I never had one so I might have suggested it. This guy and another fellow build alot of circle track engines. and they have been around for along time. there were some things that seemed odd to me but I figured they have more experience that me so I just let them build what they suggested. Another example is the iron heads. I'm the one that insisted on that, but i was also concerned with CR. From what i understand, is that there is a class in circle track racing that mandates iron heads. So I figured if they can get away with it so can I. The builder didn't argue with me, he just said, 'No Problem' , and even after discussions on this forum and then I would go back to him with my concern he still would tell me not to worry about it, the iron heads would work. So I got Iron heads. You see, I'm sorry to all the people that won't agree with me, but I don't like aluminum heads or aluminum radiators. The radiator in this car is my original radiator with the original tanks but with a new, copper, 5 row, core. My **** compulsiveness makes me do things like that. This radiator actually may be cooling the engine too much. I guess we'll see. Thanks again.

 

Crusin, I've been thinking I screwed it up when I changed the jets. Because it has been weaker since I did that. those guys on the dyno may be smarter than I give them credit for. i'm not sure I understand you sentence about jets/pv . and leaning out the idle circuit????
Just out of curiosity, what jet sizes do you think would be appropriate?

 

Angle plug heads were designed to work with domed pistons..wouldn't go through the time or a great ion for flat tops or mini domes.

 

Unless I'm crosseyed, I don't have Angled Plug heads!

 

Someone commented about angle plugs, I was was not implying you had them.
If you have an air gap intake you need to go up on your squirter.

 

My 71 has a 360cu with 400hp and 440tq. Numbers matching block, roller cam.. The heads / valves (larger) were worked by the engine builder, original heads. + other goodies.

To solve the drivability problems I would go with vacuum secondary.

I had the engine set up on the dyno meter. It cost a few bucks but the result is an engine that performed perfectly from the install.
I would suggest a day at the dyno meter shop, and problems solved.

From the sounds of things, the squirters are to rich causing black plugs..

I do know Richie Zul, and Remy H.. Rich is building racing Marine engines. P.S. they don't run on RT109 anymore... National Speedway was fun...

 

How is a squirter going to blacken the plugs? It's only a momentary enrichment of fuel when the accelerator pump is needed.

 

Hi Dave, could you post ALL the engine specs (if possible) pertaining to the final static C.R. YOU MUST KNOW THESE SPECS in order to tune this thing.

This would be the piston CC's (or specific part number), the ACTUAL piston/deck hgt, the ACTUAL head CC's, and the head gasket part number (or CC's also). This is to know the "static" C.R. In the end here on your's the "dyamnic" C.R. will be a major factor. (I'll cover this more below here). Do NOT used the mfr's advertised numbers, they are rarely correct, especially with heads!

From what I have read so far (I believe) you may NOT get this build to ever run on the available fuel in your area, at least to the point you will be comfortable driving around town. It would be less of an issue being a drag-strip ride, in which case the cam would be incorrect anyway!

Part of me does not understand your reasoning behind not wanting the aluminum heads?? Aside from the fact they will work well, they provide a "cushion" so to speak with the "detonation" issue's found with ANY "short-cammed", "iron-headed" unit, above a 10.25 "actual" static C.R. This type build MAY only respond to running some sort of "fuel" straight or mixed, read that as 100 (nominal) octane!

(Add) On a side note, just as a temporary "test", put more timing in at idle, maybe around 15*/20* and see how conditions change. You should be able to close the throttle plates down further helping to get you away from possible "power-valve" leaking/opening. Don't attempt to run/drive it wide open at this point, this is to help see what you need to idle correctly and "clean" the plugs up.

Most 383" drivers we do have 9.75:1 C.R., between 236* and 244* (.050" duration) cams, aluminum 200 runner heads, 750 carb/hi-rise intake, and are full roller. These builds ALL make between 475HP-475T and 500HP/480T. Peak HP around 5800 or so, and will run fine on 91 octane. They will probably run on 89, never tried it though?

Thanks, Gary in N.Y.

P.S. Anyone contemplating this type build with IRON heads should aim for a final 9.0/9.5:1 C.R.. absolutely no higher. What we do for our own people even with aluminum head's is build the C.R. UNDER 10:1, higher than this number on a "driver" is unnecessary for all practical purposes. Tuning this type build is a "walk-in-the-park". You can lock the entire total timing required (e.g., 36*) in at the distributor and not worry about any "advance-curve". This is how we do most BB's also that are "drivers".

Double P.S. When you have a minute take a comp test on 1 cylinder (disconnect the ignition and open the throttle plates) and post the number.

 

[QUOTE=GOSFAST;1590955599]Hi Dave, could you post ALL the engine specs (if possible) pertaining to the final static C.R. YOU MUST KNOW THESE SPECS in order to tune this thing. Please don't take this wrong, your statement here, just for the record, is troublesome to me. If your going to be that emphatic about that kind of statement I'm going to tell you that I have tuned alot of engines in my day and I didn't know anything about what was below the carburator on many of them. Maybe if you are working on alot of engines in a dyno room that stuff is certainly handy but if your back woods, and a back yard wrench, we just drive 'em and make the changes as we drive.

This would be the piston CC's (or specific part number), the ACTUAL piston/deck hgt, the ACTUAL head CC's, and the head gasket part number (or CC's also). This is to know the "static" C.R. In the end here on your's the "dyamnic" C.R. will be a major factor. (I'll cover this more below here). Do NOT used the mfr's advertised numbers, they are rarely correct, especially with heads!
Since I don't have that kind of information. I'll just have to tune it the old fashion way.

From what I have read so far (I believe) you may NOT get this build to ever run on the available fuel in your area, at least to the point you will be comfortable driving around town. It would be less of an issue being a drag-strip ride, in which case the cam would be incorrect anyway!
GoFast, with all due respect to your experience, I think you missed what I was saying, it was running very strong until I started messing with the carburator. I lit the tires up with just a touch of the throttle to the point of putting the car sideways. I'm sure if I go back to the original jets it will do it again. The off idle transition is smooth and it pulls hard thru the whole RPM range. I can idle it down to 500 rpms if I want to. i'm not complaining, just experimenting.

Part of me does not understand your reasoning behind not wanting the aluminum heads?? Aside from the fact they will work well, they provide a "cushion" so to speak with the "detonation" issue's found with ANY "short-cammed", "iron-headed" unit, above a 10.25 "actual" static C.R.

I have 1200 miles on this motor right now from interstate driving to in city and have experienced no detonation yet.

(Add) On a side note, just as a temporary "test", put more timing in at idle, maybe around 15*/20* and see how conditions change. You should be able to close the throttle plates down further helping to get you away from possible "power-valve" leaking/opening. Don't attempt to run/drive it wide open at this point, this is to help see what you need to idle correctly and "clean" the plugs up.
I have not put a timing light on it yet to even know what it is timed at right now. It may be spring before I get a chance to work with this more.
But I understand what you are saying about the timing and throttle opening/ power valve involvement. That will all be part of the tuning process. But I don't agree with you about the need for aluminum heads. Obviously, if i felt that way I would have put them on.

 

Hi Dave, accept my apologies, apparently I misread some of it here!

Thanks, Gary in N.Y.

P.S. Good luck, really!

 

You did the right thing and did not waste your money for a 400 hp goal.